I smashed a lamp over my head. There was blood everywhere. And glass. And I took a picture.

I think my life is getting better because it used to be that I wrote everything. In order to cope. Now I can take pictures. So I have two coping mechanisms.
The best way to judge someone is not by setbacks, but by bounce-backs. I am good at judging people this way. I think this is because I'm good at bouncing back. From stuff people think no one can bounce from. I can still bounce. Here's how:
1. Get perspective about what is big and what is small.
This is not the first time I have put a gash in my head on purpose. I did it when I had postpartum depression. The situation now is remarkably similar.
I told the farmer that he needs to take care of his hands better. That's where the fight started.
"I hate hand cream," he said. "It makes my hands greasy all day."
"It's dysfunctional to walk around with bleeding hands."
"This isn't normal. It's because I was so nervous around you and your mom fighting in New York."
"You have it all the time. All winter. You told me you do. It's your job to fix it. You have to take care of yourself. You have to be a better model for the kids."
He says, "I'm sorry I don't take care of my hands how you want me to."
I say, "Forget it. This is crazy. I don't care about your hands."
Then we talk about money. I spent too much money on our trip to New York. He is sick of me not being able to stick to a budget. And, to tell you the truth, I am sick of it, too. My inability to stick to a budget is like him not putting cream on his hands: Total incompetence.
The thing is that the money problems make me nuts, and they make him nuts. The hands, really, are not as big a deal.
2. Tell yourself a story of how you got to where you are, so it makes sense.
So we skip to the discussion of how I feel like I'm alone with the money problems because we agreed before I moved to the farm that he would not be responsible for the kids or the money.
Don't tell me it was a crazy agreement to make. It's water over the bridge. Or under. I can't remember the saying.
So I tell him I feel alone. I tell him that for maybe five minutes straight, because he is saying nothing.
Then we do our normal routine: I say I am lonely and feel like he's not really with me.
He gets angry because he thinks he's given up everything for me.
My abandonment issues flare even more when he is angry at me for saying I'm lonely.
I cry.
He hates me when I cry.
I hate myself for being with someone who hates me.
You can see the spiral, right? It's just a question of how much I hate myself.
Today it was a lot. I hate myself because I could have used the money I spent on the New York trip as a fund so that I could leave the farm. I don't even know how I'd leave. I mean, I know I'm capable of leaving, but I don't know what I'd leave to. What I'd go toward.
Those of you with empathy understand how it is such a short step to the lamp crashing into my head.
Then the farmer left.
3. Understand opposing points of view to your own.
People always ask how the farmer puts up with me telling our lives on the blog. What he really hates is that I get to tell the story. The story of us. Here are things he thinks you don't know. He thinks I leave this stuff out and it's not fair.
I am crazy. More crazy than you know from the blog.
I am very needy. I have abandonment issues and I never feel loved.
I am bad with money. Crazy bad with money. Great at earning it, terrible at managing it.
But I know you all know those things because I've already posted about them:
Craziness: Here's the post where I go nuts over a tweet some guy directed to me.
Abandonment issues: Here's the post where I describe the genesis of my neediness issues.
Money issues: Here's the post where my electricity gets turned off.
He feels sorry for himself that he got into this mess with me. He thinks he gave up everything for me and I'm totally ungrateful.
So I spent the day trying to avoid my ex, who spends Sundays at our house with the kids. Then, when the coast is clear, I traipse over broken glass and crawl into bed and hope I sleep forever. Not forever in a way that would mean my kids have no mother. But forever in a way where it sort of approximates death in an I-need-a-break way but then I'm still a good mom.
4. Compartmentalize. For sanity's sake.
Can you be a good mom and break a lamp over your head? Maybe that is the crux of this post. Or maybe it is "Can you be a good career advisor and still break a lamp over your head?"
Actually, I think the scary thing is that the answer to both questions is yes. Compartmentalizing in moderation is actually useful life skill. I know because I'm terrible at it.
But look at the CEOs who are never home with their kids. They are terrible parents but great at their career.
And look at the stay-at-home-baking-cookies moms who are addicted to shopping, or valium, or cheating on their husbands. It's entirely possible that these women could be great moms. Maybe you have until 3pm to be dysfunctional: What you do before school gets out can be separate from what you do after school gets out.
Anyway, here's some career advice: Try to keep your career on track and your personal life on track. You'll never have both, but your career is a sort of safety net. If all you have is your personal life then if it's going bad, everything in your life is bad. Your career isn't as important as your personal life, but it's a nice distraction.
See? It's working for me right now: I'd probably be bashing another lamp against my head if I didn't have a blog to maintain.
5. Protect the parts of your life that you can.
When the ex left, the farmer and I started fighting again. We had to fight around the kids. They watched CatDog and we argued.
He asked me if I'm cleaning up the glass. If this were a novel that you were assigned to read for school, there would be this essay question:
Compare and contrast the two knock-down-drag-out fights Penelope had with the farmer after he asked her if she is cleaning up glass.
If you were a good student, you'd remember the chapter where I break a window and end up at the police station.
Back to this time: I tell him I'm not cleaning up the glass.
I meant to tell him that I like the visual metaphor of broken glass surrounding our bed. But I didn't say that. I said, "I don't care. I'm tired of trying to do nice things for you."
It's hard to argue that cleaning up the glass is doing something nice for him. This might be supporting evidence for the farmer's contention that I am crazy. But in fact, I know from the last argument over broken glass that he cares about it way more than I do.
So I tell him that I'm not cleaning up the glass. And then, I don't know what happens. Well, first, the kids ask to watch another episode of CatDog and I say okay.
6. Re-use tools that have worked for you in the past. Abandon those that never work.
In the twenty minutes we gain from more CatDog, the farmer and I are able to establish that he is done with the relationship and he is going to sleep at his parents house.
I decide I have to keep him home. I don't know why. I mean, I guess my instinct is that if he runs to his parents when we have a fight then it's for sure that he is not really with me. I'm sort of like a fair-weather friend that he keeps around to supplement his relationship with his parents—which, I'm sure he'd say is more rewarding than his relationship with me.
Okay. So I panic that him going to his parents will solidify what I already know anyway. And I tell him I will not let him leave.
This immediately makes him want to leave more. The farmer's biggest worry in life is that I will control him.
He tells me I can't stop him.
I want to show him that actually, my specialty is keeping people from abandoning me.
Me: I'll leave the house first and then if you leave, it'll be child abandonment.
Him: I'll take the kids to child services.
Me: What will you tell them? My wife won't sweep up the floor in our bedroom so I can't stay in the house and I have to give the kids away? Really? Do that. I'm dying to see that. Should I pack the kids' clothes for them? Because if you do that, they'll go to foster care.
I know you think I sound crazy, but the farmer's way of dealing with me—his way to get me to shut up—is to threaten me. So I have taken to calling his bluff. I have noticed that almost every time it works. Like, just two days ago he told me he wouldn't talk with me in the middle of a long drive home unless I want to stop and get a hotel room for the night so we have time to talk. And I said fine. Let's get a hotel room. And he didn't want to.
Okay. So the kids do not go to child services, but I worry that he'll go to his parents house.
So I move my car to block in his car so he can't leave.
He could walk though. Or take the fifty other farm vehicles. And it's totally pathetic that I'm trying to force him to stay with me.
So the farmer is sleeping at his parents house. I don't know what I'm doing. I'm here. With the kids. I'm in the middle of nowhere with no support system. I mean, if I wanted to sleep somewhere else I don't even have anywhere.
But I wouldn't want to sleep somewhere else. I traveled every week for a year. And I missed the kids. And I wanted to be attached to home and family more than my booming career. So I moved here.
But I don't know what I'm doing here. Scaling back. Scaling back a career so that all that's left is family time, and family values. It is not working.
I see all these new year's resolutions people are making:
Eat dinner as a family more often.
Go out to eat less frequently.
All these things are easy to do on the farm. I need a new year's resolution to make sure my career does not go to hell while my personal life has. I need a safety net.
The reason I started writing career advice is not because this is my dream job. I mean, who dreams of growing up and writing career advice? I became passionate about the advice, though, when it became apparent to me that each time I had a personal crisis, my career is what helped me rescue myself.




You realize, don't you, that after THIS post he can beat you all he wants and any marks found on your body will be assumed to be self-inflicted?
Lord knows he must be tempted.
Posted by Jens Fiederer on January 3, 2011 at 9:22 am | permalink |
That's a horrible thing to say.
Posted by Andree on January 3, 2011 at 6:30 pm | permalink |
But that's precisely the response PT wants. They're not really married, she's not really a business success, and we're not really very interested.
Posted by Belinda Gomez on January 3, 2011 at 9:06 pm | permalink |
my name is samson sebastine from united kingdom i had a problem with my wife
sometimes ago but never knew what the problem was,i tried to asked her but
she refused to tell,me what it was as time goes on i discovered she was
having an affair with a friend of mine that happens to be my best friend,i
was so sad that i never knew what to do next,during my search for a way out
i met a friend of mine who had similar problem and introduced me to a man
who helped him with his situation,on getting to the man i discovered he was
a spell caster i was shocked because i have not had anything to do with a
spell caster in my entire life so i tried to give this man a chance cos i
never believed in spell casting as i thought it will not work for me but to
my surprise i got positive results and i was able to get my wife back from
him even after the spell caster did all i discovered my wife fell much more
in love with me on like before so i was so happy that i never know what to
do for him so i am using this opportunity to tell anyone on this blog having
similar problem visit greatokija@yahoo.com..i am sure he will help you
Posted by samson sebastine on June 24, 2011 at 10:02 am | permalink |
Absolutely disgusting thing to say — no matter how you feel about this post.
Posted by Chrissy on January 3, 2011 at 7:23 pm | permalink |
@Belinda Gomez: If you "not really very" interested, why are you reading and why are you commenting? And really, who are you to judge the dynamics of Penelope's relationship or her level of her business success? Compared to me, a struggling mother of two that teaches high school (and sadly will continue teaching 22 more years until retirement)she's had a remarkable amount of business success.
Posted by Sabine on January 5, 2011 at 7:11 am | permalink |
Horrible. You should be ashamed.
Posted by Angela on January 4, 2011 at 12:19 am | permalink |
He makes a totally valid real world point. "Hey, your honor, she does this to herself all the time – read the blog." Real life isn't nice all the time.
Posted by MJ on January 4, 2011 at 1:40 pm | permalink |
STFU, Angela.
Posted by Mike on January 8, 2011 at 5:40 pm | permalink |
If there was a way to flag this for removal and the poster for banning I would do that but instead I will comment so that at the least people who read it, including Penelope, know that some people think these kinds of poisonous comments are wrong and not okay and frankly evil – Penelope has dealt with behavior 100x worse than anything she's ever done – as far as I know she's never felt tempted to beat anyone. If you are – got therapy immediately – you're a lot more fucked up than Penelope.
Posted by Arachna on January 5, 2011 at 7:38 pm | permalink |
I think you need to get out of the country setting. It is making you more crazy. Country living is NOT for everyone. Especially not for you. You need people around. You need external stimulation. The farm is not good for you.
I am sorry to say this but it is how your post affected me today.
Posted by Roberta Warshaw on January 3, 2011 at 9:22 am | permalink |
Oh Penelope… do take care x
Posted by Joanna Paterson on January 3, 2011 at 9:28 am | permalink |
I didn't understand that you are crazy until I watched a Brazen Careerist webinar. You probably know which one I'm talking about. The thing is, you articulate crazy even while you're in the midst. So it doesn't feel like crazy to us. You may be what I call "meta-stable," i.e. crazy but within boundaries. What I can't figure out is how you feel to the farmer. Sometimes stable people like to engage with articulate crazy people. For adrenaline. For a sense of the vastness of life. Then the stable people sometimes feel like they've had enough, but can be brought back by whatever appealed to them in the crazy person in the first place. Oh, and by professions of love and apologies.
I only wish I could help. The farmer is not the only one suffering from lack of data in the open. I believe you need someone highly intelligent and dispassionate to help you both out right now. Someone both precise and stable. Does such a person exist in your vicinity?
Posted by Lisa on January 3, 2011 at 9:29 am | permalink |
I love this comment about how stable people and "manageably crazy" people interact and what they get out of the relationship, brilliantly stated.
Penelope, I admire your honesty, your intelligence, and your fearlessness and I always learn a lot when I come here. I wish you everything good.
Posted by JPeep on January 4, 2011 at 2:10 pm | permalink |
I sensed you calming as the post wore on.
Write, Penelope, write.
Write with your whole heart.
Your life depends on it.
Posted by Maureen Sharib on January 3, 2011 at 9:39 am | permalink |
Okay, first: I am really sorry that this is going on. It sucks.
Second: You need to go to Madison right now and get to a doctor. I don't mean that offensively (really); it's just clear that you're someplace where no human could dig out by herself. That happens. But then you need to get some help.
I'm really sorry. I hope it gets better for all of you soon.
Posted by Kerry on January 3, 2011 at 9:39 am | permalink |
This is good advice, Penelope.
There are things only professionals can help us with.
Posted by Maureen Sharib on January 3, 2011 at 9:42 am | permalink |
I agree with this. Why should you do this with out help? Please reach out to a doctor. This is especially important for your children who may look fine but are probably internalizing much of the anxiety they sense from the situation. Getting help doesn't mean you're a bad mom or bad person, it means you need help. Period. We all, every one of us needs help from time to time. Today. Go. Get. Help.
Posted by kristine on January 3, 2011 at 11:09 am | permalink |
You need to get help because we need YOU, Penelope! Take care…
Posted by RommyC on January 3, 2011 at 7:49 pm | permalink |
Sorry to hear you are having such a difficult time. Have you considered outsourcing your financial life? You'd have to find someone very trustworthy, but they could pay the bills and deal with those details for you. I realize this is only a small part of your current problems but it is one thing you could try to control.
I really appreciate your candid posts. Not many people would be brave enough to write about these issues.
Thank you.
Posted by Barbara Wells on January 3, 2011 at 9:42 am | permalink |
I agree. I'm surprised you haven't hired someone to take care of your money situation already.
Posted by Sacha on January 3, 2011 at 10:03 am | permalink |
I've actually hired a few people to help me. And I have learned something from it. Sticking to a budget is like going to the gym. You can hire a trainer, but if you don't go to the gym ready to work out, the trainer doesn't matter.
I think going to the gym is hard for some people (not so much for me) and sticking to a budget is hard for some people. It's easy to tell people how to solve the problem. It's hard to get people to take the action.
I am trying to figure out what makes me able to get myself to the gym and then use that skill to make myself stick to a budget. But I've only recently admitted that I need to do this. So I don't know if it'll lead to success…
Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on January 3, 2011 at 10:38 am | permalink |
PT-
What the gym and budgets have in common:
Practice doesn't make perfect. Anyone who says it does will fail. But perfect practice makes perfect – therein lies the rub.
You go to the gym, sit on the abductor machine (the one where you move your legs outward) and push out 3 sets of 20 reps at 70 pounds and get off thinking your thighs are now more toned.
Not only are they not toned but you just wasted your time and I'm pissed off because I've been waiting and watching as you take up my precious gym time.
What you should be doing is set the weight to 50; get your butt all the way back, sit up straight as you can, then with the arch in your back, lean forward and place your hands on the sides of the machine. Press your legs outward at a 2 second pace and hold it for one second at the widest angle. Take it back down for a 2 count and immediately do another rep. On the 10th rep, hold it for a second then pulse it for 10 reps – don't through the weight and don't let go of the side of the machine.
Different feeling.
It's the same thing with a budget: You need to find the way that speaks to your wallet and bank account. I have no idea what this exact way is for you but one thing I do know is that it probably will involve taking money out of your hands, temper tantrums be damned.
Posted by Steve Levy on January 3, 2011 at 11:03 am | permalink |
PT – Sounds like what you need to do is have someone add up your monthly expenses and automatically have your paychecks divided – part into that account, part into a general spending account. And then don't have access to the bills account. You can divide it further if you'd like, to have a Nest Egg account, again that you can't touch. That way, there is no budgeting. When you run out of money in your spending account, you're out. And you're bills are still covered.
Posted by Melissa Breau on January 3, 2011 at 3:24 pm | permalink |
Isn't budgeting really about saying no to yourself, while going to the gym is about pushing yourself toward something? Both require discipline, of course, but so does every productive thing.
Posted by Jason on January 3, 2011 at 9:16 pm | permalink |
Please see the metaphor of the glass as your own brokenness, clean it up to take care of yourself. Be kind to yourself, and maybe this will help you not argue so frequently with the farmer. Every marriage has arguments and issues, and sometimes men need space, and it makes them crazy if they ask for it and you don't give it to them, sort of like cornering a rabid dog..
Posted by Luci Klebar on January 3, 2011 at 9:55 am | permalink |
yeah. I mean, this is more complicated and also really pretty simple. clean it up.
Posted by Summer on January 4, 2011 at 3:13 pm | permalink |
yeah. I mean, this is more complicated (than it needs to be, what with the metaphors and all that) and also really pretty simple. clean it up. because it's messy and dangerous.
Posted by Summer on January 4, 2011 at 3:14 pm | permalink |
When I read your book, The Brazen Careerist, it was hugely inspiring to me. After reading some of your blog posts though, I find myself very concerned for your mental well being. There's certainly huge value to sharing your personal experiences and being as vulnerable as you're being. My concern stems from that you're leaving your readers with being worried about your physical and emotional well being–which is not the purpose (I'm guessing) that you intended for your blog.
I, for one, could not be a stay at home mom. Career for me is a way of focusing and balancing my busy mind and desire to create/contribute. Then I bring that experience back to being a parent and wife. So believe me, I get it when you say you're searching. At this point though, as a trained counselor I'm just going to ask you to please go and get some professional help. Harming yourself is not the sign of a healthy person.
Posted by Tina Dietz on January 3, 2011 at 10:05 am | permalink |
Okay. Thank you, everyone. I appreciate your concern. I'm going to be okay. I think maybe this is a time to drive home my point:
While I was writing the book, Brazen Careerist — the one that has helped so many people steer their career — I was having major postpartum depression and I was totally lost in my own career.
And here's a book secret: Many people decide to write a book when they are stuck or lost or panicking. It's just they don't write the book about that.
I guess what I want to show here is that the people who give advice — the bazillions of them — have problems too. It's just they don't write about them. And I think it's weird. I think lots of marriages have broken glass on the floor. But people don't write about it. And I think lots of people who give great career advice find themselves totally lost at times.
I wish there would not be so much feeling sorry for me. I feel like lots of people go through times like this. And I feel like since I have a track record of going through these times and coming out better for it, that it's okay to show it while it's happening.
The world is a lonely place if everyone hides this stuff.
Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on January 3, 2011 at 10:14 am | permalink |
> I wish there would not be so much feeling sorry for me.
Actually, on this one I feel much sorrier for the farmer. You are right about marriages having broken glass, though. One evening I came home from work: my wife was on the cordless phone with her mother, and there were two plates of spaghetti on the counter. I took a plate and sprinkled parmesan on it, and my wife threw the phone through the window of the next room, smashing it (I had taken the wrong plate). I told her to get the phone, and fortunately THAT was not broken – she used it to call a window repair shop, cleaned up after herself, got some more spaghetti (what was to be MY spaghetti was buttered, HER spaghetti now had cheese, and she wanted neither, but she hadn't realized there was still plenty of un-buttered, un-cheesed spaghetti in the colander) and had a nice quiet meal together.
Everybody loses it sometimes, you just have to deal with it to minimize the destruction in your wake.
Posted by Jens Fiederer on January 3, 2011 at 10:34 am | permalink |
you are so right, Penelope. I had just been thinking with respect to my own blog, and other bloggers out in the world, that the only thing that drives people to give advice is their desire to overcome their own struggles… after all what would interest someone in self-improvement if they had nothing to improve?
thank you for this post. we all have these moments, and not many of us are confident enough to share them. but you do and that's why you have so many readers.
sharing your story has provided encouragement to me. i appreciate that.
Posted by l on January 3, 2011 at 10:36 am | permalink |
Yes! It would be totally lonely if no one ever told the story of how they smashed a lamp on their head. Personally I preferred other objects.
It was an awful place to be, but I am also stronger now. Thanks for telling it like it is.
Posted by Miss P. on January 3, 2011 at 10:40 am | permalink |
"The world is a lonely place if everyone hides this stuff." You're right! We're all pretty fragile, whether we believe it or not.
Thanks for sharing your humanness, and please consider seeking some professional help with sorting this out.
Posted by Lee Ann Lambert on January 3, 2011 at 11:03 am | permalink |
Somehow your reply reminds me of how you were surprised at your school's reaction to your father's abuse. It was so hard to take any advice from what you wrote in this post – we have come to care for you. The lamp didn't worry me, the farmer driving away didn't worry me, but the part about you leaving the farm if you had enough money, that worried me. Enough that I felt a pang. Maybe it's just my own stuff. But this didn't seem like the usual Penelope stuff. It felt worse. Maybe I was wrong. That's always possible. Maybe the end of marriages doesn't feel so awful to you as it does to me.
Posted by Lisa on January 3, 2011 at 11:11 am | permalink |
Penelope, I totally agree about not hiding stuff, I do. However, I also think there might be (might being the right word, because I could be wrong) a part of you that needs to tell the truth so that we can respond just as honestly and tell you the truth as we individually see it.
Self inflicted injury is not common in marriage. I've been with my husband for 22 years. We've had huge arguments and long periods of difficulty and then long periods of loveliness. We have certainly said hurtful things. But if I hurt myself on purpose he would take my children and leave and honestly if he did the same I would leave him. At least until he agreed to get professional help.
It is not common to hurt yourself. Broken glass, not sure about that either. But hurting yourself, no. You will of course attract other people who hurt themselves and want to feel validated and you may choose to listen to them and ignore the signs that a professional might be of help. But I guess I wonder why you wouldn't call in a professional? Why must you do it all alone? And why do you have to fall so far as injuring yourself before you bounce?
Posted by kristine on January 3, 2011 at 11:20 am | permalink |
I smashed a tea cup over my head when husband was in the middle of an affair and the couples therapy shrink we saw together was totally charmed by the idea of my husband's mistress in Paris and called me skunt, I said is that with a c or a k? And looked it up at Urban/Slang dictionary.com (its a Guyanese term for asshole among less flattering things). When shrink heard about the tea cup he suggested I'd be checked into psycho ward. When husband tried to leave I hid all the keys to all the cars (good idea P !). Anyway, yes I wrote a book about it. As you say, it helped, after two years my anger faded and the affair became a story and no longer an emotion. We stayed together, for better and worse. The book, called The BlackBerry Diet is good fun (really!) but publishing sucks. A Random house editor wanted to buy it but got turned down because marketing department (bet they were all men) could not get behind another adultery story written by a not previously published woman. So then I wanted to smash EVERYTHING over my head. I did not, I just put the BB Diet online for anyone who needs to feel less alone to dip into. Then I started another career with another idea. Maybe the book was just a way to get there. Anyway P. I guess the similarities are always there, and we are not alone, just feel we are.
Unfortunately no one can tell you what to do, only you know, and you are exactly where you are meant to be… (go figure)
Besides isn't everyone just totally crazy in their own way?
Lovingly, B.
PS I would like to know what the "everything" is that farmer gave up? Its not really clear, did he move for you? Leave a wife? Or just feels he misjudged living with you? Because that's not a loss, that's a lesson.
Posted by barbara de vries on January 3, 2011 at 1:27 pm | permalink |
Hey lady – there's another blogger who covers the guts and blood of a bad relationship – go check out her blog. I think it may help: projecthappilyeverafter.com
Posted by Melissa Breau on January 3, 2011 at 3:26 pm | permalink |
As I read your post, I didn't feel sorry for you. Instead I identified with your struggles. The two areas of my life that seem to always be a mess, especially since the 2006 and 2008 births of my children, are relationships and money. I especially identified with the statement on how the farmer hates you when you cry. My boyfriend hates me when I cry. He can't handle being around that kind of emotion. It freaks him out and makes him want to run away from me. But he can't because we have toddlers, and he stays home with them, and I can't afford 250 bucks a week for daycare. Lots of things freak him out. He feels trapped. I feel trapped. We communicate poorly. We are both terrible with money in different ways.
My first husband, who passed away (though we were separated when he died, we were still legally married and so I'm a widow at 33), always quoted his mother's favorite proverb during times of stress : "This too shall pass."
I find that I repeat that to myself quite a bit these days. Perhaps you will come out stronger and better and perhaps I will too.
Posted by Sabine on January 5, 2011 at 7:49 am | permalink |
My God! Nothing makes me more angry than when a talented courageous person shows some glimpse of their real life, instead of the perfect facade, and (some) people get all squeamish and concerned. For F*** sake, people who can write about their problems in a insightful, honest and humorous way are NOT danger to them self nor to people around them, even if they smash a couple of lamps around. It's the squeamish and concerned people who anxiously try distance themselves from the raw reality of life that need a trip to a shrink.
Posted by Liobov on January 18, 2011 at 11:31 am | permalink |
I don't think it's always such a good idea to seek professional help, and it strikes me as panicky and cheap advice when you don't know what else to say (merely assuming that someone who has gone to school does know what to do. Great schools graduate lots of emotional morons). All times I've gone it's been a disappointment, and the first time I did it in my teens it was a major life disaster. Putting that much trust into someone who may or may not be competent is risky business. Penelope is highly intelligent, and although it sometimes requires a lot of intellect to become a therapist, there are high chances she will meet someone less intelligent and wise than herself. What does such a person do in such a situation? The therapist often tries to cling to their therapeutic authority by giving bad advice. Someone here gave the advice to seek the aid of someone stable and precise – that was superior advice.
Posted by Nina M on January 6, 2011 at 9:07 am | permalink |
I certainly agree with Nina M. 100% percent. "Professional" help isn't always conducive to self betterment. I feel like people say this when they just have nothing else to say, along with "Everything will be alright."
Posted by Lady Blue on January 9, 2011 at 12:32 am | permalink |
I agree that it's not easy to find a good therapist and that someone like PT may have trouble finding a good one. There are therapists who treat other therapists — if you can find one of these, s/he may have what it takes.
On the other hand, someone who is less of an intellectual but has the gonads to call you on stuff may be equally effective.
I hardly ever read this blog, but I appreciate the raw tone I find here.
Posted by Rachelle on February 25, 2011 at 5:10 pm | permalink |
Rather than just citing your childhood and past issues all the time as the reason why you're in said situation, do you ever consider trying to rise above the past explanations into something better without holding on to the past?
Your writing certainly helps you cope in the moment until next time. What about trying something more permanent that goes beyond just coping?
Yes, telling yourself a story of how things progressed helps you make sense of things but your plot needs to read more than "I smashed a lamp over my head because I was too overly stressed at the idea of money and my husband's presence being a temporary fixture, did I mention I have had abandonment issues throughout my life?"
I KNOW you can have a redemption turn into something less linear.
Posted by Melissa on January 3, 2011 at 10:05 am | permalink |
I don't really have good advice, except that I agree with you it is unacceptable for the farmer to go to his parent's house over a fight.
Also, the farmer will come back. It's his farm, right? I would not leave yet. But I would clean up the glass, because now you have the picture to remind you of this incident, and the farmer is right, it is unreasonable to not clean up broken glass.
Posted by Monica O'Brien on January 3, 2011 at 10:06 am | permalink |
Go to an Imago couples weekend workshop. Assuming you are not too crazy to help, this could save your relationship. There is one in Iowa coming up soon. http://www.sarahjbeck.com/couple_workshops
Check out http://gettingtheloveyouwant.com, read Harville's book, learn how to get out of these awful fight spirals with The Farmer.
Posted by Sacha on January 3, 2011 at 10:06 am | permalink |
Landmark Forum is really great too, not so much for couples but for self…
Posted by barbara de vries on January 3, 2011 at 1:57 pm | permalink |
Yes, the Landmark Forum will be great for putting you through a simulated hostage taking – sensory deprivation and emotional pressure tactics, until you snap. Not recommended if you don't feel like being under constructive arrest in a hotel ballroom for 16 hours/day for a 3 day "self improvement" weekend.
Posted by MJ on January 4, 2011 at 1:44 pm | permalink |
I can't quit thinking about this line…
"He hates me when I cry."
Does he hate you or does he hate the crying?
I am in NO position to give advice. Maybe the farmer really loves you and you need to believe that?
I'll go read your post on abandonment issues now.
Posted by Jesse on January 3, 2011 at 10:09 am | permalink |
My boyfriend hates me when I cry, or at least he acts like he does. It took me a while to understand that it's because he feels so helpless and blames himself (or believes I blame him)for my pain. He also has burned himself with a cigarette lighter twice when we were having an argument that I didn't even think was that intense. I obviously can't offer much advice, but one thing I've learned is to be careful how you communicate. Instead of saying, "I won't let you leave," say, "I'd really like it if you stayed." One person always has to be the humble one and make the first step toward peace. Relationships are hard.
Posted by Shannon on January 5, 2011 at 7:15 pm | permalink |
I ache for you. You are not alone. I hope it sounds worse here on the blog than it is in reality, but even if it is worse in reality… you are not alone. Lots of people love the crazy you.
Posted by Alisa Bowman on January 3, 2011 at 10:11 am | permalink |
I have been reading your posts only a few months, but you clearly have talent, an unusual perspective and – as difficult as things are right now – you are certainly right on the importance of bouncing back. Adaptation is basic to survival.
Your advice on life matters is funny, poignant and often valuable. But please don't say you give career advice – someone might believe you. Brazen Careerist is a useful platform but science will help people SO MUCH more than lots of amateurs' advice. As it does in life. I thoroughly agree with another comment: go to Madison and get professional help. Professionals make a difference, in life/health as in career.
Posted by Paul Basile on January 3, 2011 at 10:15 am | permalink |
Everyone fights. But arguing about who will abandon the kids first is just plain vicious. Since you are not legally married, he would be within his rights to have you thrown out. This only ends one way – with you leaving. Just a question of when.
Posted by Brad on January 3, 2011 at 10:26 am | permalink |
It really doesn't seem like the end of the world. It's just life, sometimes it's pleasant and sometimes less so. Although it might feel like a big deal, it's really not.
Posted by Avivit on January 3, 2011 at 10:27 am | permalink |
Penelope,
Thank you for being bold enough to share your story and congratulations for having a new outlet. An image can be worth a thousand words…or something like that.
No advice, judgments, suggestions. Just know that this will pass.
Hang in there,
Nora
Posted by Nora Whalen on January 3, 2011 at 10:27 am | permalink |
This is such a nice comment, Nora. Thanks. I would like to be this kind of person. Who can just be nice and understanding and not judge. Well, I think I want to be this kind of person but maybe I don't. But I definitely like this comment. Maybe because I can't give it myself.
Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on January 3, 2011 at 10:30 am | permalink |
Hey Penelope,
Yesterday I burned my arm badly while cooking cabbage for Halupkies–mainly because I was thinking about how holding down the cabbage in the boiling pot reminds me of a story line I was working on, where one of the characters was imagining the cabbage to be someone's head she was mad at. When I was pouring the boiling water out of the pot, it splashed back and burned me pretty badly up and down my arm. It was painful and stupid, but affirmed my idea as worthy of putting in a story. So, if I'd been more level-headed and focused on the cabbage as an actual cabbage, maybe I wouldn't have burned myself. This event reminded me how I am not like the neighbors, nor do I want to be. I was also daydreaming about this completely amazing, incredible budget software I discovered that has changed my life. I too am atrocious at budgeting and it brings me so much stress–I don't have the skills to manage a budget no matter how much I try. But I'm telling you, you need to get the 7-day trial to youneedabudget.com. It will change your life–I got up this morning excited to budget, if you can even fathom that as a concept–this is going to be a great year!
Posted by Page on January 3, 2011 at 10:28 am | permalink |
A few months ago I burned my arm badly because I was using the ends of my sweater-sleeves as pot holders. The pot slipped, the boiling water soaked through my sleeve and burned me. Careful, everyone!
Posted by Erica Peters on January 3, 2011 at 11:38 am | permalink |
I'm sorry you are in the midst of one of those hard times of life. You will find your way. That's all we want right? To find our way. To find those moments where we feel right. Thank you for your writing.
Posted by dirtywinegirl on January 3, 2011 at 10:39 am | permalink |
OMG! He goes running home to mommy!!! Not acceptable. If they were responsible parents they would tell him to go home and deal with his issues. Hasn't he ever heard the command "Leave and cleave…"?
Posted by Carla Longmeyer on January 3, 2011 at 10:40 am | permalink |
You are exactly what you say you are.
"I am crazy. More crazy than you know from the blog.
I am very needy. I have abandonment issues and I never feel loved.
I am bad with money. Crazy bad with money. Great at earning it, terrible at managing it."
I hope that one day you realize that there really are thousands of people that think you're pretty amazing (and I'm one of them.) Start focusing instead on what you desire to become and choose your thoughts. Your post really makes me understand that I am only sane because of personal spiritual beliefs. Otherwise, I would be a HOT MESS.
Posted by Tina Portis on January 3, 2011 at 10:54 am | permalink |
Where's the blood?
Posted by Craig on January 3, 2011 at 10:58 am | permalink |
OMG. That's what I was thinking. And how clean the floor is, other than the glass.
Posted by Patricia on January 4, 2011 at 12:26 am | permalink |
Staged, no doubt, as well as the lack of furniture. Looks like only boxes in a corner.
Posted by Celine on January 4, 2011 at 11:02 am | permalink |
I'm so impressed how you've opened your life and used it on your blog. You've managed to say what we're all thinking, but never say. I love your down to earth way of looking at life and the workplace.
The thing that saved me the first year of my marriage is that I kept choosing my wife, and she kept choosing me. We had to work out the answers together.
I look forward to all your posts.
———————————
The first year you're with someone is always the hardest. I say the first year, after you exchanged your rings. You both are trying to meld your life together, and it takes an incredible amount of effort. I know you know this, having been married before. For me it was an eye opener my first year of marriage, how much I had to learn, and how much we both had to work at starting to knit ourselves together. Give you and your farmer time. There were so many times during my first year that I left for a few hours to clear my head. Only to come back.
Posted by Guy on January 3, 2011 at 10:59 am | permalink |
Penelope,
Reading this I'm reminded of fights I've had with my own spouse. I think that most people share similiarly audacious sounding behavior and writing about it and/or listening in on someone else's fight amplifies the riduculousness of it all. I've never smashed a lamp over my head or blocked a car in but have tried, in the moment, equally counterproductive tactics. Looking back on them I can only shake my head in disbelief. The point, to me, of "How to Bounce Back" was not "help me, I'm crazy," but that we all resort to riduculousness at times and it is not the end of world; That problems exist everywhere, New York, Madison, so deal with them. And, in some cases write and share them, and cringe at them. And learn from them.
Posted by Jason on January 3, 2011 at 10:59 am | permalink |
'Tis the season for family craziness. Any and all festering issues in our immediate relationships will escalate through the intensity of memory and expectation-laden holidays.
I've been there, too, but have made a concerted effort over the past decade to gradually eliminate the 'crazy-making' relationships, or at least get some serious distance from them. (Relocating to different continents for work over the past few years has been helpful, for example, as I find my relationship with my sister improves dramatically when there's at least an ocean between us.)
My previous marriage was unhealthy and intoxicatingly intense, and it was excruciating to break up, particularly with a child. However, once I truly got over it (using my "bounce-back" strategies as you refer to them, including a good therapist and dear, devoted friends ) I was able to move into a relationship with a man who somehow manages to blend trustworthiness and sharp intelligence in a way that leaves me feeling both safe and intrigued. We have a lot in common, in fundamental, how-do-we-want-to-live ways…but also enough differences to keep things interesting. It's been a revelation to discover that a marriage does not have to be such hard work.
You're resilient, smart and talented. And right now, support in the form of an excellent therapist and trusted friends will make the world of difference. Take good care.
Posted by Cara on January 3, 2011 at 11:02 am | permalink |
Hi Miss P,
I am so sorry this is all going on for you right now. In speaking to the money matters, I see every day how money affects relationships for better or for worse.
For better when both people in the relationship are working together as a team which includes same goals with money, and for worse when they have different goals and are working independently including with the money.
If you ever want to bounce anything off of me regarding how to empower yourself regarding your relationship with money please email me.
Please take care of yourself, your kids, and your marriage.
Posted by finance girl on January 3, 2011 at 11:02 am | permalink |
Hi Penelope,
First, thanks for your honesty and your ability to share what many people never would.
I too went through a very difficult time several years ago in my marriage. Started out with postpartum depression and god knows what else! Only way I climbed out was by huge amounts of reading, mostly spiritual stuff, a very kind physician that listened to my version of reality, me realizing that I was asking my husband to "help me heal and to respond" to me in ways that he never could,and this mega vitamin stuff called truehope. Yeah, corny name, but as far as I can tell, it worked.
I look back on that time that was so dark and realize it was only through going through it was I able to summon up the strength to do the healing that I needed to do.
Just wanted to thank you for sharing your story, and tell you are in my thoughts and prayers.
Best Wishes, Kris
Posted by Kris Costello on January 3, 2011 at 11:07 am | permalink |
Dear Penelope's editor: Please stop allowing her to post on the blog. This is not helpful to her or anyone else. Mandatory leave of absence is a thing that exists.
Posted by Erin on January 3, 2011 at 11:11 am | permalink |
Let her post! Let her use writing as therapy! Let her inspire all of us to honestly look at our own lives, admit our failures and successes, and hope that we find peace, stability, interesting-ness, passion, love, and above all a way to balance everything in our not so balanced world. This quest is relevent and urgent and inspiring.
Erin, it may not be so helpful to you (perhaps your life is perfect), but her posts are tremendously helpful to many of us not so perfect people.
So Erin, instead of telling Penelope's editor not to let her post on a blog that belongs to Penelope, you, dear, should stop reading, stop commenting, and stop spreading your isolated, judgemental, negative opinion. You do not speak for all of her 60,000 subscribers.
Posted by Sabine on January 5, 2011 at 8:07 am | permalink |
@Penelope: I used to have rather severe Borderline Personality Disorder. What helped me was Emotion Freedom Technique http://www.eftuniverse.com/
It's currently being used to help military vets who suffer from resistant PTSD, and it's helped me far more (and more quickly) than traditional talk therapy or Dialectical behavior therapy. Everyone's mileage may vary, but it helped keep me alive and functioning after the violent demise of a romantic relationship.
Good luck.
Posted by Avatar Koo on January 3, 2011 at 11:14 am | permalink |
Have you considered that some (or a lot) of this may have to do with the fact that it's winter? In Wisconsin. Winters in the upper Midwest are pretty depressing and it shows up as lots of different problems for lots of different people. Not trying to dismiss anything. Call it a contributing factor?
Posted by Jim on January 3, 2011 at 11:17 am | permalink |
Not a bad idea – I'm in the Midwest too, in dreary winter, and started to feel back in November like my brain had permanently shut off. My doc suggested Vitamin D supplements (since I wear SPF 70 on my face for various reasons and cold weather coverage outfits) and I do feel less like I'm stuck in 2nd gear. Try the calcium, D and K chews at the drugstore – can't hurt (unless you eat the whole box – do not OD).
Posted by MJ on January 3, 2011 at 12:01 pm | permalink |
Being from the Northeast, I put a lot of weight in what you are saying. Add to that the fact that Penelope is much more of a city girl and I think she may just be very unhappy on the farm in the middle of the winter. That used to be enough for me to slump into a deep depression and start hating other areas of my life that were really not a problem at all.
Posted by hlcs on January 5, 2011 at 9:25 am | permalink |
I've had enough. I'm out. I've been a loyal reader for several years, but I came looking for career advice, and that's nowhere to be found here any longer. It's just the chronicle of your descent into madness. Frankly, I just don't trust your advice any longer.
Best of luck. I hope you find some peace.
Posted by Paul on January 3, 2011 at 11:20 am | permalink |
Does it make me a horrible person if, upon reading, Paul's diatribe on leaving loudly, that I immediately thought he's probably one of those 20-somethings who will leave a new job on day 3 because they have decided that the employer doesn't meld enough to their wishes?
Posted by christy on January 3, 2011 at 12:11 pm | permalink |
No, but it means you are confusing a legitimate complaint and observation with a sterotyped "bad bad 20 something" behavior. This was a career blog once, right?
Posted by MJ on January 3, 2011 at 1:47 pm | permalink |
Paul,
If you've been a longtime reader, you should be accustomed to how Penelope gets her thoughts across. What is she saying that you need to hear? Go back and read it again.
Posted by Allen on January 3, 2011 at 2:47 pm | permalink |
I think Paul is right. It's not about advice, it's about not enabling an unstable person write about this and think it's OK. It is not. P. needs a hospital, not a bunch of well wishers and agreeable followers.
Posted by Celine on January 3, 2011 at 10:18 pm | permalink |
Check out the Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman – I think you and the farmer have a good chance at great love once you figure out how to love each other….
Posted by X on January 3, 2011 at 11:22 am | permalink |
I am less lonely and scared today because I stopped and read your post. Thank you for your courage in sharing exactly where you are.
Posted by Jennifer on January 3, 2011 at 11:25 am | permalink |
Oh Penelope! You are right that everyone has tough times in their marriage and lift. And so many people put up a front, even around their friends about their personal or professional lives. You are right it is lonely when you think you are the only one having problems or difficulties. I want you to know that I am a LONG time fan and your advice and wisdom has helped me and inspired me many times.
Best of luck during this difficult time. Just remember that he does love you and being in a relationship is difficult. Sometimes giving in is the hardest thing to do even when you know its for the best.
Posted by Erin A. on January 3, 2011 at 11:27 am | permalink |
Oh my!
Posted by Lee on January 3, 2011 at 11:30 am | permalink |
Hi Penelope,
There's not too many people who would post what you just did. That shows me that you have no qualms about reaching out. If you want to get off this carousel then I agree with many of the earlier posts: find help. Reach out.
I have spent the last 18 months coming to terms with my last abusive relationship, with myself as well as with the significant other.
I learned that I was co-dependent (didn't even know such a term existed). It was a revelation. And now I am setting my life's course armed with knowledge. I'm working on the abandonment fear myself.
I have no children and am not looking for a relationship. So, your situation is more complex.
Being in a rural area I guess the resources are limited.
Where there's a will, there's a way.
You've got a lot of people routing for you. Just persist in finding your way.
Posted by Viviann on January 3, 2011 at 11:30 am | permalink |
The thing about the car and leaving really stuck out to me- reminded me of my history and tendencies. My experience of learning to function in the social world with aspergers is that, in situations of conflict, when you can't figure out how to make things right with someone, it is easy to make it about either tuning out or winning/crushing the opposition. Which I would imagine is a useful skill in the business field but does not maintain personal relationships. It is easy to go to that place of being willing to up the ante past the point anyone else is willing to go to, but it breaks social bonds and is alienating. You win the battle but not the war. My marriage fell apart to the point where we hated each other for years, it only better when I got really invested in the idea that being right is a booby prize- that what you have to be focused on is finding a solution that both of you can live with, that either person being unhappy with the solution is unacceptable. It is difficult but possible to get to a place of being able to do that in the middle of a conflict, and when you shift the way you talk in an argument, you often feel like you are in some sort of revolting elaborate kabuki dance, and it is easy to resent that your social interactions would have to feel so artificial. But it is worth trying, it helped me- first to have a human home environment, and then to have a loving home environment (sorry I couldn't come up with a way to say that without being saccharine).
I think it is worth thinking about why it feels important to smash your head with a lamp(you) or smoking a cigarette(me), or going running until you vomit(me), or diving headfirst off of a table onto a concrete floor(me), or something else that interrupts the mental anguish loop of "this is horrible and I'm stuck." If the problem that causes the impulse (loop despair) is the same as mine, you may be able to substitute something that doesn't harm you.
It also helped me to get hypersensitive about personal sovereignty. I know the correct way for my husband to store his computer and maintain his car and pop his zits, but I try to let him handle the things that aren't mine, because it is stressful for other people to not have a sense of personal freedom, to be incorrect in too many ways. So yes, it is not good for your children to see the farmer not maintaining his hand health or you injuring yourself with a lamp, but only one of those is yours. And I'm not sure that you, or most people for that matter, could give them a childhood where they only see people modeling correct self care. I'm not even sure if that's preferable.
I got a lot of this from a few books a few years ago. If you're interested I can go look up some titles.
Posted by Mady on January 3, 2011 at 11:34 am | permalink |
I love this comment from Mady. Sounds like someone who has "been there" before offering advice from a closer perspective than most others chiming in here.
Posted by Fred on January 8, 2011 at 4:36 pm | permalink |
Thanks for the bloody post today. I feel less dumb and stupid about how I used to fight with the 'one I loved', then clean myself up and go to work like nothing had happened. When I eventually told my boss about my split from my husband she was so surprised because I hadn't brought any of my devastation about the bad end of days of my marriage into the workplace. Truthfully, I was so just so glad to have work, doing a good job and the great people there to go to. Compartmentalizing can be postive; it is just another way of saying balance to me. When your personal life sucks, it is nice to have a job that you know you can do well. An awesome post. Now go clean up that glass! The boys might step in it! You do it for them, xx
Posted by Deborah Robertson on January 3, 2011 at 11:41 am | permalink |
You woke up and you wrote about your life. This is a good thing – this is you figuring it out, bouncing back, and you know you'll get there. You have to. It's not a comfortable exercise, but the budget & your career – these are the projects for your first quarter. Own them, and let your personal life follow.
Our dog died suddenly yesterday, and we're wrecked. I knew I had to get up this morning and write about it, and I do feel better, now that I've put a few words out there. I hope you do, too. Reading your post about struggling – it helps. So let's go into the first quarter of 2011 with some focus on what we know we're good at – owning our careers. May our personal lives be buoyed in the wake of our coming successes.
Posted by Jenn Sutherland on January 3, 2011 at 11:42 am | permalink |
Just a couple of weeks ago you posted about starting dialectical behavioral therapy (DBT), and changing your diet. Remember that change is hard, and relapses are common. I hope that even as things seem impossible and unstable, you try to stick with the DBT and diet changes, even when it seems like they're not helping.
You're in your life for the long haul — and so are your children and your ex and probably the farmer too. You can do this — you are doing it.
Wishing you all the best.
Posted by Erica Peters on January 3, 2011 at 11:45 am | permalink |
Wow, I stand in awe. Thank you for writing about this, though I'm going to re-read this again a few times. I was laid off in November 2010, and was glad that I still had my home life stable to go to.
Thanks for being gut-wrenching and real. I'll stay tuned.
Posted by Junior on January 3, 2011 at 11:46 am | permalink |
Penelope. As a man who has struggled with relationships and provides relationship advice to others, I am constantly in awe of your willingness to put it all out there. As a husband who had fantasies of running out the door and never coming back in the early stage of my marriage, I can totally understand the torment and drama of finding the balance between two people's neuroses and shtick. I am so grateful that I stayed in my marriage to work things out because it is now the best thing I have in my life. I believe that this blog is not just a way for you to feel transparent as someone to whom the world looks for advice and support regarding their careers, it is a place for you to work out the struggle of being in your own body, and that is ok.
The funny thing to me is that people get upset sometimes about what you write because they believe you should be writing something else which is exactly what you say you want to avoid. I don't doubt that the many people who read your blog care about you, but I also wonder how many of us unconsciously project our own needs and expectations onto you, hoping you'll be someone stronger or more together than all of us.
Happy New Year to you. If you're ever down in Chicago and want a free consultation, look me up.
Jeffrey
Posted by Jeffrey Sumber on January 3, 2011 at 11:46 am | permalink |
Do you imagine this blog as a reality tv show? This episode with the smashin-in-the-head-lamp would be awesome!
Posted by Melinda on January 3, 2011 at 11:49 am | permalink |
Sorry you are in a bad place. Not that the farm is a bad place, just that mentally you are in a bad place. I think it is the perfect storm for you…getting used to winter on a farm, a new relationship, the company moving….and all the other things that come along with life.
It was a very emotional weekend for my household too. We are trying to plan the future but owning your own business makes it difficult to plan very far out. The uncertainty drives my husband crazy. Somedays I want to give it all up and go back to the stability that a regular job brings. I can't stand to think I am leading my family down a wrong path.
I want to have the life I think I should. I have reached the age when things should be, well, better. ANd in a lot of ways they are but I always think they should be more fulfilling, more engaged, just more!
Here is hoping we both find peace with where we are this year!
Posted by Bianca on January 3, 2011 at 11:53 am | permalink |
I usually focus on solving problems, for better or worse, so this is a cold hearted analysis on the state of things.
Given that you already know about your difficulties in sticking to a budget, why are you in charge of the money? Transfer the bulk to an account you can not easily access. You have a previous post where you describe how to survive on a zero budget when giving seminar talks, so you can obviously cope on ridiculously small amounts of money in the right circumstances. There has to be something in between.
You both seem to be doing emotional extortion, which is not very productive in short term and there's a huge risk that it will end up in resentment in the long run. Once you get to that stage it's a difficult thing to turn back from, and the kneejerk responses you typically work up are really hard to unlearn.
I can not speak for the farmer, but leaving for the moment might be his way of coping with things. He might be angry and afraid that he will say things he later regret in the heat of the moment — taking a walk might give some perspective and cool down his feelings.
You two love each other. You can not change the way he acts, but you can change the way you act. It might be possible to start a positive spiral by doing small things, for example cleaning up the glass, and hopefully he will do something nice for you. I usually apologize once things have settled down, regardless if it was my fault or not — I certainly had a part of fighting one way or another. It sucks to apologize when it feels like none of it is your fault; I view it as a long term investment, some discomfort in the present for spending the rest of my life with the woman I love.
With all that said I am lucky enough to have a wife who loves me and understands me and my quirks, and is also interested in solving conflicts and problems. There are plenty of ways we could make both ourselves and each other miserable, so none of this would work if either one of us had malicious intent.
Posted by Tom on January 3, 2011 at 11:53 am | permalink |
Thanks for writing this, I get the message, and your willingness to be vulnerable is inspiring.
Posted by Pete Michaud on January 3, 2011 at 12:02 pm | permalink |
I'm sorry to hear that things are going so badly for you right now. You said you wished there would not be so much feeling sorry for you, but I think a lot of the commenters are just expressing compassion for you, and I don't see anything wrong with that.
So I am feeling badly for you, but I also feel badly myself after reading your post. It was honest, yes, and brave, and it broke a lot of the bullshit unwritten rules about polite discourse, and all of those are good things; but it was also harrowing to read, and "harrowing" is not what I come to your blog for. I'm not saying you shouldn't write harrowing posts, but I am saying I don't want to read your harrowing posts. So I feel sad to write this, because I've gotten a lot out of your blog over the past year, and I'm going to miss it and you (or as much of you as I get from your blog), but I'm unsubscribing today. The main thing I came here for was professional advice; but a harrowing post about your personal turmoil does not become professional advice just because you insert some boldfaced, numbered sentences into it that read like career advice.
I think the most difficult part for me about this post was the role of the kids. They have a mother who abuses herself and makes herself bleed, who breaks glass on the floor and refuses to clean it up, who uses them as bargaining chips in an argument. Those things are just not okay. You defend your parenting by citing the example of the CEOs who are shitty parents because they're so wholly dedicated to their jobs, but that's fallacious logic. Comparing yourself to shitty parents does not make you a good parent. Your parenting is good or bad on its own terms.
Please think more about what your kids must be going through. Please show them more compassion than your parents showed you.
Posted by Brent Winter on January 3, 2011 at 12:05 pm | permalink |
Penelope, I truly feel your pain. You sound so much like me, like I used to be. Asperger's. Borderline. Depressed. Suicidal. Self-destructive. A wreck. I tried everything. EVERYTHING… counseling, antidepressants, career, sex, etc., etc. I had a successful career, but nothing worked and nothing helped me. I finally came to the end of myself one day when I was between jobs and was desperately lonely and needy and all the people I loved were out of town and beyond cell phone range. I had none of my usual distractions. I was left with nothing to do but reflect on what a miserable failure I had been in all of the areas of life that mattered to me most … home, family, children, marriage, friendship. I nearly imploded.
That's when I finally broke down and asked God to help me and to take over the reins of my life. I wasn't even completely sure if there was a God when I made my entreaty, but what followed was quite tangible and indescribably amazing. No one would probably believe it all if I could even describe what happened inside of me, but the people around me have seen me and my life utterly transformed in the two years since it happened. Depression is gone. Borderline is gone. I am continually growing and healing. I have a joyful life now.
I never believed before. I was wretched and miserable. Now I believe with all my heart, and it's because of all the proof I've seen in my own life. Everything has changed. This lonely, quiet, empty time you're dealing with right now is the perfect time to turn to God. He can mend you from the inside out.
I know that practically no one believes this anymore and that dozens of people, and possibly even you, will probably blast my socks off just for posting this, but I have to tell you because I can see you are hurting like I used to be, and this is the only thing that has ever worked for me. Salvation is real. Please just try it … just ask Him. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain.
Posted by Margaret on January 3, 2011 at 12:13 pm | permalink |
What could it hurt?
Posted by Maureen Sharib on January 3, 2011 at 12:39 pm | permalink |
Margaret, yours is a beautiful comment and so very true. Except the part about not many believing anymore. I think there's lots of us that do. And we can all vouch for what you just said. Penelope, give God a go.
Posted by sophie on January 3, 2011 at 2:10 pm | permalink |
That's good, but that emotional high doesn't last for ever either. Still need to develop LOTS of internal and external resources, that is, lots of different tools in the box to draw. Personal faith can be a great tool, but it's ALSO not the be-all, end-to-all questions many people think it is. Trust me. Because nothing shields us from everything for ever. Only by continually, continuously living our lives and learning from our mistakes and others', and hanging in, do we grow.
Hang in, Penelope. I already appreciate your courage and honesty, and, yes, it DOES translate to career advice. Thank you. Will it make you smile a little to tell that I've previously bypassed your blog because I (mis)read the title of your blog as "Penelope's Trunk", and,reading no further, thought it was a blog about antique collecting? Hah! Glad I stopped this time.
Posted by Angela DuBois on January 3, 2011 at 2:29 pm | permalink |
The temptation to turn over my life to some higher power is so tempting and calming during times of extreme stress. Though I consider myself spiritual and Christian, I've never been able to fully believe that surrendering my life over to this elusive God will solve all of my problems. I'm glad it worked for you, but not everyone is capable of such strong blind faith. And isn't Penelope Jewish?
Posted by Sabine on January 5, 2011 at 8:16 am | permalink |
Now that you have calmed down, you should address the root cause of the matter. Not being crazy, probably the best expert in the world couldn't guarantee to fix that.
Hand cream.
You are his wife, not his mom, so it is really not your place to train him in personal grooming. But, if it is REALLY that important to you:
1) Purchase some protecting, moisturizing cream. Nothing labeled "hand cream", that makes it too obvious.
2) "Honey, I'd really like to have my breasts rubbed with this cream….."
3) Since a guy cannot in good faith turn this one down, the result are two manly hands with their working surfaces thoroughly coated with the product.
Don't expect this to result in no blood on the hands, though – guys who work with their hands are often getting scraped, nicked, and abraded, and no cream in the world is going to stop that.
Posted by Jens Fiederer on January 3, 2011 at 12:21 pm | permalink |
Jeez…seriously…get help. You're not doing your personal life (or your career) any favors by showing everyone how batshit crazy you are on this blog.
Posted by anon on January 3, 2011 at 12:29 pm | permalink |
The first step is to admit that you struggle with certain things.
The next step is to overcome and deal with those troubles.
You have problems with feeling loved and being abandoned. You cannot always deal with that on your own.
If you want to save your marriage, you need to see someone who can help you.
Posted by Liza on January 3, 2011 at 12:30 pm | permalink |
Amazing that you're able to capture your craziness in such a sane and articulate way. Have you been offered a reality TV show yet? This is far better drama and more gripping than any other "reality" series. The camera crew would move in and keep you company, kind of like a second family…
Seriously, I do hope you figure out what you need. It's clear that the farmer and the farm are not the end all be all for you – they wouldn't be for most people anyway. You need something more challenging and you need the connection and energy of other people. Even if it's a small group of people. Good luck P.!! You'll get through this.
Posted by Stephani on January 3, 2011 at 12:34 pm | permalink |
Out of that whole post, you know what caught my eye enough to write a comment? The part where you know exactly how to combat the farmer's fight tactics. Pretty insightful. But…while I'm as compulsively competitive as the next type A careerist…I got a lot of mileage out of realizing that while I was smart enough, tactically, to "win" every fight in my marriage, winning arguments wasn't good for me (or what I ultimately wanted, despite every instinct screaming for victory in the moment.) Just a thought.
Posted by Shana on January 3, 2011 at 12:36 pm | permalink |
As a very recent subscriber I don't have much context into your background or psyche. Your comment caught my attention: "those of you with empathy understand how it is such a short step to the lamp crashing onto my head." unless this is a sarcastic comment, no this reader doesn't understand the cause and effect the way you do. That's not healthy behavior and I worry about your kids.
Posted by Keemia on January 3, 2011 at 12:38 pm | permalink |
I disagree. Having battled self-injury for my whole life, as soon as I read the title of the post, I knew where Penelope was emotionally. Sometimes, self-injury is the least crazy option. Not the best but considering what going on in your head at that moment, the least crazy.
Penelope – keep writing and doing the things that keep the crazy at bay, including seeing your therapist.
Posted by morningcain on January 3, 2011 at 12:55 pm | permalink |
Sorry I don't understand what you're disagreeing with. What I do know is that self inflicted injury is very unhealthy behavior and kids should be protected from it.
Posted by Keemia on January 3, 2011 at 2:04 pm | permalink |
Saw this coming last summer. The farmer is right, he should be afraid of you controlling him, because you do. Also, at some point, after calling his bluff continually, he'll get tired of being controlled that way, and actually follow through on his threats.
My sympathy right now is for the farmer. He sounds like a decent enough guy, but living with Penelope has pushed him to the brink. Penelope seems like she wants everything her own way, and will run over anyone who she sees as preventing her to get it at all costs.
I predict another divorce in less than two, or maybe even one year. It was never destined to last anyway, given her issues.
Posted by awiz8 on January 3, 2011 at 12:39 pm | permalink |
As someone that grew up in a family not too far off from yours, except that I wasn't lucky enough to get to go live away from that batshit craziness. No, instead I got myself pregnant so that I would get kicked out that mess. It really is nuts the things we do in order to survive whatever it is we find ourselves living in.
Since I am a newer reader I did go read the posts you make reference to here…the one about why you write about the truth in order to not keep the secrets…living the secrets is way harder then the truth…so many don't get this…it is almost rare to find people that really get it…you get it…that shouldn't make me happy but it does…anyways when I read that when you went to school you didn't know there was anything wrong with what your dad was doing and how did they know? Holy crap…that was me…all through school they kept after me, asking me questions and I kept thinking, "How the hell do they know?" Now that I am so far from that life, it's easy for me to say, "Of course they knew you were getting the shit beat out of you."
I lived for so long in this box of not ever speaking of the experiences of my life…keeping the secrets…not knowing that a lot of that shit was not normal…it's freeing to speak of some of these things now…still there are things that have me gagged into silence…so reading your posts filled with your honesty and speaking the truth and not keeping secrets, really are touching to my heart. And they give me hope. So thank you.
There have been so many times I would have loved to have broken a lamp period, let alone over my own head…but the fear of being my father, my brother or exhusbands keeps me from breaking anything. Never in my life have I broken anything…even though I've wanted to. When I seen the photo and read about your breaking the lamp I gasped and smiled…because right now I would love to break a lamp…and a part of me is jealous that I don't have the courage to break a lamp let alone tell me whole story on my own blog…or to all the people in my life…they may know bits and pieces but there is not a single person on this earth that knows my whole story.
Since I have known what it means to live without a single support system my heart goes out to you. I am not sure how I ever found my way here but I sure am thankful that I did. Since you have so many readers and commenters you may never read my comment here but still I felt the need to thank you for speaking the truth…for giving me hope..for letting me know I am not the only one. XX
Posted by Lori on January 3, 2011 at 12:42 pm | permalink |
My husband and I had glass on the floor for the first 2 years we were married…my (farming) parents were interfering and meddling in our lives without us even realizing it. This would never have stopped, and we could never have moved on as a UNIT, if I had not 1) acknowledged what was happening, 2) had Hubs insist I pick HIM, and 3) chosen to cut the cord and re-prioritize WHO in my life got top billing.
Good luck.
Posted by Jessica on January 3, 2011 at 12:44 pm | permalink |
Penelope, I'm sure in the midst of your little "hells" you are not thinking that you are helping your readers. I gain so much from reading your posts, however, I do not like to hear that you are suffering inside. Your posts speak to my heart and from my heart – thank you!
I don't know if this is fair to say, what a loss for the rest of us if you weren't able to articulate your journey. You're leaving a mark. Now, that should just empower you; ok, I will shutup now.
Hugs….
Posted by Rita Palanjian on January 3, 2011 at 12:44 pm | permalink |
Started with hand cream then money, hmm. I had hard time picturing reason for the anger although I guess arguments sometimes excalate to anger without reason. Remember anger is a choice the avoidance of which requires early recognition and substitution. When it begins find a method to replace the anger with laughter. As far as hating yourself, remember it is easier to love and be loved when self hate is replaced with acceptance. You have so much to offer the farmer, the kids and your readers you should stop the self hate and agree to be puzzled by yourself and spend your time understanding yourself. Consider laughing at yourself and your quirks. Find a mechanism to stop the tirade, breathe and calm down. Learn from each explosion ways to find serenity. If you understand yourself better you may be able to help the farmer learn ways to calm the argument and the anger. I never feel good after being angry. Always wish I had not allowed myself to become angry. When angry I say or do things I wish I did not say or do.
Find a way to lessen the anger and increase the love. A way I tried in the past was to play Twister. Next time stop the argument and say: alright buster, I've had it, get out the Twister sheet and start spinning. We are taking this fight to the mat. Combine Twister with Strip Poker and replace the anger with…, later mention your head hurts and would he be a jewel and sweep up the glass. If he does it, you have a keeper.
Posted by Don on January 3, 2011 at 12:44 pm | permalink |
Thank you,
Was meant to be doing the usual domestic stuff for my family, but instead have spent past 30 minutes tucked away in a quiet spot reading your post and the comments that followed.
Can only agree with your earlier commentator Nora – I have no advice, suggestions etc. This will pass.
Writing from London in the UK, I have no idea what it must be like to be on a farm in Wisconsin, but it's possible to feel desperate, angry, and sad, wherever you are, and that is what resonates with me.
Take care
Posted by Maryon1 on January 3, 2011 at 12:45 pm | permalink |
Time for Penelope to grow up and stop making life miserable for your kids, your poor husband, yourself. Get some professional help and realize that your marriage was just another attempt to find someone to put up with your mood swings, whether they be hormonal or emotional. I can imagine that the farmer has come to the realization that he was duped and manipulated, and that he has married an emotionally unstable individual who is also narcissistic. Get some help, admit you made a mistake marrying the poor man, and move back to the city where you can seek professional help. Your blog is not about career information, it's about a mentally unstable person… it's watching a train wreck in action…
Posted by Adrienne on January 3, 2011 at 12:55 pm | permalink |
This post really bothered me and I even called my wife to tell her not to read it until she got home. But then I read your follow-up, and the line "I guess what I want to show here is that the people who give advice … have problems too" helped put it in perspective. I have students and employees that see only the teacher or manager side of me and and would be — sometimes are — shocked to find out I'm just as flawed and struggling with the same kinds of problems outside those roles that they deal with. You are more courageous than me; I fear I would not have a class to teach or a job to manage if I told my them all about having been institutionalized.
Or maybe it would help if they knew I had been to the edge and made it back. I know how much more I admire our son knowing that he, too, stood at the edge, we nearly lost him … and he made it back. Most people don't know what he went through and just see a nice guy and a good father. But I know more, and I see much more in him because of knowing. And maybe that's the same reason I keep reading your blog. Unlike others who pontificate, you are human — just like me.
I am concerned, though, that the sharing you do as "your job" may be amplifying some of the problems you are having — like an actor play a part on stage who starts to take on the characteristics of the role they are playing. Are you really crazy? Are you crazy for the sake of the post? Do the crazy-sounding posts nudge you a little further towards crazy?
I hope the bleeding has stopped, both from your head and from your heart.
Posted by Thomas on January 3, 2011 at 12:57 pm | permalink |
It seems to me that you have a great deal of insight, but little ability to channel that insight into action. Perhaps a few short rules to help you cope? A good doctor could help you develop these. Also, not to be rude/mean, but having read your blog, it seems to me that the farmer is just a phase for you. You seem to flit from one enthusiasm to another, with plenty of drama. Perhaps his time is just over? If you really want to keep the relationship and build a life, you need to work on this together.
Posted by Karen Burgess on January 3, 2011 at 12:57 pm | permalink |
No condemnations or predictions just a plain and simple thank you. You are a strong human being–not just because you can break a lamp on your own head, but because you are courageous enough to tell about it. As a reader for sometime I appreciate what you write and your frankness. I enjoy how freely you share your thoughts. As a single mother of 4 children I have had days like yours (though I am farmerless)and though my lamps are in tack that might be because I don't have any glass ones. People who throw stones shouldn't live with glass lamps might be my motto (but please do not ask about my dishes). The pain you feel is so real as sharp as those glass shards. I think I understand why you did not want to clean up the glass–believe me I have so been there. I lives through my crazy pain alone –sometimes locked in the the bathroom laying on the floor.
I am glad to be here to hear you.
I hear you.
Going forward…
Posted by IMA2FOUR7 on January 3, 2011 at 12:57 pm | permalink |
Ordinarily I do not proffer advice as I have no solutions to any of the recurring and widely shared problems in life, but your 'support network' is already crowdsourced via your blog and twitter. This support could even be scripted–a particular person for a specific answer that will snap you out of whatever incrementally self-destructive course of action you have wittingly/unwittingly undertaken. These supporters need not be clinical psychologists but given that they are at least human beings, the answer, however scripted, might be compelling and genuine to your mind.
If all else fails, Seth Roberts reports some cognitive benefits with the addition of animals fats to the diet. Though it is counterintuitive, they might extend your periods of controlled emotional flexibility.
Posted by Nandalal Rasiah on January 3, 2011 at 1:01 pm | permalink |
Penelope: sweetheart, you need to pick up the glass. And apologize. You're allowed to make messes but then you have to clean them up.
I know you like the metaphor. You're an artist. But a shared bedroom is not an appropriate place for found ordealism.
Posted by Nowgirl on January 3, 2011 at 1:03 pm | permalink |
"Self inflicted injury is not common in marriage."
She's right on the money here. Remember that your view of what is "normal" is based on a childhood as an outlier.
Yes, you can survive this. But wouldn't it be nicer if you get through all this stuff to a place where you and the farmer both dealt with your own issues enough that every little thing didn't set you both off? And you could have a new normal?
Even crazy people are lovable. Even co-dependent momma's boys can grow up and have healthy boundaries. Really!
Posted by Tzipporah on January 3, 2011 at 1:07 pm | permalink |
I have a wife who's a bit like you. Forgetting the money problem (she has her own, but it's more the opposite) she's pretty much the story in your blog: Studies, career, sports, kids, success in everything she wants/does. ENTJ and probably Asperger's. Feeling abandoned, needing _one_ person to love and trust (while really needing lots of them around). People think she's weird and that she has the funniest stories anyone ever heard when she talks about her life and reality.
We have crazy big fights. But we do stay together and I trust that to be true (mostly). I leave for an hour – a day every second year.
My wife is at her best when she has too much to do/organize/handle and a lot of people to organize into doing it. I believe she is at her happiest alone with me, having sex on a mountaintop we conquered together.
You are helpful for me in your writing because I get many different verbalizations from you about her/us, I wish I found a way of being helpful for you. I hope I am helpful for herâ¦
Tom
Ok, my suggestions (more about us than you): 1) stay with the farmer (help him trust you will though you are "crazy"), 2) make sure you get out from the farm a lot (he can't take all of your energy), 3) have people he does not know/care about around (for criticizing – this is actually the same as #2) 4) let him love you by showing him some other kind of love than the hurting vulnerable kind 5) create something or somebody together
Other ways could work too
Posted by Tom on January 3, 2011 at 1:07 pm | permalink |
I'm new to your blog. Would love to read about the things you used to love about the farmer, what made him special, unique and the things he loved about you. I'm sure there must be an old blog somewhere.
Survivors project themselves into a happier future, dreams shouldn't be undervalued.
Posted by Mal on January 3, 2011 at 1:12 pm | permalink |
Here's the history of me falling in love with the farmer.
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/the-farmer/
And, I confess that I love going back to the first few posts just after I met him….
Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on January 3, 2011 at 1:27 pm | permalink |
Fundamentally you are you, if you look for help from an outsider (eg dr as suggested) it would need to be someone who can have some understanding of you. Your actions and reactions are not that of the majority but that does not mean that you are nuts and need medicating to become someone else to better fit a so called ideal either.
Breaking the lamp is fine, I would rather you cleaned up the gash to your head than the mess on the floor, sometimes the mess needs to be physically there until you don't need it any more, here the pics can help but maybe not as satisfying to the senses as the reality. Injuring part of yourself (head) and bleeding can be like letting lots of steam out of the pressure cooker that your head and mind can become, especially when the farmer refuses to talk to you as much as you would like.
You need to write and verbalise, you can't keep it all in, it's not who you are. You can't change the farmer and you should only make changes to yourself that you want to make and that you feel comfortable with and can cope with, personal changes should be small, baby steps, not huge as huge ones just leave you in a position of not being able to cope at all.
You are not the farmer and he is not you, he is the product of his life, you of yours and all the shit that has happened has made you who you are, someone who can bounce back, it's ok to be down for the count for a bit, to feel sorry for yourself but then your strength comes out and you come out fighting and remake yourself stronger than before.
The farmer cannot give you everything that you need, you are the only one that can do that, he can love and support you though. Maybe he doesn't fully or even partly understand living with someone who has aspergers, that your actions and reactions are not anything that he has ever dealt with before and so he isn't coping which can send you both into a further downward spiral in your relationship. Any chance he would read something like Aspergers in Love? He needs to realize that you can't be anyone else but you, that you are indeed special and different and that is in the main to be celebrated and cherished, not destroyed, he fell for you, he just probably didnt realise the whole package as in the first couple of years of a relationship you only see what you want to see of your partner and reality can be quite a shock. Doesn't mean that it can't be worked through though.
As for his bleeding hands during winter, use Elizabeth Arden 8 hour cream of a night, won't make his hands girly but will help enormously with skin cracks, if not available wool fat (from sheep) would also help.
Posted by Ann on January 3, 2011 at 1:30 pm | permalink |
Oh, gee…more drama from Our Lady of Drama. Let's review this week's episode, shall we?
You still haven't figured out why the farmer hates to see you cry? (Quick hint: it starts with "m" and rhymes with stipulation.)
You were worried when he decided to leave and go to his parents house? You ought to be. If that family is smart, they'll be plotting their legal strategy for getting you the hell out of that farmhouse and the farmer's life. The good news is, you're giving them lots of information that can be used against you by writing these trainwreck blog posts. The bad news is, you painted that beautiful trim.
You really don't want people's pity? Oh come now. Seems to me that's exactly what you want. I note that the only comments you respond to are the ones that are warmly sympathetic and cloyingly pitying.
My guess is, you've milked the farmer's goodwill and gullibility for all its worth, and he's finally caught on that you're not crazy or even on the autism spectrum. You're a first-class con artist who will use any means necessary to gain a goal.
Posted by H on January 3, 2011 at 1:33 pm | permalink |
Well that's a little harsh even by my snarky standards. Lest we forget, the farmer and P broke up umpteen times before she finally moved in. Presumably he had read her blog and was aware of her relationship issues and utter incompetence with money. And he was abundantly warned by his family. So if he's surprised now, he just wasn't paying attention.
Posted by JR on January 3, 2011 at 1:57 pm | permalink |
I kinda agree with this comment. Penelope you had to know the farmer didn't take care of his hands when you were dating and he knew about your money issues. Yet you all chose to marry anyway. And it's not like everyone is 20 years old thinking things will magically change. What's the use in fighting about it now?
What I'd like to know is what you all are going to do to lessen these types of disagreements in the future. I can understand how this sort of thing can happen early in a relationship– everything is new, you get carried away with emotion etc–but one time is enough! I'd like more posts about how you're taking steps to resolve problems and end these arguments once and for all.
BTW I love your blog. Keep writing Penelope!!!
Posted by lym on January 15, 2011 at 7:06 am | permalink |
If you want to put a lamp to your head so be it your over 18 years of age. However the kids do need to be with their father or in child protective services as this is a train wreck happening in slow motion and more then just the "Engineer" will feel the impact…
Posted by Joe Campbell on January 3, 2011 at 1:39 pm | permalink |
This is the first thing I thought of. Even if you don't want to clean up the glass for yourself or the farmer, you need to be a responsible parent and clean it up because of your young children.
Posted by Rachel on January 3, 2011 at 7:20 pm | permalink |
I don't think the farmer hates you when you cry. He may hate "it" (the situation, he may dislike your crying, he may dislike how he's feeling in response to it, but I don't think it makes him hate you. Saying that because you don't need the pressure of feeling hated on top of whatever is making you feel awful enough to cry, when you're crying.
Posted by Ann H on January 3, 2011 at 1:49 pm | permalink |
{hug}
I don't know an emoticon for sofa cushions.
Posted by melanie gao on January 3, 2011 at 1:52 pm | permalink |
Penelope, I think you often feel like you have to come up with new answers for everything. But you don't, because you're not the first person to have these experiences.
You're not the first person to come from an abusive household.
You're not the first person to divorce.
You're not the first person to have a rocky second marriage.
You're not the first person to relocate.
You're not the first person to wonder if you're a good enough parent to children you love dearly.
You didn't invent any of this. So what does that mean? It means you don't have to invent ways to fix these things, either.
You have lots of company. That's unfortunate in a lot of ways, because it means that too many people are dealing with heavy problems. But it also means that you can benefit from those who have dealt with them before you.
There are tools that already exist. Counseling is one of them, and there are counselors who work with adults with Asperger's–I found some in Wisconsin by Googling. I hope you find your solution.
Posted by KateNonymous on January 3, 2011 at 1:52 pm | permalink |
I feel so sorry for your kids Penelope. Why don't you let them live with your ex?
Mature, stable parents do not knock themselves with a lamp. Nor do they run to mama's when they argue with their spouse. Both you and the farmer sound crazy. You shouldn't be raising kids.
Posted by sophie on January 3, 2011 at 1:53 pm | permalink |
Meditation is helpful to discover the way forward.
Posted by Leslie on January 3, 2011 at 1:57 pm | permalink |
Penelope, hope today is a better day. Take care.
HAPPY NEW YEAR!
Posted by Michelle on January 3, 2011 at 2:01 pm | permalink |
So you talked to your ex-husband about moving to a farm on pink carpets and now, 2 years later, you're married to a farmer?
You broke a lamp over your head to make a point, either to the farmer or to yourself. And you can't see that you're endangering your kids by not getting professional help for this problem.
Please consider this statement: if you harm yourself, you harm your kids. Plain and simple. The more you harm yourself, the more you harm your kids.
Get professional help. And look at all the posts that mention getting professional help. And consider it, if not for yourself, then for your kids.
Posted by louden on January 3, 2011 at 2:10 pm | permalink |
Yes, I see all the recommendations to get professional help. The farmer and I both have therapists. In fact, I just wrote, two weeks ago, about my therapy. Here's the link:
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2010/12/21/my-new-path-to-self-discipline-dbt/
I have actually been in therapy since I was five years old. I love therapy — both on my own and couples therapy (although I have to say the latter is more frustrating than the former).
Anyway, the therapy I'm doing now is called DBT. It's a great type of therapy for people who have been in analysis for a long time (which is me). DBT is a fresh approach to seemingly unbeatable problems.
–Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on January 3, 2011 at 7:48 pm | permalink |
To quote Dan Savage (slightly out of context but it still works in this situation): "Just because you've been victimized doesn't mean you operate in an alternate moral universe where you're not obligated to take other people's feelings into considerationâparticularly the feelings of people you profess to love and happen to be married to…It looks to me like you want out of this marriage. But instead of taking responsibility for wanting out, you're playing the victim card while slamming both hands down on your marriage's self-destruct button."
Posted by H on January 4, 2011 at 1:59 pm | permalink |
Maybe having an affordable place to escape to would help you feel less caged in. A friend or relative to stay with or an affordable hotel in a nearby city? Do it on a schedule. Once every 6 months like clockwork. We all need to get away now & then before we can fully unwind. With that said, taking time (and sometimes money) for yourself is NOT a bad thing. It's good for you, which is good for your family because they need to you be wound less tightly as well.
As for the farmer's hands, I recommend Corn Husker's Lotion. It's non-greasy, non-scented & totally manly. It comes in an ugly clear bottle with a yellow label. We keep some by the bed so I can suggest it to my boyfriend before we go to sleep & he can't complain about greasy residue because he'll sleep through it anyway.
Posted by Chaely on January 3, 2011 at 2:20 pm | permalink |
Also, these comments about giving up your children are discouraging & terrible. You do need to find better ways to cope, but you are fully capable of raising your children until a professional tells you otherwise.
I think a good therapist & a good nanny would do wonders for you & your family. Like I said in my previous comment you DO need to find ways to take time out for yourself. A nanny would give you more flexibility so you can sneak away once in a while without abandoning anyone or leaving the Farmer with more responsibility. A therapist could help you see that you don't have to punish yourself for every mistake you make (or think you made) & be a more positive outlet than this blog with it's comment section of negativity.
Please take care of yourself. You don't need an ER bill on top of everything else.
Posted by Chaely on January 3, 2011 at 2:26 pm | permalink |
Sophie, who endowed you with the ability to judge who should and should not raise kids? Do you know Penelope's kids? Her ex?
I questioned Penelope's use of the kids in her argument with the farmer, and I question you and others here who presume to tell someone else how to take care of her children. We should all hope that Penelope bounces back from her post-holiday funk. But please lay off the parenting guilt.
Posted by Hazel on January 3, 2011 at 2:29 pm | permalink |
Alright, I'm going to approach this in a way that I hope you'll appreciate.
1. The first year of marriage is the hardest. If you can survive that, you can survive anything. Remind yourself and your partner of this, and treat the bit where you survive it as a goal to achieve. In my first year of marriage, which just ended, my husband and I uprooted our whole lives and moved to another country – completely removed from our routine and our friends and the various other safety nets we have in our lives – to wait for his immigration process to wrap up. It was the year of broken glass, and it wasn't pretty. But when I spoke to other women about this first year of marriage, they told me that's how all first years go. I don't know if it's true, but the women I spoke to hadn't spoken to each other, and all seemed to say the same thing. Moreover, we introduced a huge change to our lives and our routine in the first year, which is bound to break some glass. I'm not saying you'll make it past this first year, but you should try, because everyone struggles.
2. Apologies always matter more to one person than the other. There's always that imbalance. Figure out who it matters more to, and if it's you, tell your partner that in that instant, an apology would matter more to you than it does to them. Hearing "I'm sorry" is tantamount to hearing "I'm responsible." You're not exactly saying "I'm wrong," you're saying, "I shouldn't have done that specific thing that I'm apologizing for." If the apology will come in the form of an action – like cleaning up the broken glass on the floor – just do it without saying a word. The minute someone apologizes, it's surprising how quickly the discussion returns a relatable, rational level. That's when you can reconcile and negotiate a resolution.
3. When you're at the point where you're blackmailing each other or threatening to leave, have the wherewithal to ask your partner, "do you want this marriage to be over?" You talked about calling the farmer's bluff; this is just another way to do the same thing, but on a more profound and direct level. You're asking the biggie and cutting to the chase. I had to do that myself, and when it became obvious that it was just a bluff, I'd say, "alright, so let's discuss this fight for what it is – a fight – and try never to have it again."
4. Think of every issue you fight about as something you never want to fight about again. That way, you'll be serious about finding a solution. You can even say something like, "okay, I hear you. How do we never fight about this again?" If you find you're having the fight more than once, tell your partner, "we've had this fight more than once; we both need to resolve this so that we never have it again. How do we do this?" Don't ever try to find the solution yourself; you're not alone in this, and your partner won't appreciate being excluded.
5. It's great to have goals, but work on one at a time, and involve him in the discussion of establishing both the goals and how you expect to achieve them. The first, which seems to be a biggie, looks like the budgeting thing. Give him an active role in helping you with this. And if it's like going to the gym, don't think of him as your trainer but your gym buddy: you won't always feel like going, but you're egging each other on.
Good luck!
Posted by Olivia on January 3, 2011 at 2:34 pm | permalink |
Penelope,
You're not crazy. You just might need a new distraction to keep yourself from thinking about your life on the farm and your blog. Perhaps there was a reason why you received a camera. Take it and use it. Who knows what will come of it.
I have found another blog that has great advice on improving your photography skills. Here is the link:
http://www.mocking-bird.org/blog/2010/12/09/20-easy-ways-to-improve-your-photography/
Next time go to Montreal, it's probably cheaper and even the lettuce tastes better there.
As far as your personal life, all I can say is do what's best for you.
Posted by Ella on January 3, 2011 at 2:44 pm | permalink |
Penelope, how might you have used the skills of distraction and self-soothing to either get through these arguments more successfully, or restore your inner equilibrium after them?
Posted by jim on January 3, 2011 at 2:51 pm | permalink |
P- Its not looking good. I worry about the kids because they are learning from your actions on how to have a loving (not so)relationship.. Do you want to see your children repeat the same miserable behavior 10,15,20 years down the line? Please stop and think about all the damage you are inflicting on your kids, the farmer and you. You can't unring the bell but you can stop it from ringing forever.
Posted by MH Williams on January 3, 2011 at 2:58 pm | permalink |
Oh and all of you who are prattling on about "saving the marriage," you do recall that they aren't legally married, right?
Posted by H on January 3, 2011 at 3:08 pm | permalink |
Why does this matter so much to some people? Are you the relationship police?
Posted by Kelly on January 5, 2011 at 3:03 pm | permalink |
It matters because PT operates on the belief if she says it enough times it becomes true. Business sucess, Aspbergers, marriage….all fictions.
Posted by Bennie on January 6, 2011 at 10:50 am | permalink |
I have to say in the days leading up the New Year, I secretly seethed at every post where the writer chronicled all the shiny, happy, positive stuff that happened each month. Because if I were to sit down and write something to follow that model it would look like this:
January: Got punched in the face. February: Got beat up my brother in drugged out stupor April: Sister pawned laptop for drug money May: My tech offices were broken into, $15K in equipment was ignored for my bank statements, credit bills and blank company checks…. etc, etc
Your blog is on the intersection of life and work and sometimes that intersection has a big, awful accident in the middle of it. So thank you for writing about the not-shiny part of this process, I for one learn the most about resilience from others who have the courage to live out loud.
Posted by Sabrina on January 3, 2011 at 3:27 pm | permalink |
Well, up here in the woods we would consider someone who hits themselves with a lamp as crazy/sick/looney and a whole lot of other inappropriate words, but then I used to live near Stephen King down in Maine. I just feel badly for you, but I'm now more worried for your children. These manifestations of self-loathing are at a clinical level and you need treatment.
If I was there I'd wrap you up in a blanket and hold and rock you. You reach out to love and come up with more tension and heartache, how much can the farmer stand to see someone he loves destroy herself.
Please seek professional help before you damage the relationship between yourself and your children. Think mental health sabatical and blog about it.
Posted by Woody on January 3, 2011 at 3:39 pm | permalink |
Penelope, you're in your head too much. Set something up in town (madison) so you can give yourself an outlet for the farm. Kind of how stay-at-home moms go crazy when they're home all day and need adult interaction.
Sign up for yoga in Madison or something. Anything to make you not go stir crazy. You love the farmer. The problem isn't with him and you; it's between you and you.
Posted by kara on January 3, 2011 at 4:07 pm | permalink |
Penelope,
I don't have any sage advice to offer, but I'm far more empathetic because my life had hit rock bottom. When you go through really bad experiences it humbles you. You have to ride it through and time does heal all wounds.
One of the things I did, and am still doing is a self-guided meditation by Christie Marie Sheldon called Love Or Above. It helps you to let go, which has always been one of my biggest issues. Perhaps there is a meditation out there that will work for you and help you to deal with your money, abandonment issues and so on.
We all have issues, and that's what makes us normal. We are perfectly wounded people.
Avil
Posted by Avil Beckford on January 3, 2011 at 4:13 pm | permalink |
Some wounds don't heal. Some people keep going in circles. It's hard to break patterns of behavior with, or without, help.
Posted by Barbara C on January 3, 2011 at 8:34 pm | permalink |
The thing that concerns me most in this post is that you and the farmer are having these fights with your children in the room.
Really?
You're worried about him being a good model for the kids about his hands. Meantime, you're smashing furnishings and having fights with your husband in a completely non-constructive way while they look on. (Believe me, the TV is NOT a meaningful distraction.)
Learning how to have a meaningful, helpful, adult disagreement that doesn't involve threats, recriminations, shouting, throwing things, and generally both being emotionally 11 years old and throwing a tantrum… well, that's what grown ups do.
Find a good marriage counselor and learn how to disagree healthily. Find a good family counselor and help your children to learn how to cope better than you can teach them.
Posted by Grown Up on January 3, 2011 at 4:21 pm | permalink |
The kids are not in the room. I don't even know where you got that notion — except from your imagination. Which tells me more about you than me. No wonder you didn't leave your real name in the comment.
-Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on January 3, 2011 at 7:55 pm | permalink |
Penelope! I feel less worried if you are fighting back for yourself. Do you know how many people are engaged in trying, even poorly, to help you?
Posted by Lisa on January 3, 2011 at 8:07 pm | permalink |
Dear Penelope,
I had left an earlier comment and I wanted to leave another one
I do greatly appreciate your raw style, and how you can sit in front of your computer and expose yourself without shame. This will undoubtedly make many uncomfortable (it sure as hell makes me uncomfortable at times) and judgmental enough to leave their two cents about how wrong it all is.
But I just want to say thank you– thank you for writing your hard truths especially when you take a beating for it, thank you for being a great female writer and entrepreneur.
You inspire me.
Happy2011.
Posted by Melissa on January 3, 2011 at 8:21 pm | permalink |
While I sympathize with your agonies, Penelope, I must first be concerned for your children. It doesn't matter whether they were in the room or not. Children are not deaf. They are not without perception. They know full well what's going on. Please find a better way to deal with your frustrations. For their sake.
Posted by dl on January 3, 2011 at 9:47 pm | permalink |
"When the ex left, the farmer and I started fighting again. We had to fight around the kids. They watched CatDog and we argued."
That's how I got the idea.
Even if they weren't in the room, they know. Wouldn't you?
Posted by Grown Up on January 5, 2011 at 1:27 pm | permalink |
You wrote: "When the ex left, the farmer and I started fighting again. We had to fight around the kids. They watched CatDog and we argued."
That's how I got the idea they were in the room. Even if they weren't, they know. Wouldn't you, if you were they?
Posted by Grown Up on January 5, 2011 at 1:29 pm | permalink |
Everyone has a mad minute and usually its because we've done too much or given too much of ourselves away for other people's benefit.
Take chunk of time (a day?) and do something for yourself, something which you love and enjoy and for no-one elses benefit but yours. It'll cheer you up I promise.
Posted by Anna on January 3, 2011 at 4:30 pm | permalink |
You smash a lamp over your head and you won't clean up the glass and you want to call him dysfunctional for not wanting to use hand cream?
My parents, who have been married for 30 years and have never fought, say there are two key things that are important in a marriage.
The first is that it should be more important for your partner to be happy than for you to be right.
The second is that you have dozens of chances every day to maximise your partner's happiness over your own- little things that you know would make them happy like making the bed or making them a cup of tea. If you take those chances most of the time, you will be happy.
It doesn't sound like you are doing either of those things.
Posted by Jessica on January 3, 2011 at 4:48 pm | permalink |
2 questions for you…are you married or even in a relationship? Do your parents live in separate houses? I've been married for 39 years & we fight just like everybody else. 30 years together & have never had a fight…I don't think so.
Posted by Kathy on January 5, 2011 at 1:38 pm | permalink |
@kathy, believe it or not, there are some relationships out there that are 99.9% peaceful. My husband and I, while not perfect in the least have not had one long drwn out argument in the 20 years that we've been together. He says it's because neither of us has to have the last word. I think it's because I relocated to be in a city that makes him very happy.
We've been together since 1991, married since 1994. I said it's 99.9% peaceful because once back in like 1995 I told him that I didn't want to speak to so and so and just then so and so called and he handed me the phone. I leaned over and hit his head. Then another time circa 2000, my husband raised his voice at me.
What happened is that our son walked home from school by himself. I went to pick him up and when I got there he was gone. Of course it ended up that my son was okay, but I was a complete wreck AFTER I found out he was okay. My husband told me to calm down–but he said it in a raised voice, not in a comforting, loving kind of way. It's like you know how when someone is hysterical on TV someone slaps them. Of course my husband would never slap me so he yelled at me. That was one time in 20 years!!! And I hit his head once. LOL. Other than that it's been alllllll peace. 99.9% peaceful.
Posted by lym on January 15, 2011 at 7:36 am | permalink |
So… I would like to know more about this agreement you made wherein he would not be responsible for the money or the kids. And I say, "bah" to this over/under the bridge business; you're trying to be cute and you brush it off too quickly. Can we go back to this agreement one day (or point me to previous posts)? It doesn't sound like a fair or healthy or loving agreement to me. I know I sound judgmental, but actually this very much interests me as I am a single mom living with a man who does not want kids. There, now you can judge me too.
Hugs.
Posted by bzzzzz on January 3, 2011 at 5:04 pm | permalink |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-harm
When you start a) hitting yourself with a lamp to cope (get attention, feel alive, punish yourself, punish others) and then b) putting it up on your blog, this is what we call a 'cry for help.'
While blog advice is useful, it's no substitute for professional help.
Posted by louden on January 3, 2011 at 5:08 pm | permalink |
I'm so happy we can talk about self-harm here. Now that you've linked to the wikipedia entry. First of all, read the entry. Self-harm is not a cry for help. Münchausen's is a cry for attention and care. As is half-hearted suicide attempts. Self-harm is much different. Self-harm is a quest to distract oneself from what's going on in one's head.
Self-harm is commonly found in people who have more going on in their head than a normal person — for example borderline personality disorder, Aspergers, or obsessive compulsive disorder. The self-harm is a way to shift the mental pain, which cannot be controlled, to physical pain, which one can control.
My favorite writer on this topic is Bob Flannagan. When I was in my twenties, he was doing public exhibits where he used self-harm as a way to gain control of other types of pain he was not in control of.
I love this topic.
-Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on January 3, 2011 at 8:11 pm | permalink |
Penelope:
Does the farmer know this about self-harm? Because without knowing this, he may be thinking it was a stunt to manipulate him. I'm wondering how much more he still needs to understand about what goes on in your head?
Wishing you the best in getting through this for yourself and your boys,
Jennifer
Posted by Jennifer on January 3, 2011 at 9:50 pm | permalink |
I've heard this topic discussed on Sirius Radio (Channel 114 from the NYU Langone Medical Center) more than a few times.
Also there was a segment on Radio Health Journal in mid-November last year titled '"Cutting" and self-injury' at http://www.radiohealthjournal.net/ . The podcast can be accessed from the Podcast Archives link on the top menu. The people on the show are listed on the Guest Archives page which is also accessed from the top menu.
While looking at Susan Bowman's book on Amazon, I came across another book written by Marilee Strong titled 'A Bright Red Scream: Self-Mutilation and the Language of Pain'. It was on the Amazon page for Marilee Strong's book that I learned that self-harm "affects 2 million or more Americans and countless others around the globe". I think it's more prevalent than is being reported or that we're willing to admit exists.
Posted by Mark W. on January 4, 2011 at 11:48 am | permalink |
I want to repeat what others have said, which is that I'm glad you are being so open about this. It is beyond brave. You risk pushing people away because in my experience, people have a threshold of what they're willing to hear about and are not willing to accompany you all the way through a dark period. But maybe that's just how it feels to me when I'm in a dark period. Anyway, I admire you for being as honest as you are and for standing your ground AND for ending with this…
"The reason I started writing career advice is not because this is my dream job. I mean, who dreams of growing up and writing career advice? I became passionate about the advice, though, when it became apparent to me that each time I had a personal crisis, my career is what helped me rescue myself."
…which not only brings this whole post back around to your central thesis but also lets me know that in the midst of this craziness, you are ok.
So, best of luck to you.
And also, I think I've seen a documentary about Bob Flannagan! Years ago at a film festival, I walked in thinking I was going to hate it and it turned out to be very moving.
Posted by faith on January 5, 2011 at 4:23 pm | permalink |
P, I'm sorry to hear that you are in a bad place now, mentally. I hope it gets better soon, and that you gain from this experience.
Two very minor pieces of advice:
1. My husband also gets cracked skin on his hands during the winter, and also hates lotions. After much carping he finally relented to let me put the lotion on the back of his hands. It turns out he hates the lotion on the palms of his hands (sensory issue? I dunno). This has changed from a point of contention to a tender and loving moment of tenderness our marriage, and perhaps that would work for you.
2. Don't underestimate the effects of cabin fever. It sounds like you have it (crankiness, wanting to sleep a lot). Some info: http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=50887 and I like the mythbusters show best of all: http://mythbustersresults.com/alaska-special these guys who are pros at executing complex and dangerous stunts can't remember how to take a spit-test after the effects of cabin fever start.
3 Get some pro help.
Posted by ejly on January 3, 2011 at 5:11 pm | permalink |
Seconding those belowâplease do take care and consider getting some kind of help.
Posted by Pbing on January 3, 2011 at 5:18 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope
I love your thought of the bounce backs.
People can be like oranges, when they are squeezed or under pressure whatever is on the inside comes out, now sometimes what comes out is a bit icky and sticky, also what comes out is their amazing inner strengths. There is an inner strength in a person who can bounce back from some of those dark night of the soul experiences. The trick is to let go of the patterns, that puts these things on repeat.
Often, because of life or circumstances or nothing we can figure out, we end up running on empty, feeling stretched. This maxes to the limit our life skills,coping skills, hormones and nervous system and beyond.
Maybe – grant yourself something each and every day, possibly some time doing something that fills you up.
Good Luck
Posted by Ensha Reiya on January 3, 2011 at 5:21 pm | permalink |
I don't believe you broke the lamp on your head.
The farmer seems a poor, tortured soul (and a sucker for punishment) but he could do better than to run back to his parents. For the benefit and wellbeing of your children…send them off to boarding school. Handcream for all!
Posted by Jeffrey on January 3, 2011 at 5:42 pm | permalink |
Penelope,
Please hang in there.
Posted by t on January 3, 2011 at 5:50 pm | permalink |
Penelope – I don't really know how to give you any advice that will help because, as someone who has struggled with an anxiety disorder, I know that most of the time people trying to "fix" me and offer help just make it worse. Perhaps I can just share my own story.
My anxiety disorder tends to make it so that I worry about everything constantly, no matter what it is. It's severe enough at times that I can't function. I end up in bed all day completely focused on nothing but the anxiety. There are physical symptons as well, including panic attacks, weird tingly extremeties, and headaches. As a coping mechanism, I used to cry to my husband all the time, and he hated it and would try to find ways to get me to stop. I knew he just wanted me to feel better, but it felt like he hated -me- for the crying. He was always giving me advice, help, tips, etc. Always trying to fix it, but for some reason it just made it worse and worse. I so desperately wanted to fix my anxiety and make him happy, but I could never live up to the advice I was given and always thought that I was a failure and a bad person because of it. The whole thing eventually led to a large blow up between myself and him that very nearly led to divorce.
However, we talked about it for several hours one night, and he decided to stop trying to fix me and let me be myself – no one had ever done that for me before; I'd always been led to believe that I was broken and "wrong" and needed fixing, and I hated myself for it. With him professing that he would no longer try to change me, I got this sort of…..I don't know what it was exactly, but it was a kind of boost in self-confidence I guess. I still had the anxiety problem, but I wasn't holding back the rest of my personality anymore in fear of the anxiety coming out – because that's what I was trying to do when I was trying to "fix" it, was hating my whole self and not being myself in the process. I was a dead shell of my former self out of fear and effort.
It was the weirdest thing – and the best thing he's ever done for me, because it was my first step on the road to recovery. I'm not 100% sure that I'm cured or if that's even possible, but I was able to take the first step in the right direction because he was able to make me believe that there was something to love in myself, and that my problems weren't wholly and completely me.
I believe you are a person worth loving as well, and you deserve to be yourself and love yourself. I hope that one day you find the catalyst that I did that gets you going in the right direction towards recovery.
Posted by Shayl on January 3, 2011 at 6:18 pm | permalink |
Penelope, you are gifted. Why would you allow yourself to be in such predicament? I love your blog. I wish you and everyone health and happiness.
Posted by Michelle on January 3, 2011 at 6:22 pm | permalink |
Jesus Christ, you are a nut, aren't you? On the plus side, since your "marriage" to the farmer was a fake "pretend" marriage to keep from having to pay taxes, it will be relatively painless to disengage…no messy divorce.
Posted by Mike on January 3, 2011 at 6:35 pm | permalink |
Mike,
Just what possessed you to post this and slap Penelope around? She's honest and you backhand her. Can you add something here, or are you just succeeding at being a jerk?
Posted by Allen on January 4, 2011 at 10:02 am | permalink |
Allen, why don't you just STFU? Nobody asked for your opinion.
Posted by Mike on January 8, 2011 at 5:42 pm | permalink |
Penelope -
The problem here is really not very complicated. Simply stated it is:
You and the Farmer are not best Friends
I know you love him, want him, need him, etc and I'm sure he feels the same way about you, but you're not best friends. The difference -
1) Your best friend is as concerned with your happiness as he is his own. They really aren't that separable. Which means
2) Your best friend is not a competitor or adversary in any way. Your best friend understands that you and he are an integral unit with the same interests (much like a small company). Chief among those interests is mutual happiness. If your best friend breaks a lamp over her head, the appropriate reaction is concern and a commitment to fix things so that it never happens again. Which brings up
3) Commitment and Love are what best friendship is really about. Commitment is not simply about never leaving the person or sharing a home, its about being willing to share life no matter what. Best friends can trust eachother to be there for them because of this commitment. Love is the willingness to participate in another persons spiritual growth regardless of your views on sprituality.
4) This commitment has inestimable benefits and allows 2 people to share amazing things as well.
You and Farmer can be best friends, but it will require enormous effort. The effort, however, is insignificant in comparison to the rewards.
Posted by Leo Fabisinski on January 3, 2011 at 6:53 pm | permalink |
How preachy can you get? The problem here *is* very complicated, on both sides. Your sermon about the virtues of true friendship and commitment is full of lots of truth, but as far as I can tell not much truth that meets Penelope or the farmer where they are at right now.
Posted by Emily on January 3, 2011 at 7:10 pm | permalink |
Not trying to be preachy at ALL, and I'm not denying that they (and all of us) have lots of very complicated problems. Just trying to say that (very much like the dynamic of a small company) when all of the involved parties see themselves on the same side, they can do a much better job of fixing things.
Posted by Leo Fabisinski on January 3, 2011 at 7:25 pm | permalink |
Very well put Leo. Aiming to be best friends is the quintessential element in a committed relation. Achieving that may be a a formidable task. I do believe that when we talk about lovers' commitment is … simply about never leaving the person or at least not without a solid reason and not for a long time. I may be completely wrong but why waste any time without your loved one, if indeed is love. Time is of essence and we the mortals one should know that.
Posted by Michelle on January 3, 2011 at 7:25 pm | permalink |
I used to date an ENTJ and he displayed similar fighting behavior as you. Would never let me leave when we got into an argument, had abandonment issues and was always afraid of what it meant if I left. We didn't work out, obviously, but he is and will always be the roughest relationship in my life. Part of me wants him to be able to see how crazy he was…the things he did was so irrational. I tell you this b/c I hope that you are able to see the stress this type of fighting causes on your significant other and learn to discuss in a healthy way. There really is no need for all of that drama, and maybe before you dive into excuses, figure out why it is you must create these irrational situations? I think it's wonderful that you are open and honest, but sometimes that isn't enough. If someone did that to me, broke a lamp over his head, I would have left…for good.
Posted by Minaminx on January 3, 2011 at 7:18 pm | permalink |
I used to do this to my husband. I *hated* when he tried to leave in the middle of a fight, going so far as to follow him and harass him until he talked to me again.
Our marriage got at least 10x better when I let him leave. Five minutes later, he would cool off and come back. We continued our argument until it was solved or he left again, but he always came back.
When I pretended it was just a break, a pause in the conversation, we started to actually solve our problems because our arguments didn't escalate to the point of no return. We can now avoid the throwing things, banging down doors, chasing after cars stuff (yeah, it used to get intense).
Also, I'm an ENTP, fiercely, fiercely competitive. I hated him leaving because I couldn't "win" the argument, whereas if I got to keep talking I could.
Posted by Monica O'Brien on January 4, 2011 at 3:14 pm | permalink |
I can really relate to this comment as I am like your husband and my husband is like you. I am the one who leaves in the middle of a fight. It's partly because if I stay in the house my husband will not stop talking or yelling for hours and he breaks me down so much I just give up and start crying. I need to get away and think in private (probably partly because I'm an introvert) without someone yelling/talking at me. I literally cannot process the fight and figure out how to get past it until I can think in quiet. It is great that you have figured this out about your husband and are able to give him the space he needs. I hope he appreciates what a wonderful wife he has. Of course, I hope in Penelope's case that her husband just needs a few minutes to think and intends to come back and isn't just running to his parents.
Posted by hlcs on January 5, 2011 at 10:20 am | permalink |
It makes sense to me to try to get comfortable with time-outs when you are fighting. Leaving is okay. And then, whomever leaves needs to pay close attention to how they feel/what they say to themselves after they have left. For example, if the farmer left and went to sleep at his parents house, would he really sleep? Would he talk it over with his parents? Would he feel bad, relieved, regretful, or ??? Would he miss you?
And you, Penelope, if YOU left and took a motel room as someone suggested, how would you feel? You created a break for yourself to gain perspective . . . would that really happen? would you be antsy to get back? Get back to the fight (so that you could gainsay)? Or get back to the resolution of the issues? Would you think of compromises while you were in time-out? Would you justify your own behaviors while you were away? Would you miss the Farmer?
I just think it is instructive to let this happen and then monitor the results. How you feel will tell you a lot about yourself, himself, your sense of direction, your values as individuals and as a couple . . .
Posted by chris Keller on January 5, 2011 at 1:33 pm | permalink |
Come to Brazil during Carnival with the farmer!
Posted by Thiago on January 3, 2011 at 7:44 pm | permalink |
Think you're crazy? You are certifiable! If I was the farmer, I would have called the police for abuse, who would have contacted child services, then had you on a psych hold at a hospital. After 24 hours of assessment you can be committed for being a danger to your family and yourself, which clearly you are. This isn't about bouncing back: you need time in a psych ward. And you can't give advice about career or life issues because your life is so screwed up that you can't see it and hopefully others will stop putting up with you and enabling your behavior. Your blog is the least of your worries. Depending on who reads it, it may be your downfall. Your kids will be the ones who suffer from having a crazy parent who won't go into hospital. The farmer would be doing you and your family the best thing by having you committed.
Posted by Celine on January 3, 2011 at 8:31 pm | permalink |
Dear Penelope,
Things will get better. We all care about you. Please take care.
Posted by JB on January 3, 2011 at 8:38 pm | permalink |
This is going to sound awful, but …
If this is real, you really need to get over it and get it in check until your youngest is at least 17 years old. You may think your kids were watching Catdog while you were breaking lamps, but that's not real. Kids know.
Even though it isn't fun or interesting or exciting being "OK" for your kids, you're the mom, you need to be the mom, and it's what kids need. The hardest part of growing up and being a mom is knowing that your life is boring. Not exciting, not interesting … just day-to-day plain-old boring. Your life is actually supposed to be boring while your children are 5 – 17 years old. Boring is stable and kids need stable. They don't need interesting. Kids need stable more than anything.
I just don't think you should be smashing lamps on your head or anywhere when your kids are in the house. They absolutely know what goes on in their house, and that's not cool at all. The rest doesn't matter, but kids shouldn't have to go through that.
Posted by amy on January 3, 2011 at 9:00 pm | permalink |
I'm glad someone else said it. The answer to your question if someone can be a good mom and smash a lamp over their head is NO. A resounding NO. Your kids know what's going on and they are worried about you. Writing is fine, sure. Smashing a lamp over your head is not an acceptable coping mechanism.
These actions are just as bad as using drugs to cope. I hope the farmer does take the kids to Child Services and gets you the help you need.
Posted by Eve on January 3, 2011 at 9:28 pm | permalink |
Well said Amy. These two children should be the first and foremost concern of everyone reading this post.
Posted by dl on January 3, 2011 at 10:01 pm | permalink |
I can't say I know how you feel, because obviously I don't. That would be a lie of magnificent proportion, because no one can know how you feel, not the farmer, or your ex, or your editor, or any of your readers. But sometimes, when I'm watching tv with my boyfriend and he says in all seriousness that he never knew Oxford was in England, I feel like I should find someone that appreciates the knowledge you find in books and travel, maybe someone who finally after the millionth time I've asked him would learn to put dirty clothes in the hamper, who when he's mad at me doesn't threaten to take our dog away from me (who sometimes I feel is the only thing I may ever be able to really truly love forever, well, perhaps with the exception of my mother, despite the flaws in her that I'm sure motherhood accentuates in everyone in their children's eyes), or punch a hole in a wall the way he did that once, even though when I rationalize it I know he shares everything with me– his home, money, experiences– and tells me I'm beautiful and all the things women say they want, at least in movies. So then I think I can't leave, so I think about him leaving me. And then I worry that if he did leave me, I'd have to sleep in my car, or go to my parents and confirm my mother's suspicions that real love doesn't exist after all, not for long anyway, the way she's been telling me for years in different ways, some subtler than others. I am sure that I have read in comments before that people like reading your blog because it makes them feel that their lives are more normal, or better, or however they phrase you making them feel in some way at ease with themselves. But that's not why I like reading your blog. I like reading your blog because it makes me feel less alone.
Posted by Harriet May on January 3, 2011 at 9:01 pm | permalink |
my feeling exactly. thank you
Posted by dana on January 4, 2011 at 2:23 pm | permalink |
My goodness. So much advice here. Some of it quite bad, too. I assume that you will ignore the person who thinks that you should send your children off to boarding school. I don't even think we need to discuss that.
I also assume that you will ignore the people who think that Jews don't "let God in" their lives. Sad.
If therapy is working for you and making you feel better, that's swell. My husband and I were in couple's therapy for years and the only real decent piece of advice we ever got out of it was, that's it's not OK to leave. Every once in a while my husband would get angry during a fight and walk out and not return all night. Once, he even left with the words, "You'll be sorry."
I didn't know if this meant that he was going to kill himself, or go have sex with another woman, or never return. I stayed up all night terrified. It turned out that he checked into a Holiday Inn for the night. Hopefully, alone. I'd like to tell you that was the only time he did that, but it wasn't. Finally, a marriage counselor declared that it's inappropriate for either partner to leave without telling the other where he or she is and that they are safe. Obviously, The Farmer told you he was going to sleep at his parents, so it's not quite the same. But I did think that your retort about leaving first and packing the kids' clothes for the welfare people was classic. Sounds like something I would say.
My point is that once my husband agreed to never walk out like that again (and I agreed to the same, although I had never done it), we never had that problem again. It stopped. We still fought like cats and dogs. And I don't know how you avoid fighting in front of the children unless you lock them in the barn (which I wouldn't recommend, especially in the winter months). You can go into the bedroom and shout at each other and pretend that you're in a "cone of silence." Like the kids wouldn't hear that. Sure.
The one thing that I would recommend, however, is that you clean up the glass. It is, after all, your glass and your responsibility. Tell The Farmer that you will agree to take responsibility for your own actions if he will agree to quit playing the "parents card."
Shit happens. You're crazy. I'm crazy. I keep reminding my husband how dull his life would be with someone "normal."
Kay in Honolulu
Posted by Kay Lorraine on January 3, 2011 at 9:07 pm | permalink |
>>>I also assume that you will ignore the people who think that Jews don't "let God in" their lives. Sad.<<>>But I did think that your retort about leaving first and packing the kids' clothes for the welfare people was classic. Sounds like something I would say.<<<
This comment bothers me. I sure hope calling Penelope's retort "classic" isn't a commendation. Because can you imagine how her boys feel hearing this? Children should not be made subjects of their parents' arguing. Nor should they have to fear being sent away.
And finally, get the Farmer some Bag Balm. It's for cows but lots of people swear by it for themselves.
Posted by dl on January 4, 2011 at 11:44 pm | permalink |
The first part of my comment got cut off. Let's see if I can remember it…
>>>I also assume that you will ignore the people who think that Jews don't "let God in" their lives. Sad.<<<
I don't think the "let God" comment was saying Jews don't have God in their lives. Perhaps she was suggesting Penelope let MORE of God in her life.
If I recall, Penelope has said she's not a fully-practicing Jew. She doesn't regularly attend synagogue. Yet she feels afraid and unloved.
The spiritual discipline of prayer, Bible reading and attending synagogue can bring great peace. When Penelope feels no one else loves her, she should know God always loves her. She can be reminded of this by letting MORE of him into her life.
Posted by dl on January 4, 2011 at 11:53 pm | permalink |
I love it when people play the "God card." It's the ultimate trump card. Penelope is a Jew but she's not a "fully-practicing Jew" and admits that she doesn't go to synagogue on a "regular basis." Why do I just KNOW that dl is not a Jew?!! dl's very words, "The spiritual discipline of prayer, Bible reading and attending synagogue can bring great peace. When Penelope feels no one else loves her, she should know God always loves her. She can be reminded of this by letting MORE of him into her life," are sooooo Christian-speak. And in saying this, I mean no disrespect to Christians. I was raised Christian. Very religious Christian. I'm just telling you that this concept of "not fully practicing Jew" and the parallel with less of God in your heart is just so bogus. One has nothing to do with the other.
BTW, yes I did think that the remark about packing was "classic." And I don't think for one minute that Penelope's kids are worried about this as a reality. Kids know their parents. Kids know their style. Kids are a lot smarter than people give them credit. Which is why I knew we didn't even have to talk about that foolishness of sending Penelope's kids to a boarding school. Kids know when they are loved. It's the parents who get it all screwed up. Not the kids. Penelope was not loved by her parents when she was growing up. Nobody had to tell her. She knew.
And please refrain from playing the "God card." It's kind of tacky.
Posted by Kay Lorraine on January 5, 2011 at 3:18 am | permalink |
I am new to the blog, but am really bothered by the comments about the farmer "running" to his parents' house. Sometimes the best solution to an (at the moment) unresolvable argument is to leave the house. Some people might go to a bar, some people might go to a friend's house and talk. You and the farmer are out in the middle of no-where, it's probably too cold to sleep in the barn, and it doesn't sound like the argument would cease if he went into another room, locked the door and went to sleep.
It is also better to get out of a "hot" situation before something is said that is deeply hurtful, or said in the heat of anger. Words said in anger can be very destructive, and are impossible to take back. They hang in the air forever.
I have parents who have been verbally abusive to me and eachother all of their lives. In order to get away from my mother, I once swallowed a bottle of pills. Fortunately for me, it just resulted in a really good night's sleep. My therapist promptly advised me to leave the house any time one of them tried to pick an argument. I realized 30 years later, listening to them argue yet again, that they would rather be right than happy.
Penelope, are you afraid of happiness? If things are going well, do you worry about that there "something" just waiting to go wrong, and fulfill your prediction? Is the money management issue part of that, or part of the Asperger's, or just somehting else? Did the farmer think he was going to rescue you (I recall from one of your posts that he said you need someplace quiet), and that just isn't happening at the moment?
For whatever it's worth, Western Psychiatric Institute at the University of Pittsburgh has a great clinic for women. Self-injury is not a coping skill, although I can understand being so confused and in pain that you don't want to sweep up the glass. It's a great visual metaphor.
A career isn't a substitute for human relationships. But, with Asperger's, the latter must be easier than the former for you. And compartmentalizing is good, but you may not doing that right now. Please take good care of yourself first.
Barbara C.
Posted by Barbara C on January 3, 2011 at 9:19 pm | permalink |
I guess I interpreted this a little differently as my husband has the same "flight" response to a fight – no matter the nature or seriousness of the disagreement. I many times also block my husband from leaving in an attempt to find closure in a disagreement for myself. I sometimes need to fight it out – he always needs to flee the situation. I don't think P was wrong in doing what was needed to keep her husband in the house – and it was very intuitive of her to believe that once he left he would not be back.
Posted by Allison on January 5, 2011 at 3:08 pm | permalink |
Have you tried light therapy? You may be experiencing Seasonal Affective Disorder due to the low winter light, in addition to the other challenges you have.
Posted by Barbara C on January 3, 2011 at 9:21 pm | permalink |
Penelope, NOBODY can understand what you are going through except you – and sometimes even you don't know. I've been where you are, but my ex really did inflict physical harm. I stayed with him because he convinced me I could not survive without him. In our divorce papers, he acknowledged that he beat me because I "deserved it". It took a lot for me to leave but I did and I am so much better today. I am happy and I look it. He is filled with hate and venom and it shows.
Take care of yourself. The one big thing I learned is that people, even people you may not think of as close friends, will help you if you ask.
I am sending positive energy, a hug, and strength in your direction.
Posted by Mairzy on January 3, 2011 at 9:40 pm | permalink |
Hopefully the farmer has already read this post and knows how you feel/think about the situation. Yes, I,m a long-time reader and think you're nuts (so are we all, in different ways). And he married you knowing this. And the two of you want to stay married, so you will work it out.
good luck
*hug*
Posted by Ash on January 3, 2011 at 10:05 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope,
I don't know you, and you have obviously been reaching out for help for a long time so you probably know much more than I do about the terms for what may be bothering you deep down… but what I hear crying off this page is a deep, deep loneliness and a thirst to be known and loved anyway. Is it possible that one of the reasons you write from such a raw, true place is that you want to connect with others in that place where your need for care and love have not been met? Just a thought. I have noticed myself doing this with one of my blogs, which is probably why I thought of it. I truly wish you peace and love. I walked around with completely insane levels of anxiety for years because I was afraid that if I wasn't perfect, no person (or God) would love me in that place, where I had been rejected and bullied for many years. My peace came from discovering first-hand that God wasn't who I feared He was (now I'm sounding like a looney). Maybe ask God to show you how He feels about you, if He's there.
xo,
Laura
Posted by Laura K. Cowan on January 3, 2011 at 10:07 pm | permalink |
A lot of this is painfully familiar. I've spent a few months working through the exercises at http://moodgym.anu.edu.au/welcome and would recommend them to just about anybody. Just you and an Internet connection, no people to deal with.
Posted by Michael LaRocca on January 3, 2011 at 10:26 pm | permalink |
Wow. You're just as crazy as I am. It's kind of refreshing. Now I'm wondering if I have Ashberger's too.
I think you have too much free time on your hands. I know when I have too much time to listen to my wheels turning, I end up believing everything I think, then if I spend enough time on that, I end up acting out on it. I think you're right: working will keep you out of trouble. I think that's true for everyone. No one is at their best when they are just doing WHATEVER. If you have designated work to which others hold you accountable (outside of this blog where you can SEE and FEEL their reactions to what you do) then what you do will matter more and you'll take your actions more seriously. I am in a similar rut and didn't even realize it. Focusing on creating and producing something positive, useful to others, something that serves anything outside ourselves (our own home included) is always the cure for the tireless mind.
All the best,
Kim
Posted by Kimberly C. on January 3, 2011 at 10:35 pm | permalink |
boy, you can sure tell who *hasn't* been through any of the sh*t of life by reading these replies … does anyone else want to tell all these self-righteous know-it-alls to STFU, already? all of the pity and advice-giving and hopeful-this-will-be-your-come-to-jesus-moment bs……spare me.
this is life. it's f**king messy. maybe not yours, but then isn't that all the more reason to quit acting like you can so easily solve everybody's problems for them. or assign blame, which is soooo easy to put on the person at hand than the grown man refusing to communicate and avoiding problems like a child running to mommy & daddy. gee, i can't imagine why you're at your wits end, frustrated to tears that something as simple as saving a person's bloody hands turns into a power struggle.
i particularly wish to advise all the "you need professional help" and "he SHOULD call child services" imbeciles to shove it up your respective a**es, because you don't have a clue what you're even talking about or what real child abuse is… "if IIIIIIII haven't done it/felt it/been through it, it's not normal/it's crazy."
you can't tell the truth about anything in this life without every ignoramus out there trying to rush in and save the day because it makes THEM feel better, not because it's actually helpful.
there's a lot worse crap going down tonight in our precious little country, but it'll never be made public for your judgment – all of you who think you know what goes on behind closed doors are, shall we say … sheltered.
Posted by downfromtheledge on January 3, 2011 at 10:46 pm | permalink |
I hated this post. But then, as if guided by some mysterious force, I spent 10 minutes reading all the comments. And here I am posting a comment to feed your stats machine. You might not be able to manipulate the "farmer," but you've got your readers right where you want them. Genius.
Posted by Janeegib on January 3, 2011 at 11:49 pm | permalink |
What makes this situation unfair to you is that while the farmer has somewhere to bolt to , you on the otherhand have to stay where you are. And that makes you superior- you are & likely to stick it out. Its when people know that they have somewhere to run yet they don't, that tells you alot about them. The farmer probably does this in alot in other situations , he looks for the exit first or he makes sure there is an exit door before committing to anything.
But just so you understand, he's probably not sleeping in peace at his parents place. The minute he gets to his parents home , they give him the 'we told you so' look, which he probably hates even more because that tells him that he is not a good decision maker.
Somehow writing this post seems like an act of hope – you hoping the farmer will read it & understand and just stay.
Posted by Sadya on January 3, 2011 at 11:54 pm | permalink |
What makes this situation unfair to you is that while the farmer has somewhere to bolt to , you on the otherhand have to stay where you are. And that makes you superior- you are & likely to stick it out. Its when people know that they have somewhere to run yet they don't, that tells you alot about them. The farmer probably does this in alot in other situations , he looks for the exit first or he makes sure there is an exit door before committing to anything.
But just so you understand, he's probably not sleeping in peace at his parents place. The minute he gets to his parents home , they give him the 'we told you so' look, which he probably hates even more because that tells him that he is not a good decision maker.
Somehow writing this post seems like an act of hope – you hoping the farmer will read it & understand and just stay…
Posted by Sadya on January 3, 2011 at 11:58 pm | permalink |
Thank you Penelope.
Coming out of three divorces, and having a daughter from the first marriage I can appreciate what you have been writing, and all of the difficulties between family and work. And trying to find your place in the middle of all of it.
Leaving was the coping strategy I developed early in life; but in the marriages, it was after thirteen years for the first, four for the second, and eight for the third. Children were involved in all three marriages.
Among the things I've learned is to stop getting married, it has been easier for me to deal with feeling lonely and overwhelmed than the conflict, I've learned, and keep learning, how to bounce back.
What I have also learned is that people do want to hide how messy their life really is, I grew up in that kind of a family. I started therapy in 1974 because of growing up in that kind of family, and I have now found a therapist who is helping me.
I am almost scared of people who define what is mature and stable. It cannot be done because people hide too much, and compartmentalize too much. The whole idea of therapy is not more than a couple of hundred years old. People, and families, have made it through tough times. Mature and stable people have done and continue to do a lot of damage. How did we get into Vietnam? How did we get into Afghanistan and Iraq? How did we get in this recession that all the mature and stable people "never saw coming"? Domestic violence and child abuse almost did not exist fifty years ago, or drug addiction, alcoholism, or out of control gambling, or PTSD, or Aspergers, ADHD, etc. There are a lot of corporate executives and politicians who are able to justify their lives and the money they make simply because they have a mature and stable image. Start separating the mature and stable people from the rest of us so we can all be locked up or sent to another Australia.
Caring about the children? Sorry about that. We all were children once too. The worst people on the planet were all children once. It is fortunate any of us have been able to survive. Caring about the children is difficult, mature and stable people make it down right hellish. Children survive bad marriages and divorces, but I think a child's life expectancy is threatened by people who have arranged their lives so that they are removed from lesser people like me, or like Penelope. For some years, in the seventies and eighties, I pleaded with my mature and stable siblings to help me and my daughter. They have not yet. The last time I saw my brother, I asked him if he still believed that emotional issues and family should be kept out of the workplace. Absolutely, he said.
It was not hard for him because emotional issues were kept out of our family. I believe Penelope's willingness to write openly is of immense value to herself, the children, and to us.I have been sexually abused, as was my mother, that behavior and the neglect and abandonment gets passed down through the generations,having only one child was my way of stopping that at least. There was much more I had to learn how to deal with because mature and stable people paid no attention. Because Penelope is writing makes it easier to believe, that there is hope, that attention will be paid to how we, not just a few of us, can stop the wars, stop the behavior that leads to violence, we can all have better lives.
Posted by David on January 4, 2011 at 12:21 am | permalink |
Penelope:
This is the first time I have read your blog. Wow! I have a son with AS who is now 19. I have some AS traits myself. But that is immaterial. What I admire is that you are so open about your life and what is going on with you. You show us all that even successful book writers and blog publishers have lives that are messy and complicated.
Good luck on dealing with your family issues. I think that you will figure it out in time. I look forward to reading more from you!
Janis
Posted by Janis Schubert on January 4, 2011 at 12:27 am | permalink |
I don't think you're crazy. I don't. Dramatic maybe but not crazy. Here is why: Every woman that stays home from her career, takes care of her children, her home, her husband….and has very little interaction with anyone else, in person, looks to her husband to fulfill her. This becomes a problem.
When you realize that you are focusing on arguing with him, feeling lonely no matter what, experiencing your abandonment issues-don't abandon yourself.
Take time for yourself. Just yourself. Can you get away? Is there somewhere you can go, locally, and make contact with other women? A yoga class? A coffee shop? A church? Is there something you can do just for you that you enjoy?
I take my Alaskan Husky and walk for miles through the woods. It is what brings me joy; makes me feel alive. To be in nature and breathe the air.
We cannot expect the men in our lives to fulfill all of our needs. It is impossible. They are only men. They cannot read our minds. And if given the opportunity and we are in our mode of abandonment and loneliness, we will make darn certain that everything they do or do not do, supports the state that we are in and magnifies it! Am I not right ladies?
So my advice to you is to find the wisdom within yourself to recognize when you are moving into the space of these negative feelings. And instead of trying to move closer to your husband, or keep him from trying to get away find relieve for himself, move in the other direction. Not away from him so much but toward yourself. No matter what-no one can love you as much as you can love yourself..along with the love you will find from reaching for your guide: God, Spirit, The Universe—-whatever you interpret as your unseen solace.
~Take Care..you are not alone and you are loved!
Posted by Robbin on January 4, 2011 at 12:39 am | permalink |
Everybody is crazy. It's much easier for men to be crazy, though, because it's easier to find women willing to support and overlook crap. It takes a special guy to overlook a woman's craziness. Good luck. The farmer is a close one.
Posted by Naomi on January 4, 2011 at 1:30 am | permalink |
Reading all these comments is like enjoying a longer short story with a lot of characters, in the middle of the night when I can't sleep anyway. A friend of ours had emergency brain surgery today. We saw him yesterday at the local hospital before he was transferred to the university hospital, and he was rather delusional. When his wife came back to his room after we left, he told her he'd been having Coors Lite with my husband and me, there in the Critical Care Unit. He was convincing enough that she called us to find out, because they're closely monitoring his fluid intake.
Coors Lite??! Really? We're going to visit a friend in the ICU who may have brain cancer, and the best we could do is COORS LITE? Honestly, if your friend may be dying, you could at least get your hands on a six-pack of Stella Artois. Probably the worst part is being grilled by his wife, who thought we might have actually brought Coors Lite into the ICU. But delusional people are so sure, it can make you doubt your own perceptions. My dad was in the same university medical center about a year ago and was completely convinced that one of the orderlies had checked him out of the hospital, and they spent the evening at the guy's house with his family, watching movies and eating popcorn. "He was a helluva nice guy," my dad said, "the nicest person I've met here." I was happy for my dad, even if the orderly was not what I would call "a real person."
Lucky for me, we have GABA in the house — a kind of amino acid that calms the racing mind — and 2 hours later it's starting to kick in. But maybe I'll read some more comments first. (I left off at #176.)
Posted by EllenSka on January 4, 2011 at 4:08 am | permalink |
The saddest part I've read here, other than that there are children involved in this unfolding scenario, is that you've been in therapy since you were 5 years old. What kind of therapist do you see which lets this continue for all these years.
Any therapist worth their salt – ie one interested in you as a person, rather than your payments – should be able to help you. The only thing stopping that happening is your willingness to forego secondary gain.
IF you aren't gaining relief from therapists, it begs me to ask the question – are you paying for nice one to one chats or are you taking the actions required for you to move on from your past and into a future you choose?
I've been through many things in my own life including sexual abuse, rape, divorce and financial troubles. These have been experiences which I've used to create a life for myself. Yes some of it has been tough, but I've thrived emotionally, mentally, physically and spiritually.
It's all very possible, but only when you want to take responsibility for yourself and your family. It might take a while, but you could start today. My thoughts are with you as you make new choices and start to create the life you want to live, be the person you want to be – with or without the farmer and definitely without your old story.
Posted by Jackie Walker on January 4, 2011 at 4:26 am | permalink |
This is exactly the reason I don't blog. I'm afraid someday I'd talk myself into posting inappropriately personal stuff for the whole world to read, and then in the comments I'd get a million idiots thinking they're experts telling me how to run my life.
You all need to learn some basic boundaries about what's appropriate to put on the internet and what isn't.
Career?? This whole posts shows such lack of judgement I'd never have a business or professional relationship with you.
Posted by Looney on January 4, 2011 at 5:49 am | permalink |
I haven't read through the other comments because I need to leave for work soon, and I wanted to say:
Cleaning up the glass and apologizing for being crazy might be appropriate.
You can't change the fact that you act crazy sometimes, but when you come down from it, acknowledging it and apologizing to the person who bears the brunt of it can help to show them that you *do* love them and want to be in a relationship *with them* rather than just a relationship.
It's easy to forget when you're fighting, but you're partners – relationship partners rather than business partners, but still partners. Still on the same side.
Are there any career and business lessons that you can apply to your relationship? How would you start to mend things if you broke a lamp over your head in the boardroom instead of the bedroom?
Good luck to both you and the Farmer!
Posted by Anthea on January 4, 2011 at 6:32 am | permalink |
I think I'm actually understanding where you're coming from now. My ex exhibited pretty much all the same traits you're exhibiting, with a couple of extra doozies thrown in.
I'm not going to offer any advice. Everyone else has given their two bits worth, which may or may not make any difference. Probably not, unless you've built a rapport or trust with them in the past.
I will leave an observation though. Do with it what you will. My ex would regress from being a functional adult to essentially an emotionally stunted child. During this period her young son would revert to being the adult of the two. This has had a significant impact on their relationship now that her son is legally an adult. To a certain extent she has lost the respect of her son, as she wasn't always consistently an adult/parent/mother to him at times when he really needed her to be.
I hope you're able to get to a place within yourself where you can cope well in your personal life, such that all your relationships are vibrant and healthy.
Posted by Chris on January 4, 2011 at 6:48 am | permalink |
The worst fights I've had with my partner was when I didn't let the argument drop for a while, I didn't let them leave the bar/club/place we were at or go home if they had to.
If the farmer needs a quiet place and that place is his parents place you should let him go there. Then he knows he can go somewhere and still come back without it being a huge deal.
Sometimes even a fight needs an ad break.
Posted by J on January 4, 2011 at 7:10 am | permalink |
If the farmer needs a safe place to go for a time out, that's fine. But it should NEVER be his parents or his sister. For those who have not been following this relationship for the past couple of years, the farmer's family is NOT a neutral place. Anything they could do to break these two up would only be a victory on their part. If the farmer needs a safe place, choose someplace else. The farmer knew exactly what he was doing when he threatened to sleep at his parents' house. That's the emotional equivalent of his breaking a lamp over Penelope's head.
Posted by Kay Lorraine on January 5, 2011 at 3:38 am | permalink |
Penelope, you covered a number of bases: history of abandonment/abuse, your own history of post-partum depression, strategies to manage your issues with the farmer, such as gaining perspective, using tools that have worked in the past, seeing the other person's point of view, etc.
But here is what you didn't say, that I think needs to be known: How did your sons' faces look during/after the melee? How did you explain to them what was going on? How have you/can you make them feel secure and safe when loud, physical fights are happening in the next room?
Also, have you thought about guidelines for fighting fair? When you are in a calmer place, you and the farmer could develop such guidelines for yourself. It is worthwhile to fight–but you have to set down some rules-of-the-game, I believe. (Included in these, each of you needs to be able to "save face". No winner/loser.) Tell him what you need. He tells you what HE needs. Look at those declarations in writing side-by-side and see if they can be melded . . .
Have each of you apologized to the other?
Several readers have said that you cannot insist upon being right. I concur. What if you, right smack in the middle of a fight, said "I love you, and I believe you love me. This is awful for both of us. Can we turn it around some way?"
Chris
Posted by chris Keller on January 4, 2011 at 7:48 am | permalink |
I'm married to a writer, so picture the farmer's version of this fight as follows:
1 – Wife was whining about something, and accidentally hit a lamp with her elbow.
2 – Wife whines even more, and I decide to visit the folks to chill.
3 – Wife keeps whining, and threatens to block my car with hers.
4 – Wife can't find her car keys. Now is whining AND crying.
5 – I leave the house for a few hours. Good food at my parents' house.
6- Come back home. Wife hasn't cleaned the broken lamp BUT is not whining (good!); but is writing on her laptop (uh-oh).
PS – Really, the smashing a lamp in the head sounds cartoonish; like something from the Three Stooges.
Posted by Working on January 4, 2011 at 7:53 am | permalink |
BEST COMMENT EVER!
Posted by emily on January 4, 2011 at 3:23 pm | permalink |
Penelope-
I know this doesn't really solve the fighting issues (and everyone has them) but I would suggest two things: YNAB http://www.youneedabudget.com Someone mentioned this and it is the best software out there for actually keeping a budget. I've used it for over a year and it has really helped. More than a budget though, you need to give yourself some leeway so you won't need to over-indulge on trips.
The other thing is Badger Balm http://www.badgerbalm.com It is a hand salve that rubs in and doesn't feel greasy. I got my husband to use it at night before bed and it had really improved his cracked, bleeding hands.
As for the lamp, please try to stop hurting yourself. It does show how much you care about the Farmer though because you chose to smash yourself and not him. I hope he appreciates that!
Posted by Chickybeth on January 4, 2011 at 8:16 am | permalink |
My heart is racing after reading this post. Partly because I'm familiar with "crazy," but mostly because as a mother (also with a son who has autism) I'm worried about your kids. You didn't say anything about what you're doing to ensure their well-being while you sort yourself out. I think back to your post about when you had PPD and finally forced yourself to hire a nanny. That was a smart thing to do after you hurt yourself back then. I pray that you're doing the right thing for them again NOW. You are their best and only advocate, it seems.
Posted by VW on January 4, 2011 at 9:18 am | permalink |
Didn't you want the farm, and the farmer because you craved normalcy? It reminds me of wanting to move to Mexico whenever I'm there on vacation, and then after a week I'm so sick of sand in my bed, salsa breath and frizzy hair. My guess is you will always find drama and will just take turns having it with different people. Makes you an interesting read, but not a good wife, employee, mother, etc. We readers think you are great, but that probably won't pay the bills or keep you warm at night. Time to figure it out.
Posted by ASH on January 4, 2011 at 9:20 am | permalink |
Penelope, both you and the Farmer are smart, strong-minded and independent. I would guess those are some of the qualities that attracted each of you to each other. Neither one of you is going to control the other in any way, shape, or manner and any attempt to do so will result in some sort of conflict. Conflict either within yourself or exhibited towards each other. Conflict manifested by stress, emotional roller coasters, and/or verbal or physical outbursts.
What are you trying to prove or achieve by this conflict? Both you and the Farmer need to assess at a basic level what each is needing and asking for in this relationship.
My recommendation is two-fold. Focus on self as this approach is totally within your control – self-discipline and self-control by breathing, meditation, and other techniques with which you are already familiar with and have published on this blog. Focus on influence rather than control when it comes to dealing with other people.
Also, if you are able to see a downward spiral develop (e.g. – Farmer threatens with a given scenario), try to avoid calling his bluff or whatever and tell him what he's doing and that you're not going there. Take the high road and try to get back on track to resolve the problem at hand. It is important to be able to bounce back when you have a setback. It's also important to avoid a setback, if possible, by careful planning which I know you advocate and are good at doing.
Posted by Mark W. on January 4, 2011 at 9:45 am | permalink |
I hope that things get easier for you, Penelope. I hear you on how bad it gets *and* on bouncing back. Hang in there.
I know you must know a fair amount about borderline personality disorder, from doing DBT, but I don't know if you know Judith Herman's book "Trauma and Recovery." She argues that borderline personality disorder needs to be understood as a form of chronic post-traumatic stress disorder, which it makes total sense to me. From what you've said about your family background and from your bent towards bibliotherapy, I think you would find it a useful book to read. I also found Sandra Bloom's book "Creating Sanctuary" to be really, really useful.
I also hope the farmer will read them. I found them extremely helpful in understanding what one of my partners was going through as she fell in love with me. Like you, she has a lot of abandonment triggers, and just falling in love opened up huge triggers for her that were really, really intense for both of us to handle and we fucked up a lot out of god intentions for a long time before we figured out what we needed to do.
It's so encouraging that thinking about the early parts of your relationship with the farmer still makes you happy. Don't give up yet.
Also, I'm back on the East Coast now, but I had the deepest and most persistent depression of my depressive life during the years that spanned moving to Madison-getting married/all my friends finishing grad school and getting jobs and moving away by the time I moved back home pregnant/having that baby/starting a business. Plus some extra traumas thrown in.
If I'd stayed in Madison for all of it, I don't think I would have made it. Even though I like Madison, I couldn't have stayed in Wisconsin, but you seem committed, and you've moved to an even more isolated setting. Maybe staying with the farmer isn't worth it, maybe it will be in the end–but get a lightbox, really. Serotonin is key.
Wisconsin winters are a killer. All the therapy in the world didn't do me as much good as a lightbox–and a good lightbox only costs about what a therapy session does. It wasn't a substitute, I still needed therapy, but using the lightbox meant the desolation receded and the joy could reach me again.
Good luck. I'm rooting for you.
Posted by Sheila on January 4, 2011 at 9:47 am | permalink |
I love how you are like the dark shadowy version of the Pioneer Woman. I know you like her site but it bores the shit out of me. I much prefer your version of farm life.
Posted by liz on January 4, 2011 at 10:03 am | permalink |
man everyone feels like smashing something now and then…i think your post was funny and heartfelt and sincere…and real. the craziest part of all was having the courage to post about this, but thats crazy in a good way…
sounds like you could need a good hug though…
and you're right about being good at bouncing back…think about this, every single one of your ancestors survived and bounced back from everything…you come from an unimaginably long line of survivors…and so does everyone alive today =)
anyhoo, stay true…
Posted by tom on January 4, 2011 at 10:21 am | permalink |
Yowzers – first off I'm always amazed at how many people think they know you or the farmer based on some blog posts. Most of these comments have a lot more to do with people's own issues and projecting, than either Penelope or the farmer. Now for a bit of my projecting
Okay I admit it, I read your blog as you remind me so much of my batcrazy sister who can never ever be happy. I recall reading about the farm and how great it will be for your family and huge bells went off. Life is never the idealized version that is running in your head. You can't fantasize yourself into happiness. And as for the farmer – I just deleted two long drawn out paragraphs on my view of marriage – I deleted them as I realized that really fundamentally the issue is much simpler. You can not be someone's life partner until you are whole. I don't think either of you are whole. Okay back to projecting-my sister has run from one disasterous relationship to the next dragging her three kids with her. You're looking externally for someone to fix the issues inside you. It will never work. Stop. We all make mistakes, we all make poor decisions. The reality is that most of the decisions we obsess over, really amount to little in terms of long term impact. Who you spend your life with, and who you invite into your children's lives isn't one of them. I know, I know you've convinced yourself that the farm is the perfect environment for your son with AS – well FYI – the scene you described is much more destructive than any city or town life.
Posted by Sara on January 4, 2011 at 11:12 am | permalink |
Penny,
What's important to you? What's really important to you?
I've seen you like this before, and the one thing that pulls you through is your focus on what's important to you… business… kids… farmer… whatever it is.
You know the demons, now fight them, and don't be scared or stay alone too much. You know yourself well.
Talk to your good friends and those who will tell you the truth, and start a new project. You've been idle for way too long.
Peace,
D
Pulling and praying for you.
Posted by Dale on January 4, 2011 at 11:16 am | permalink |
Hi again,
Wow, what a deluge. I read through those early posts about the farmer…the beginnings, they were lovely. It brought back memories, as I too went to live with a farmer, years ago. I remember being confronted at the peeing outside, at what seemed like every opportunity â territory marking perhaps. Also the glide time approach to life, the impact of the weather, the seasons, the poverty and dependency. I remembered the sense of big sky. I wish I had taken more photos, explored different perspectives. The city is my home now and I hanker for the smell, openness, sounds and lifestyle of the country.
I liked that you thanked God that your blog introduced you to people who could change and challenge you. I liked that he is quick witted, has business savvy, is kind, thoughtful and generous â that you wrote about it.
In Chicago one time, I attended lectures delivered by a man who had written a couple of books on burnout. He spoke about how there are certain things that feed our soul, so to speak. We each have our individual things that restore us and when we factor these into our lives we can endure the rest. I can get so busy with the rest, it is easy to overlook these things that make a big difference to me.
Go well.
Posted by Mal on January 4, 2011 at 1:06 pm | permalink |
I see what you're doing. You're building things around you to take your mind off of the problems you have in your life. This is evident from the positive reinforcement you are giving to comments like Nora's.
And I see why (bear with me, this is just an opinion, after all). Like you said, you have been in analysis for a while. You have a mind that does something very special. I'm not sure I quite get it, but from what your posts and conclusions reflect, your brain is able to capture so much more information than normal people. And the information's always running through your head, like a river. When you force yourself to write a post, you are drawing from the river.
The thing about this kind of thinking is that it is way beyond just logic, it's groups of logic colliding at the same time. This, I think, is where you get so much insight into everything in life. And this is something that most people, like me, can't do. We find your conclusions correct though.
The problem is that you try to apply the same kind of thinking to the simpler problems, like your life. Budgets are not hard, relationships are not hard, normal life is simple. Just do it. At least, that's how it works for most people. Most people rely on the simple answers to get through the hussle of life, and it works mostly. But like I remember you writing about, you can't pick up this kind of information because of your Asperger's. Like body language and stuff.
No pity here, I'm just sad things are rough for you. It's empathy from a person different than you.
And I'm not going to try to solve your issues with your brainpower combined with Asperger's. I don't know everything about you, even though you write a lot.
But please keep in mind that you hold the key to solving your problems. Clear your mind. It might help.
These are just thoughts. Please let me know where I'm incorrect.
-JPN
Posted by Jeff N on January 4, 2011 at 1:43 pm | permalink |
I love you! I read through these comments then I just had to stop. Obviously very few of them understand this post. I do and I love you for it. Thanks!
Posted by Kathy on January 4, 2011 at 1:52 pm | permalink |
Penelope, if photography is going to be your new thing I figured you'd like the occasional pointer. Have you heard of the "rule of thirds"? It's for stronger composition. For example, the point of focus, which looks like the larger piece of lamp, could be on the lower 1/3 intersection and the lines between yellow/pink and floor/wall could be along 1/3 lines too. You can crop out the lower left portion of the photo and see what I mean. Not all great photos fit this "rule" but the one you posted is begging for it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_thirds
Good luck with everything! Feel free to contact me if you want to talk photography.
Posted by Travis on January 4, 2011 at 2:18 pm | permalink |
um, down from the ledge..
I have been through it and then some. Hate to see it pass down through the generations as many sufferers from abuse invevitably pass it down by repeating the same patterns they learned as children. I don't think P asked for advice but some folk feel compelled to reach out. Sure they could be less "judgemental" but who would read the comments?
Posted by MH Williams on January 4, 2011 at 2:28 pm | permalink |
You help me so much with your honesty about what you experience. I think some folks don't get why you post what you do. I for one appreciate it. I think it isn't about what happens in your life, rather it's how you deal with it; with all of it. Best, Beckie.
Posted by Beckie on January 4, 2011 at 3:03 pm | permalink |
Maybe you should write back and forth with the farmer….seems you can express yourself better when you write and not speak so impulsively.
Yes we all have these days… some rougher then others.
Posted by Jenn on January 4, 2011 at 3:08 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope,
I wonder if what you actually want is to give up your old definition of yourself and how important a "career" was to you at one point in your life. You live the pioneer woman – why not model your life after hers? As a NY corporate woman in her 30's I understand why this suggestion is difficult to take seriously. Brilliant writing, btw.
P.S. Finger Picking is a form of self hard. What is the farmer going through that he can't talk about? I'm sure it's not your fault.
Posted by emily on January 4, 2011 at 3:26 pm | permalink |
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/04/health/04mind.html?src=me&ref=general
Posted by KB on January 4, 2011 at 4:53 pm | permalink |
@KB http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/02/weekinreview/02parkerpope.html?_r=1&hpw
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/02/weekinreview/02siegelbernard.html?src=un&feedurl=http://json8.nytimes.com/pages/weekinreview/index.jsonp
Posted by emily on January 4, 2011 at 5:06 pm | permalink |
Don't fault the farmer for having his wounds licked at
his parents house. Everyone needs a sounding board:
yours is the blog, his are his parents. You obviously love each other, otherwise you wouldn't argue as much as you do. You're defining your boundaries, your strength and your limitations in your relationship. Coming from such different backgrounds as you and the farmer do, there is bound to be friction. The key is to find a common ground where you both can live with.
Don't give up that easily!
Posted by Geli on January 4, 2011 at 5:09 pm | permalink |
You know what scares me here? The number of commenters saying "thank you for exposing what we all go through".
Huh? Yes, most of us will have ups and downs. I've been married for almost 20 years and there were a couple of occasions I seriously considered getting a divorce, and both my husband and I got really sad about the prospect. Sometimes I feel like I have the worse job in the world. I have friends who went through cancer treatments that made them depressed and debilitated for a while. Etc. etc. In none of these cases, there was any hint of self-inflicted injury by anyone involved.
No, we don't all go through stuff like hurting ourselves on purpose, so I'll echo what Celine said: "it's about not enabling an unstable person write about this and think it's OK. It is not. P. needs a hospital, not a bunch of well wishers and agreeable followers".
My mother had depression from time to time, and my siblings and I suffered a lot even though the only thing she'd do was to sleep a lot. I can't imagine the pain for your kids, Penelope, so I think it's time for you to get a different type of help than the one you've been getting, because, from the outside, it doesn't seem to be working.
Posted by Chris M. on January 4, 2011 at 5:25 pm | permalink |
But where is the blood?
Posted by Joanna on January 4, 2011 at 5:56 pm | permalink |
Wow. When I used to act like this, I called it "shooting myself in the foot." But I never actually shot myself in my foot. But you actually broke a lamp over your head? Wow.
And as long as we are talking about honesty, my honest thought when reading this post was "Penelope, snap out of it! Stop doing this to yourself!"
Posted by Stacey on January 4, 2011 at 7:12 pm | permalink |
Interesting to read the comments and guess the gender before getting to the names (which are imperfect indicators). My tentative conclusion is, in general, your female readers are more concerned for your children's and your well being, more sympathetic to your grievances, and more appreciative of your authenticity.
I share their concern and appreciation, but suspect the only way forward is if both of you sincerely conclude you're equally responsible for the problems.
Guy's comment that he survived his first year of marriage by continually choosing his wife really resonated with me as did the suggestion to write back and forth.
One thing I can't shake though is how I'd feel if I my wife detailed the arguments we've had the last few days for everyone with an internet connection to read. Don't know how he manages that.
Here's hoping that calm prevails and you choose whatever you deem is in your children's best interest.
Posted by Ron on January 4, 2011 at 7:40 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope,
I thought this was a great column and I hope it made you feel better to write it. FWIW you don't sound crazy to me….Crazy people usually lack self awareness while you are quite the opposite. Your outbursts and behavior might push people outside their comfort zone but that is ok. You are also capable of calming down, assessing what you've done and reflect on why you did it. I for one appreciate your honesty and your ability to write about it. Thanks for sharing such personal stories with a fresh and honest voice.
Posted by mm on January 4, 2011 at 8:09 pm | permalink |
Dear Penelope,
I can't say much except that you take care of yourself…
I hope that things will be OK for you, the children are fine and the farmer will come home. You take care and we love reading your blog..
Posted by intan house on January 4, 2011 at 8:44 pm | permalink |
He went to sleep at his parents because he doesn't want you to control him? Interesting.
Relationships are challenging. My husband and I have been together for about 13 years (3 dating)almost 10 married. Anything can be hard….although I haven't smashed a lamp (may have thought about it) I think that staying and working it out is the most important thing. There have been times when I have just gotten in the car and driven….and calmed down and then come home and talked about whatever the problem was. But that is what we do, we talk, analyse and separate whatever issue it is and then discuss more. Rather like beating a dead horse (not a good allegory, but the only one I could think of). I think the new life is overwhelming to all of you, he is getting used to having kids around 24/7 you tow are adjusting to a comittment and there are stress issues with work….sounds like a normal relationship with a blended family. Just breathe…and no one is judging you.
"Those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."
Just breathe…..that's it….breathe.
Posted by Laura on January 4, 2011 at 9:33 pm | permalink |
I am sorry. I feel like I am losing it too. I have a good job, great kids, nice husband, but he's boring and I bear all the real responsibility. In the end, it's the moms who really know what's going on with the kids in the vast majority of cases. So even if you throw yourself into work, you are still the one who knows what needs to be done at home and this is a huge burden on top of work. Guys cruise through life cluelessly while we take on all the stress. It sucks; at this point, I don't think we really need them, and I don't think your lifestyle or husband is a great fit. It sounds like he doesn't give any energy back. I keep telling my husband I don't need him and don't want him. I'm not saying I am such a prize, but I am self-sufficient and in some ways it would be easier to be on my own and hire the help I need, instead of try to get him to help when he is often not competent. I think in many ways we are just better off without them. Get a vibrator and move on.
Posted by dottie on January 4, 2011 at 9:35 pm | permalink |
Like you, I am a city girl in a tumultuous marriage with a farmer. My farmer also hates me when I cry. Actually disgust is probably a more appropriate description. From a prior post, you accurately noted that farmers value hard work. Likewise, driven by a "survival of the fittest" mentality, they despise weakness. Since they associate crying with weakness, farmers are repulsed by this behavior and are emotionally unable to reach out with any nurturing or support. If you choose to stay with him, the only thing that will garner his respect is a tough exterior, even if it's a ruse.
Posted by Colleen on January 4, 2011 at 9:49 pm | permalink |
This is my favorite blog on the internet because it features a real human. The "intersection of work and life" no longer applies here? Do you not think that high-functioning, uber-successful people mask a host of personal issues from alcoholism, to infidelity to serial triple-bypass surgeries that they never share publicly? This doesn't mean they don't have them; it only means they pretend not to. What is fascinating to know is how people overcome these issues that WE ALL HAVE. In the collective sharing, we experience the pain, poignancy and hope of being human. Together.
The major difference between the other symptoms of psychological and emotional stress I just mentioned and Penelope smashing a lamp over her head, is that they are culturally sanctioned and perceived as things that "just happen to us." It's socially acceptable to get cancer. It's socially acceptable to be an alcoholic. It's socially acceptable to be 50 pounds overweight. No one harps on someone who has cancer and tells them to stop whining and get some help. No one says: "Your manipulative and passive aggressive tendencies brought this on you." Our pharma-cratic culture brainwashes people to think that certain (if not most) illnesses just befall us and we bear no personal responsibility in their contraction nor in their healing.
We all need "psychological help." Meaning, we all have our own blind spots and we all need unbiased, objective people to help us illuminate them. Rarely can friends and family do this for us because they are too tied into the results and it's hard to straight talk to the ones we love. Unfortunately, we live in a society where obtaining "psychological help," which is simply the conscious pursuit of self-awareness, is also condemned as something that only truly mentally unwell people do. In contrast, what's seen as more "normal" is people getting their breasts cut off, their uteruses taken out or their intestines chopped in half.
People get a sense of exhilaration reading this blog because Penelope bares it all and doesn't pretend. Yep, she may need help to see past her own blocks, but don't we all.
Posted by Kim Anami on January 4, 2011 at 10:39 pm | permalink |
Kim Anami– that was a pure genius entry.
Posted by Melissa on January 4, 2011 at 10:47 pm | permalink |
Right on, Penelope. Having a similar situation with school admissions/work/life
Posted by MC on January 4, 2011 at 10:49 pm | permalink |
Well said Kim!
Posted by Mal on January 4, 2011 at 10:50 pm | permalink |
I am also going through a difficult time and I've had a few dark, painful moments lately. I am not alone; your post confirms this. Thank you for sharing because there is such a tendency in society to just dismiss episodes like this as "something that only happens to crazy people who should be locked up." Not helpful, not productive. How can we learn as if problems and moments of personal failure are swept under the carpet? I'm sad that a few commentators have chosen to simply "kick you while you're down." Many of us have had difficult, sometimes excruciating, times, but few of us are so brave as to talk about them so honestly. Let us not be so afraid to show weakness and emotion. Thank you for giving us a window into the mind of another suffering, feeling human being. I hope you feel better soon, Penelope.
Posted by Heather on January 5, 2011 at 12:17 am | permalink |
When blog comments become as provocative as the post, and even more so, it's apparent you are chiseling through our shells into truth.
Yesterday morning I read your story. I couldn't think of a single constructive comment. This crisis is too complicated, too sensitive, too exposed to find a solution inside a thousand words. So I stepped away, but kept you in my thoughts.
Then, last night, with your life still seated in my heart, I asked my wife to read your story. We discussed your plight, the farmer, the color of your walls, your children, Wisconsin, and all that you represent. Minutes passes, carrying us to midnight and beyond. Eventually we spooned under the covers, feeling grateful that we had found each other and escaped loneliness. I rolled away from her and turned off the light. It was okay to find sleep. We were together.
Today I awoke depressed but came home happy. I made that happen. I don't always succeed. But I felt positive enough to touch your story again, by continuing to read the added comments. Rarely do I find such raw honesty published for me and the world to ingest. It's not always happy. But it's real.
Penelope, I do understand. You are deeply in pain. But you also express, on our behalf, the disconnect from the human soul. Yet this exposure is positive, for how can we find our way home if we don't admit we are lost? You coax us to face our dragons, even as we deny they exist. You remind us, in scalding ways, that we all are in some ways, broken, and in this way we are ONE. Ultimately though, you provoke thought about who we are and where we're going, as you contemplate that mystery yourself.
So I don't know if you actually crashed a lamp on your head or threw it on the floor. It doesn't matter. The truth of your need rings out, beckoning us to sing our own songs of longing and despair. And sing we do.
Thank you.
Irv
Posted by Irving Podolsky on January 5, 2011 at 1:05 am | permalink |
I keep coming back to this post and rereading the comments. Sometimes I wonder if Penelope is simply an awesome fictional writer and we're all suckers? Or is she really that far off the wall? But mostly, I wonder about the comments. Like someone said above, it's alarming how many people appreciate this post because they too have experienced such turmoil.
I find it interesting how irritated people are by what they perceive as "self-righteous advice." They're pissed because "obviously the advice givers have never experienced the bad life they have."
Maybe there's a parallel here. But before you get all pissy at me, let me explain.
Maybe the advice isn't so self-righteous. Actually, lots of it is pretty good and we readers could use it for ourselves. You know, things like putting our spouse's needs before our own, treating others the same way we want to be treated, taking responsibility for our own actions no matter what…this is all good advice. To you who are so angry with this advice, perhaps if your parents had lived accordingly, your experiences would not have been so negative. And perhaps if you can now live accordingly, your children can avoid such problems in their future.
I know this sounds self-righteous. And yes, I know every family has problems. But it's important to know there are lots and lots of families who do not have such extreme problems. Maturity and stability are not a complete myths. It can be done and lots of families are doing so.
Instead of automatically taking offense by the advice, consider that maybe there's some reasoning to it. If we reach out and help one another, if we allow others to help us, we then can make life better for our children.
Posted by dl on January 5, 2011 at 1:33 am | permalink |
It's generally not the advice itself that I object to, but the tone of some of this advice.
Posted by Jenny on January 5, 2011 at 1:55 am | permalink |
I'm having my own minor crazy time so I appreciated the openness a lot this morning.
Not exactly advice but here is a story about my marriage. We had been married over ten years when my son was born. At the nine month mark of parenting we hit a really low point and my husband, who is one of the least acting-out type people I know, turned away from me during an argument and threw a shoe down the hall…and through the window next to our front door.
I packed a bag and said I was taking the baby while he calmed down. He said pretty furiously that he assumed I was going to my parents and I said no to a hotel and just for one night. That, for whatever reason, calmed it down. No one went anywhere. And the next day I called the glass guys. My husband was kinda floored that I called rather than making him do it.
But the thing is, I'd learned that capacity – to see him, not the glass – from him. From the way he would bring me tea cause my throat hurt from yelling during a fight (that was as the 7 year mark). It -certainly- did not come factory-installed on me or even our marriage. And it wouldn't work if, over time, it didn't work both ways ( I picked the glass story).
I don't know how it will go down for you
Posted by Shandra on January 5, 2011 at 6:41 am | permalink |
… But I hope y'all figure it out. And yes if you're the one still home, clean up the glass.
Posted by Shandra on January 5, 2011 at 6:44 am | permalink |
You shouldn't be hitting yourself with something breakable. Next time, try a cast iron skillet.
Posted by MyWifeThinksImADonkey on January 5, 2011 at 8:48 am | permalink |
I think the breakage is part of the appeal. I lose my temper about once every ten years or so, and once threw a water glass at the wall only about a foot from the window where my wife threw the cordless phone in my other anecdote (she had been giving me a hard time for buying the wrong color paint).
The glass bounced off the wall, leaving a noticeable dent, and landed on the carpet, unharmed. It wasn't a wimpy throw, it was thick, solid glass, but it left me feeling dreadfully disappointed somehow. I stomped upstairs in a huff and unintentionally ripped the railing out of the wall.
Posted by Jens Fiederer on January 5, 2011 at 8:56 am | permalink |
Your wife is right.
Posted by Dale on January 5, 2011 at 9:20 am | permalink |
Posted by Tom on January 5, 2011 at 10:49 am | permalink |
Thank you for sharing this, Penelope. I look forward to reading about how you overcame this.
In the meantime, you may want to buy him a bottle of Surgeon's Skin Secret moisturizer. It was developed for surgeons who scrub their hands multiple times a day and need a good moisturizer that does not leave their hands greasy. I used to take care of my family's horses and would get dry, cracked knuckles too until I used this moisturizer. *I do not work for this company, I just love the product.
Posted by hlcs on January 5, 2011 at 9:45 am | permalink |
Keep writing and find a great therapist to talk to, even if you have to travel to get to the appointments. You are entitled to a happy life, as are your kids and the farmer. You two may not stay together and that is OK. I always found it strange he was "the farmer", not even a name. Life is constantly readjusting your Mind. You have a good one so you will make it.
Be well,
Lisa
Posted by Lisa Best on January 5, 2011 at 10:07 am | permalink |
Thank goodness you have so many readers who know exactly how to fix you. Too bad they don't realize you're not broken!
Posted by Dana on January 5, 2011 at 10:51 am | permalink |
Another good way of bouncing back and "keeping perspective" would be to volunteer and see how much worse other people have it. It might not make you necessarily feel better but it might help in the perspective sense. Also, it's a lot less painful than whacking yourself in the hand or head. That hurts!
Posted by Backpack Cooler on January 5, 2011 at 11:06 am | permalink |
Your advice to volunteer in order to gain perspective is misguided. What charity is helped by someone who needs more than they can give? P is suffering from some form of mental illness that could be depression, bipolar disorder, or something else. Do you want someone who is struggling to control their own emotional problems to volunteer to help underpriveledged kids or keep senior citizens company? Those types of jobs require someone who is in a place to GIVE out of their own STRENGTH.
The other reason your advice is misguided is that it is a thinly veiled way of saying, "Your life is actually really good, and you are just being a whiny bitch." How do you know that? I bet 5 years ago my life looked great from the outside – I had a new job, got to travel the world, and lived in a decent house we were fixing up. Peel back ONE freaking layer and you'd find out my husband was leaving for 9 months of military service. Peel back another – my father was dying of cancer. Peel back another – you'd learn my dad was an ill-tempered alcoholic that I hadn't talked to for about 10 years. And my sister still refused to talk to. And my mom, who I am very close with, was seething with anger that I was taking care of him after he'd left us so many years ago.
But to you, I bet everything would have looked fabulous and I should have just started volunteering to get some perspective on how wonderful my life was just then.
When someone says they are hurting or struggling the only correct responses are:
1- I'm sorry, I can't help you.
2- I'm sorry, how can I help you?
Posted by EngineerChic on January 5, 2011 at 5:56 pm | permalink |
Penelope…you're never going to resolve your abandonment issues through another person. No man will ever be able to put those fears to rest; you have to do it yourself. Or you can keep beating your head against that wall but I'm telling you from a lifetime of experience, at some point you just have to realize it isn't a fixable thing. It's an overcomeable thing, but if you don't stop acting out the abandonment issue in your relationships, nothing gets better.
Learn to let go, whether it's during an argument or when you think someone is walking out for good. Just stop yourself from bringing the crazy when you feel lonely or abandoned, it doesn't help or make anything better or teach you anything.
Posted by Kathryn (@kat1124) on January 5, 2011 at 11:41 am | permalink |
This is obviously a sad situation, and perhaps frightening for the kids involved. One of the things that caught my attention in the reported conversation with the farmer is that he said the fighting between you and your mother made him nervous. You do not respond to this. I'm not sure what the reasons are for the lack of response, but it seems important to examine and understand.
Posted by Karen on January 5, 2011 at 1:32 pm | permalink |
People. Seriously. I could shake you.
Quit telling her what cream she's gotta give to the Farmer. The whole blasted point is that it wouldn't matter if the Eskimos use it, because it isn't about the cream. This is a power struggle through and through.
If it comes at P's suggestion, prodding, encouragement … the Farmer would rather bleed to death one trickle at a time than do anything that would imply she "wins."
Is it possible there's far more dysfunction in some families where all the lamps are neatly intact and nobody's moving the cars around in the driveway? The broken glass is symbolic.
And for anyone who thinks you are "helping" a depressed person with your condescending remarks and cliches, I wrote this post for you (actually, for people who have to listen to people like you):
http://downfromtheledge.blogspot.com/2009/12/this-too-shall-pass.html
REALLY, you think you're helping?? REALLY, what she needs in her moment of powerlessness is your patronizing???
Posted by downfromtheledge on January 5, 2011 at 2:12 pm | permalink |
I know you're just trying to help, but it's a little obnoxious and self-serving to advertise your blog here. Be a little humble and offer to privately send it to people if you really want to practice what you preach.
Posted by Shayl on January 5, 2011 at 6:22 pm | permalink |
What's obnoxious is your patronizing comment and the intention behind it: to insult somebody, rather than contribute something productive…which is exactly what most of these commenters are doing to Penelope. Anyone who cares nothing of the topic of "why you shouldn't spout useless cliches to someone in genuine pain" probably isn't interested in clicking on the link, now are they? It's always easier to render judgment and tear people down.
Posted by downfromtheledge on January 5, 2011 at 6:44 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope and Farmer
If you suffered through all the comments to reach mine, you're tough!
The fact that Penelope wrote about this and the farmer has to read it before she published it- show that all is well on the farm in Madison- so your followers might stop worrying about you.
I am sorry if you are in real pain- but the way you told it give me a lot of giggles- you surely are a marvelous writer and although I have only find your blog a few days ago- I am basically nailed to it- even when I am in the dairy (I also live on a farm- my coping mechanism is my quilting and to not take everything so serious).
I don't think you need therapy any more- seems your coping skills are well developed! ( braking the glass on your head not a good coping skill though but for once in ten years- and able to tell the story, not to bad.)
Thanks for a wonderful captivating story- I am waiting eagerly for the next chapter!
Posted by Marié on January 5, 2011 at 2:42 pm | permalink |
Since so many people recommended that you get professional help yet failed to read that you've been in therapy since you were 5, I'm interested to know what your therapist advised about this incident. What did she/he recommend?
Having said that, I just wanted to let you know that the first year of marriage (legal or not) is very difficult. We expect the "honeymoon period" that we're told about, yet we get just the opposite. Add parenting guilt, past abuse issues, and human flaws and frailties to the mix and we start smashing lamps.
We criticize our spouses for their cracked hands and simultaneously ignore our own self-neglect. Penelope, what are you doing for yourself these days? You are unhappy with everything around you, but I suspect you are really just not happy with yourself. Ask yourself what you need right now. Do it. If you can't, then find a way. If it seems impossible, then ask for help. The farmer would probably love to help you because it sounds like he just wants you to be happy.
It's not about the farm, the farmer, the kids (who just want Mommy to be happy too), or your career/blog. It's about you and what you perceive that you're missing. What is it that you want? Where would you go if $10,000 fell into your lap? Would you really leave?
It took me the better part of my 17 year marriage to figure this out. I can't change others but I can change me. I can also take care of me and not feel bad about it. It's a "self-worth" thing. You know the expression "When Mom's happy, everyone's happy."? What would make you happy?
Pulling for you girl,
Sue
Posted by Sue on January 5, 2011 at 2:58 pm | permalink |
If they can make a show about $h*! My Dad Says then they certainly could do one on your and the farmer. "$h*! My Wife Blogs" maybe.
Posted by Kevin on January 5, 2011 at 3:23 pm | permalink |
@ Kevin –
Maybe producers from Bravo or MTV can see this potential reality tv mine gold. Heck, I'll watch it. Better that the Real Wives of Atlanta or Jersey combined indeed!
Posted by Passerby on January 5, 2011 at 4:27 pm | permalink |
It's a tricky one, this. If he really can't stand the greasy feeling then maybe there is little to be done but endure. (I know where he's coming from. But the way the grime sluices off at the end of the day is magical. And I do love to finish with a little magic.)
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on using life and career as safety nets for one another. I haven't seen this stated so cleanly before: right on the money. (Note to self: get a life.)
And thanks, Dana, for your neat and cruel summary at 10.51.
Posted by TwistedByKnaves on January 5, 2011 at 3:59 pm | permalink |
This post was alarming. Yes, we all have fights with our significant others, but smashing a lamp over your head is not a normal or healthy way of conducting an argument. Even if you find her candor inspiring, there can be no doubt that Penelope is very troubled. I worry that someday soon I'm going to log onto this blog, only to find that she's done something way more serious to herself.
Posted by Hatch on January 5, 2011 at 4:03 pm | permalink |
But…where did she say it IS healthy or normal or good for the kids? She actually implies (by referring back to her post-partum depression) that she *knows* she's in trouble. Her post is ABOUT picking up and moving on … no matter what you've done that you don't feel good about. Other people are out there breaking the lamp over their kids' heads, for crying out loud. OF COURSE self-harm isn't good. You know what's worse? Shaming somebody who is obviously already their own worst enemy.
Posted by downfromtheledge on January 5, 2011 at 4:21 pm | permalink |
Penelope…we could still find you that quiet corner in the shop. Bottom line: I think you should stick w/the farmer, otherwise you would be just like the rest of us, boring!!!! If you need to talk…call. Kathy
Posted by Kathy on January 5, 2011 at 5:09 pm | permalink |
Thanks for your openness about fights and lamps and hiding in cupboards at parties. I'm quite new to you but your posts are wise. Your truthfulness makes me feel less crazy and alone. Also proves that there are many ways to live a life. Focus on the next hour and know everything changes. Keep writing!
Posted by Bernie on January 5, 2011 at 8:02 pm | permalink |
I am a recently new reader to the blog and have always enjoyed reading all of them except this one, it sort of felt like watching a train about to wreck. I cared enough to keep reading, but felt worst with every sentence, this blog was at a very different level/tone than any of the past ones I have read. I could be way off base here, but I think you need to remove all the activities that remind you of being lonely, probably even therapy. I am not saying to avoid the issues that you are having, but to push yourself pass them…leave the issues behind and do not do stuff to remind you of the issues (again therapy). How about taking up some Farming activites with the Farmer…actually not just a few things…fully engage as if your career/life depended on it. If not anything else it will fill your days and give you something else to think about besides your issues…leave them on a different track!
Posted by Dennis on January 5, 2011 at 8:34 pm | permalink |
Regarding budgeting, perhaps you should turn over money management to the farmer and get yourself a pre-paid credit card that he reloads weekly with spending money that you can do whatever you want with. If that's the only card you have access to, you won't be able to go over-budget without getting him to agree with you that it really is very necessary to make an exception this time.
Posted by Jacqueline on January 5, 2011 at 8:49 pm | permalink |
Penelope,
I think it would be a positive and helpful step for you to engage with friends, relatives, neighbors, etc., and find out that you have a lot of friends and others who want the very best for you that life has to offer. To continue with the same way of doing things and expecting different results will only cause you more pain and stress. You have a wealth of friends and a huge number of fans cheering you on. Just start taking small steps, one day at the time, in a positive direction.
We're all pulling for you
Posted by Al on January 5, 2011 at 8:56 pm | permalink |
Penelope is so "troubled" that this was her latest tweet.
"Payoff for posting a photo of my fight with the farmer: I can crowdsource mental health strategies in my blog comments." Does this sound like someone who needs well-wishers, support, hugs or whatever the majority of posters do, or is this a totally manipulative, albeit very dysfunctional, self-centered woman who wants nothing more than attention? Another tweet regarding a parent-teacher conference she states it would be more interested if they talked about her. P. needs a psych ward and her kids should live somewhere else for their well-being. As for the farmer, he's grown and can figure out his own life.
She's built a brand around this behavior and has been fired from most columns because she gave bad career advice that no one trusted or wanted.
Posted by Celine on January 5, 2011 at 9:06 pm | permalink |
@Celine: Well said – I had the same reaction when I saw the tweet.
Posted by Jim on January 5, 2011 at 10:12 pm | permalink |
I've been gone too long. Last time I hung out here, you were in love with the farm.
I hope you're okay…
Posted by susan on January 5, 2011 at 9:55 pm | permalink |
I think a lot of people haven't read enough of your column to get you. My parents got divorced, my mom acted nuts around me, and I would have rather that than some weird repressed environment where everyone was in denial and pretended things are perfect. I'd rather live in the crazy truth, than in some fucking fantasy land my parents concocted for me.
And also, everyone should stop being so judgemental of P, who none of you have ever met (myself included). She was kind enough to give me great career advice when I emailed her once, and she was VERY responsive. Her advice worked, and I got the salary I wanted thanks to it.
If you've read enough of her column you'd recognize that she's pretty self aware and puts great effort into minimizing her crazy, or at least trying to offset it. She checked herself into the hospital–which takes guts, faith and self awareness.
Finally…this is a blog, a mere snippet of someone's life.
…Lest ye be judged…
Posted by Erin on January 5, 2011 at 9:58 pm | permalink |
I don't get it…
"He gets angry because he thinks he's given up everything for me."
What the hell has he given up? He's in his home on his farm plus he gets a wife and doesn't have to worry about the kids or money handling. So basically he wants to be a married man but doesn't want to change anything in his life…nice. He also gets to have his family nearby and "escape" whenever he feels like. Penelope, he is NOT the one with the raw deal here. I think you guys need to start acting like real partners and share the good and the bad.
Posted by Carina on January 6, 2011 at 1:36 am | permalink |
Was wondering the same thing. What has the farmer given up?
It has been instinctual for me to block my husband (and all former boyfriends etc.) when he tries to leave and have been quite desperate to ensure that I am not abandoned. I've smashed things over my head and lots worse. I've been in therapy since I was a child, dx with BPD or PTSD depending on the therapist and decade of analysis. One even said I was a sociopath. Back before the term sociopath fell out of favor? Or, maybe that was just my father's interpretation of the therapist's diagnosis. In any case, it's now part of my story that I tell myself. Crazy girl, bad history.
I relate to your blog and am very thankful that you are here. My most recent sessions of DBT therapy were started in 2007, because I was yelling at my toddler and the last thing I wanted was to become like my parents, so I began therapy again with the intent of eliminating that behavior. This primary directive in therapy – a clear focused goal – led to changes I never thought could happen. Namely the elimination of the escalation of fights into demon-conjuring status. At 40, I am now able to keep things in check. So far. It might all break down tomorrow. Who knows.
The change started in my late 30's. I hope it can happen for you, too. I wish you all good things. <3
Posted by Kathy on January 6, 2011 at 4:20 am | permalink |
I agree. I know we're not hearing his side of the story, but some of the things he said are not okay in any circumstance. It's never okay to talk about abandoning the kids to social services, even on your very worst day in the midst of the very worst fight. It was messed up to insist he wouldn't help clean up the glass, but threatening to abandon the kids is so completely wrong. Kids aren't currency for anyone's use under any circumstance. And leaving to go to stay with his parents is just LAME.
Posted by Sarah on January 7, 2011 at 8:32 pm | permalink |
Sorry you had a fight. Reminds me of cat 4 fights I had in '94 -96.
I hear corn huskers lotion is good and rural.
love, compassion and understanding.
Posted by Hans Hinners on January 6, 2011 at 6:11 am | permalink |
Violence is never acceptable, whether done to another person or animal or done to yourself. Is this really the best way for you to communicate your feelings? I don't know you or the farmer. but get thee to somesort of family systems therapist to learn how to communicate without harming yourself. What example are you setting for your children. Be a Mother first and care about what you actions you model for your kids.
Stop modeling violence for their sakes if not your own.
Posted by Tom on January 6, 2011 at 7:53 am | permalink |
Okay so for most of you who read Penelopes posts I think you are missing one big point. SHE HAS ASPERGERS!!!!! Do some research on this and then search for Theory of Mind. This will explain so much about communication. Having Aspergers is like living in a monotone type world they cant read people's emotions, they don't understand how to put themselves in others shoes, they can develop rules like if this happens then I need to do that.
I read Penelope's posts becuase I am amazed at how successful she is and how writing is her "thing"….I work with people who have disabilities. Asperger's is in the top five I never want to have….take my legs but don't let me have Aspergers.
Penelope you need to get some communication going that will work for both you and the farmer.
Posted by Jenn on January 6, 2011 at 9:34 am | permalink |
She SAYS she has Aspergers. Unreliable source.
Posted by Bennie on January 6, 2011 at 11:00 am | permalink |
I read this post today expecting positive reassuring advice but this is not what I got. Today I got the real world honest depicted life of a woman who is living life. I am a bit shocked but the same time I completely understand. You are not crazy. You're just like everyone of us trying to cope with life. Each one of us deals with what we have one way or another and well just don't have all the tools or experience. I dont have them and neither does anyone else. You need a support system and this blog helps but you need to have one that's like a tree; branches out for different parts of your life. I'm like you I write everything down to keep track and cope with the overwhelming amount of information I process daily. Pictures help too when I'm trying to describe something. For some reason my mental image of something doesn't translate to spoken word.
In the past when I read your blog I judged you unfairly. I saw that you were just making the wrong decisions and to me your writing made it blatant. I felt like I knew better and that you should too. How stupid of me. I was just like all your readers who post negative comments from their high perch. Now that I've moved from PA to Fl I'm now on information overload and I'm finding all the new things I'm dealing with quite stressful and well it seems like your life is just the same. There are things that I have in mind to accomplish but it gets overshadowed by everything else that I didn't or couldn't think of. What keeps me sane through this all? Music, writing things down, prioritizing the people and things in my life and well just laughing when I do dumb, idiotic things. The last thing helped when I moved into my apartment and went grocery shopping for dinner only to realize I didn't have any cutlery or plates at home.
Sorry I wrote so much but you really can cope if you want to. You can't change the way the farmer thinks or react but you can get him to understand you and your perspective. Your children are important and even though the tv is a great distraction just be honest with him and tell them that you're not coping well to all the changes. They're not stupid and they might be in the same situation as well. With the farmer and kids as support you've started out your tree's foundation.
Your relationship with the farmer doesnt have to end but if what you're saying about him is true then he sounds like an asshole. He expects too much from you and well he is treating you like the cattle he tends. Again I'm being judgmental but why would he hate you when you cry?
Posted by E. Wilson on January 6, 2011 at 11:47 am | permalink |
You've mentioned dialectical behavioral therapy (a treatment developed for borderline personality disorder) in a previous post and here you're reporting that you're self-harming and having explosive fights with your spouse. I'm not a mental health professional but you seem to fit the profile of borderline personality disorder, and I think you know that. It sounded like you were attempting to follow and adapt DBT on your own in the previous post. Please consider seeking a class and counselor trained in DBT, if you aren't already. Everyone goes through bad times, but this is extreme. I mean this sincerely: you need and deserve professional help.
Posted by R.K.A. on January 6, 2011 at 12:44 pm | permalink |
How can you say she's not crazy? That's exactly what she is. She may have Aspergers, but I think that's the least of her issues, to the point of being almost irrelevant.
As for her relationship with the farmer, what relationship is there? It sounds like his initial attraction to her was that she brought a lot of strange energy and uninhibited sex into his mundane rural lifestyle, that that was all he was interested in. He more or less told her that (you take care of the money and the kids). She was after the same thing (a lifestyle change) in reverse. I don't think either of them really connected with each other on a level necessary to maintain a relationship, they just used each other as vehicles to a new lifestyle.
I don't know about the farmer, he sounds like he has some real maturity issues, but I can't see Penelope ever being able to sustain a relationship. There's seems to be no give and take. She's just a big needy vacuum who loves herself so much that no one else could ever provide her with satisfaction.
Posted by MyWifeThinksImADonkey on January 6, 2011 at 12:48 pm | permalink |
At the end of the day, it is about her kids and what sort of world is she modeling for them. It's not about her, or her Aspergers, or the Farmer, or her career, or her blog, or her website. It is about her kids. We all sacrifice for our kids. We all conform to standards we may not like because of our kids and the need to support them.
If she is or isn't crazy doesn't matter. She needs to be a parent first and foremost and take care of her children.
Posted by Tom on January 6, 2011 at 1:59 pm | permalink |
Penelope, please get some help right away. Jesus. You're scaring me. I mean, other help; I know you've gotten loads of help, but try again; try something different; try someone different.
xo
Posted by Martha on January 6, 2011 at 2:55 pm | permalink |
FWIW, your blog has lots of traffic when you have a fight.
Yet, it has less than half the comments that Tim Ferris. Sorry.
Posted by Justchecking on January 6, 2011 at 4:19 pm | permalink |
I'm going to ask you a question because I see a lot of myself in your most recent post. Have you ever been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder?
Stay with the DBT – it might save your life someday.
Posted by Paula Bostrom on January 6, 2011 at 4:45 pm | permalink |
Thank you for your post today. I understand what you are dealing with and I'm sorry for the chaos in your life. Yes, your life is what you make of it and you readily admit your mistakes. What I always appreciate is your honesty and your willingness to share your mistakes and what you are learning from them. Today I was wondering around my house in my sweats and slippers and I couldn't figure out why I felt so lost. I know I need a job. I know I need more social connections. In the past my social connections were through my job and without it I don't know what to do with myself. My life is unbalanced and while my coping skills are different then yours I am well aware of how easily I could hit my bottom. As long as you keep you and your children safe you will find a healthy solution. Maybe not today or in the near future but you will succeed in providing your needs. At least, that is my belief.
Posted by Shelly on January 6, 2011 at 6:04 pm | permalink |
Keeping the track of personal and career is important, Yes I do agree with you that personal life is more important for career. If that goes wrong then everything seems to be horrible in life. As you're a mother take care of those children and give them a good life…..
Posted by Naresh on January 6, 2011 at 6:53 pm | permalink |
Tears are a turn off to men?
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/07/science/07tears.html?partner=rss&emc=rss
Posted by Hazel on January 6, 2011 at 6:57 pm | permalink |
I imagine that you find these quiet moments where you boot up the computer, pull up the blog and just read through the hundreds of comments from people all over the world who were compelled enough to share their opinions on your life and journey. And for each comment there are hundreds more who pondered your situation either quietly or aloud and wondered, "what would I do", or "how do I feel?" Perhaps others wondered if there was something – anything – they could do to help. Help you. Help the farmer. Help your kids.
That is the purpose of writing, provoking thought in others by exposing your innermost self. Some do it in bits but you do it in droves. Every week. And that takes something that most of us simply don't have. Courage isn't always healthy and craziness isn't always bad.
Posted by Mark S on January 6, 2011 at 6:59 pm | permalink |
I'm reading all these very serious comments worrying for your welfare and wondering if these people have ever been married. The first few years of marriage are notorious for the stuff you're going through. Hopefully, you and the farmer will find your way through it and by the time you get to my age, you won't have the energy to go around breaking things anymore
You're fine. And I adore the way you write.
Posted by louise fletcher on January 6, 2011 at 8:32 pm | permalink |
Spot on Louise. I definitely have a few stories that would shock my parents and the perfect image they have of my husband. Ha!
Posted by Sarah on January 7, 2011 at 9:33 am | permalink |
I think you spend too much time inside. Simple cure for your situation, which applies to 90 percent of the population, get out of the house, take vitamins, eat a healthy diet, get exercise, ride your bike, swim, walk, run – outside of the house. Don't spend 24/7 with anyone – recipe for disaster with anyone! You need to have some sort of social outlet with friends not your family and not internet chat.
Posted by c on January 6, 2011 at 9:53 pm | permalink |
Very good advice C. And while she's outside she should be doing some physical labor. Pitch sh*T from the calf pens or shovel the sidewalk. Here in Wisconsin lots of us burn wood for heat and we "make" wood. That means cutting, stacking and loading – it's a good aerobic and weightlifting workout.
Posted by dl on January 6, 2011 at 11:05 pm | permalink |
Penelope, I love your posts and I thank you for you honesty. and I am quite amused/disturbed/worried at how nonchalantly you explained how you broke that lamp on your head. I don't think this is the kind of things you would normally do even though you are quite "crazy"… unless louise fletcher is right, and this is how married women behave
Please take care of yourself, your blog advice has really helped me through tougher times.
Posted by SIP on January 6, 2011 at 10:39 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope, I read your post and am very concerned. I really think you need counseling. I think your actions were self destructive. It isn't healthy. If you aren't in a healthy relationship, then you need to take steps to get out. Please get some sort of help.
Posted by AJ on January 6, 2011 at 11:20 pm | permalink |
Who edited this piece? I could not even read the article it was so poorly structured. Half the 'sentences' in the first paragraph are not even complete sentences.
I smashed a lamp over my head. Complete sentence
There was blood everywhere. Complete sentence
And glass. NOT a complete sentence
And I took a picture. Never start a sentence with 'and'
I think my life is getting better because it used to be that I wrote everything. Garbled grammar.
In order to cope. NOT a complete sentence.
Now I can take pictures. Complete sentence.
So I have two coping mechanisms. NOT a complete sentence.
That is as far as I read. Epic fail.
Get an editor.
Posted by D on January 7, 2011 at 7:41 am | permalink |
Get a life.
there's nothing worse than someone pedantic enough to analyze spelling and grammar instead of content. Idiot.
Posted by J on January 7, 2011 at 7:54 am | permalink |
Silly comment. You seem to know little about communication. Say what you will about Ms. Trunk — my opinions vary — but she is a hell of an effective writer/communicator. I should know — I've made a (very good) living doing the same…although the grammar police would scorn me.
Posted by Peter on January 7, 2011 at 10:45 am | permalink |
I had to add my two cents:
In expressive writing, including interrupted or incomplete sentences is 'grammatically' allowed to create a specific mood or to establish a voice. This choppy effect works exceptionally well in this piece because it reflects what Penelope is going through.
And as a writer, I sometimes start my sentences with 'And' and 'But'. It's for effect/flow. As an editor with 10+ years of experience, I would never change those incomplete sentences to complete ones. That just completely eliminates the writer's persona.
Posted by Nadia on January 9, 2011 at 10:11 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope,
As you know I am a huge fan of your work. You are without a doubt the most brilliant writer I have ever read. One of the few true voices of Generation X. I hope you keep writing forever. (For me this is saying a lot.)
Sometimes I think you go too far. When you wrote the post where you said that Veteran's Day should be cancelled, I terminated my subscription to your blog. It was such a disrespectful post. No matter what your opinion is, there are some things that really are sacred. In my mind, attacking the people who defend us was totally out of line. You could have said what you wanted to say without literally trying to have Veteran's Day subtracted from our lives and traditions. (Disclaimer: I work for the government. However, my opinions are my own.)
Nevertheless I gradually have been sneaking peeks at your blog over the weeks because I miss it. If I were a teacher of writing, I would make it mandatory to read your blog. I loved the piece about grammar being obsolete. You really get it. You fundamentally understand the principles of good communication. The proof is the success of your writing. (Honestly I couldn't care less about your advice. It's the writing style that is so fantastic.)
Anyway, about this post. Obviously I couldn't stop reading it. You already knew that. I read the comments too. I'm not going to insult your intelligence by adding to the chorus of people telling you that you need professional help. I think you have calculated that into the equation of all your blogs. You intentionally portray a version of yourself here – who said it, "crazy within defined boundaries," – so that you can engage your readers on a certain level emotionally.
Your writing reminds me of Bret Easton Ellis (take your pick of his work). I wonder if you like his books. You remind me of the way Michael J. Fox portrayed the main character (Jamie?) in Bright Lights Big City. Caught up in bad, crazy things but mostly because you find them interesting. Mostly because you are bored.
The character you have constructed for your online persona also reminds me of Sylvia Plath. I mean that as a compliment.
I will echo others in saying that I am concerned about your kids. Of course. But I also get the sense that you love them dearly and are a really attentive and caring mom. I think they will be OK.
Forgive me but I am also curious as to how exactly you broke the lamp over your own head (since you brought it up). Physically, how did you do it? In addition, assuming that you literally stood there and smashed a lamp over your skull, wouldn't you be out cold and lying on the floor? Also the photo was a bit tame (as others have pointed out). But then again…you are very careful about having a certain "brand" of being crazy within boundaries that others find acceptable to view. (Perhaps that's how we know you are normal. You usually know where to draw the line.)
If I could give you any advice it would be to watch out for the sophistication level of your readers. I think it's obvious that you aren't really as out of control as you claim, although of course you're fairly messed up (like the rest of the world). If people start to see through your work and discover the underlying marketing ploy (which is to get more readership by being outrageous or needy) they may get angry and abandon you for people who really do need their sympathy.
Finally, from a feminist perspective, I just want to call attention to the fact that you are a survivor of physical and sexual abuse, and that your behavior online could well be an example of how abuse survivors become disconnected from their own bodies and feelings. This is very evident in the way you literally put everything out there, or at least stuff that is way, way beyond what most people would share. As you continue your journey of healing, you may regret this later on. I would supportively encourage you to look for a solution that enables you to be real, but also respects your and your family's need for privacy. Come back from the edge. Trying to continually top yourself can only end in one way – a bad way.
We will still be here, reading, no matter what you do. Your writing is inherently not boring, no matter where you live.
OK, just one more thing. I don't think you should run away from home. The issues can be fixed. In the big picture, the commitment to one another is there and that's what counts. You don't have to be like everyone else. As Carrie put it in Sex and the City 2, "Every marriage makes its own rules."
You have brought a lot of help, comfort and hope to people online, not just for career help but also for sympathy as we all face the difficult challenges of life. Though I disagree with some of your posts, overall I think you've been a force for the good.
Thank you for that and Happy New Year.
Sincerely,
Dannielle Blumenthal, Ph.D.
Posted by Dannielle Blumenthal on January 7, 2011 at 8:51 am | permalink |
You just quoted SATC 2? Seriously, were there no better authorities?
Posted by MJ on January 7, 2011 at 5:50 pm | permalink |
You aren't perfect, but I have to say this–the farmer is an ASS for not cleaning up the glass and running to his parents. I would FLIP if my husband did that.
All is not lost–and I hope things get better for you guys.
Posted by Sarah on January 7, 2011 at 9:26 am | permalink |
From the "No duh" department:
He doesn't hate you when you cry. He's just turned off.
Science confirms: Women's crying is a turnoff for men
New research finds "emotional tears" may actually lower testosterone levels
Posted by Tzipporah on January 7, 2011 at 12:30 pm | permalink |
For someone who is struggling to determine how much of one's self to put into career and how much to put into personal life, I thought there was a very important piece of career advice in this post. Penelope reminds us that when one's personal life is in shambles, career is a saving grace, as something to remind yourself you have accomplished something good in your life, to give you a goal outside of your personal life, or just to give you something meaningful to keep your mind occupied. When one's personal life is going well it is easy to forget how meaningful our careers can be. I learned from this post. Best wishes to you, Penelope.
Posted by Megan on January 7, 2011 at 12:51 pm | permalink |
Hi Penelope. Ive been following you on and off for awhile. I think its been at least a year or so since I looked you up. Your blog today really moved me.
I dont have anything to offer in the way of advice, Lord knows my relationship history is nothing for someone to model themselves after, but my heart really goes out to you.
From reading your posts over the years, I feel like I know you really well…which is weird since you dont know me at all! If I were your friend in real life, Id invite you and the kids over and we could all hang out, watch cartoons and eat pizza or something. I know that sounds odd, but what Im trying to say in my own weird little way is; there is love out there for you, so dont ever doubt that.
big hug….
Kylie
Posted by Kylie Estwick on January 7, 2011 at 1:27 pm | permalink |
I don't know what to say that hasn't been said. And also, I am without words. But I'm happy you know you're in need of a bounce back. Take care.
Posted by Joselle on January 7, 2011 at 4:17 pm | permalink |
So sorry all this is going on. I wish I had the courage to write about my kind of "crazy". Keep on writing, I'm cheering for your bounce back!
Posted by Amanda on January 7, 2011 at 8:20 pm | permalink |
my sympathy to you. hope you'll be okay in God's time soon. take care always.
Posted by blacktip28 on January 7, 2011 at 9:15 pm | permalink |
Penelope, just came back to check. Hope all is well. And that you've bounced back, as you say.
Posted by Lisa on January 7, 2011 at 10:12 pm | permalink |
To The Farmer:
You already know that you can both love and hate someone. But is she worth it? Of course she is. If you leave her, you will regret losing the opportunity to learn more about yourself than you could ever learn any other way. She will take you way beyond your boundaries and you will become someone you never thought you could be. Peace will develop over time takes time (I don't think you two have been together for very long) and it will be worth it – just ride it out.
To Penelope:
Same Comment.
To Both:
Forget everything but kindness.
Posted by Grace on January 7, 2011 at 11:19 pm | permalink |
You're going to be fine. Part of being in a relationship and being human, which you have proven over and over in so many aspects (not that you had to). Love and Prayers. Keep up your great work.
Posted by Oscar Baltazar on January 8, 2011 at 1:05 am | permalink |
Sadly, I assume your next post will be about how child protective services removed your children from this potentially dangerous situation. You need to stop reacting to every thought. Especially the destructive ones.
Posted by Mike on January 8, 2011 at 4:35 am | permalink |
now would be the time to bounce back – go girl – for the kids just fake it for now … best le
Posted by le@thirdontheright on January 8, 2011 at 5:06 am | permalink |
I am a first time reader, 40, female, and owner of my own small business. This post was highly disturbing and completely turned me off, as a business owner, woman, wife, and every aspect of my being. I'm with Paul who commented above that he will not be reading this blog any longer. I highly doubt I will ever come here again. Everyone has issues, but posting them in a public format to people who turn to you for advise is not helping anyone. I hope everyone reading this knows that the situation as described is not healthy, and if you look to the writer of this blog as a role model, consider looking elsewhere.
To Penelope – If you are wondering if this love is the real thing, it probably isn't. Real love is something you feel heart and soul. Some say you know it because you can't possibly live without the other person. That is not true. You can exist, and so can the other person. The point is that you compliment one another's lives. You each bring out the best in the other. Based on this post, that is not the case in your relationship. And before you tell me that he makes you happy, let me tell you that first you must be able to find happiness on your own in order to share it with another.
Posted by Tracey on January 8, 2011 at 10:23 am | permalink |
Tracy- I just wanted to start by saying thanks for kicking Penelope when she's obviously down. That says a lot about you and I say good riddance. This site, it's subscribers and Penelope don't need readers like you who are obviously just here to judge. It takes a lot of courage to share your thoughts and feelings, especially online so I applaud Penelope for her courage and hope she gets the help she needs to get through this tough time.
Bye Bye Tracey!
Posted by Amanda on January 8, 2011 at 5:00 pm | permalink |
You've given a lot of advice though this blog, some of which I've found helpful, and maybe I'm not really returning the favor, but I'm going to try.
You need to get help. Serious help, and as soon as you possibly can.
Because you've (and possibly the farmer too, it's hard to tell from this distance) have passed the point of 'having problems' — you've become an abusive spouse. At the moment, the person being physically hurt is you, but physical abuse isn't the only kind. You cannot stop someone from leaving you, and having abandonment issues — valid as they are — is not a get out of jail free card. And I meant the jail part literally. You cannot stop someone from leaving you. It's illegal, and it's illegal for a reason.
You already know your behavior is "crazy"; I don't know if you grasped how very far beyond the pale it is. I realize you genuinely have issues, and I realize that they may be preventing you from really getting how bad things are.
Think about your situation. Imagine a friend of your described it to you, as her or his reality. How scared for your friend would you be if you heard him or her describe (as being done to them) what you're doing to the farmer? Would you be afraid it would escalate? Would you be afraid of the impact it might have on their children? What would your advice be?
Please get help, and get it soon.
Posted by MNiM on January 8, 2011 at 12:55 pm | permalink |
Great photo.
Posted by rickandkathy on January 8, 2011 at 4:41 pm | permalink |
Some of the comments are really scaring on this blog.
Posted by Ulmert on January 8, 2011 at 4:44 pm | permalink |
People are only speaking the truth. That Penelope is a nut job and her kids are in danger and should be taken away from penelope for their own safety.
Posted by Mike on January 8, 2011 at 5:47 pm | permalink |
To Tracey and Paul: would you think your dentist is any less qualified to perform a root canal, if he tells you about his marital problems?
Oh never mind, both won't ever read here again, right?
Posted by Geli on January 8, 2011 at 6:28 pm | permalink |
I am sorry you are going through this Penelope. All I truly want to say is that 'everything will be allright', and I mean it. I feel the same way about investing in a career. It's an amazing security that gives confidence. Personal life with a partner can work or not, but atleast we can maintain a roof over our heads, our sanity, and fulfillment, when we have other goals that pull and drive us. I feel, that everything will be allright with your husband, Penelope. Just be patient and give it time. Don't give up yet. Such things happen in relationships. Take good care.
Posted by Harshi on January 8, 2011 at 6:43 pm | permalink |
Just read one of your replies Penelope. You are strong, so open, so enterprising, and yes, you will be fine. I feel much better. I agree that many go through these times. Whenever we can, we can step back to check where we can improve, when things go a bit out of hand. None of us is perfect. I hope you and hubby are back together soon. Warm hugs.
Posted by Harshi on January 8, 2011 at 6:55 pm | permalink |
All I can say is: Think positively.
It's obvious you know what's wrong and have outlined ways to make it better. You are already getting professional help. All external factors are there, but you now need to focus on the internal. Positive thoughts are very powerful and effective. Just think positively and allow good things to happen by not getting/staying frustrated, angry, or upset (I know…easy to say…but breathing deeply helps). Remind yourself of all your happy moments and visualize even better days to come.
I hope you bounce back stronger, not just for yourself, but for your kids as well.
Posted by Nadia on January 8, 2011 at 9:02 pm | permalink |
You're fucking insane.
70% because of the content of this post, and the other 30% for sharing it with the world.
Posted by Piranha on January 9, 2011 at 12:14 am | permalink |
Penelope, here is some practical advice: flash forward 5, 10, 25 years. Consider whether you will have regrets about putting it all out there for the public. It may be cathartic, but its not helping. I hope you can find some peace, truly.
Posted by KP on January 9, 2011 at 1:24 am | permalink |
Oh my god. The way I read it, she's simply writing down the thoughts that many people have but choose not to, or can't, articulate. Fear, anger, insecurity — all things that we are generally programmed to hide so that we do not appear vulnerable. So what? People can't vent on their own blogs?
Posted by Janine on January 9, 2011 at 2:37 am | permalink |
Penelope:
I can't say it will get better. I will not WILL not will NOT try to stand in any judgement of you or myself. All I can say is I get it. I walk around all day in a fugue of anxiety knowing I am different from anyone else I work with, everyone in my married-into family, everyone I try to be friends with, because what goes on in my head and heart don't match up with their outsides. I don't even know how to be fully honest with myself, let alone my therapist. My marriage is hard, my relationship with my stepkids is impossible, I work for the money – I don't even know what a career is anymore. But I come here and whether you are in a good place or a bad place you are so honest. I relate. I relate JUST because you are true to yourself and completely open about it. I don't know if that's good or bad (for you). I relate to the struggles, the feelings, the questions, the brokenness – mostly because right now my own life feels like a directionless shambles – not because yours is, but because you are crystal clear about your experiences when things are a mish-mash – and – when i come here I feel like there is at least one person on this planet who is not afraid to say it all, and it gives me courage to say even a little bit. like i posted a very, very small and nonspecific comment on facebook today about my struggles with ptsd and then agonized about it all night because i know my husband considers that stuff (meaning anything emotional) private and probably my small group of "friends" are all thinking what a loser i am… i love your relentless honesty. it just helps me feel somehow like i'm not disappearing, i'm not alone. i can't really explain it fully. i don't know if you are doing the right thing for yourself, but i know i don't "match up" with what most people think and need and feel and do, and i have a hard time getting advice and most of all any level of real understanding, just a lot of canned bullshit, even though i think what i think and feel is probably not that different, i'm just more willing to acknowledge it, which may be true and maybe isn't, i don't know. i do know my problems are not unique, but not common in my small social circle. My friends, for instance, don't understand constant dissociation. and i don't know what to act on and what not to act on of the ideas in my head. do i smile now? why doesn't anyone get my jokes? is there something wrong with this shirt i'm wearing? i'm convinced everything i do is just wrong regardless of which choice i make. so what i'm trying to say here is i myself am helped by your honesty even though i regret you are suffering, i hope you can find a way to express the unexpressable without breaking any more lamps on your head, i hope blogging helps, be kind to yourself, marriage is damn hard work. and you helped me chill tonight.
Posted by Elena on January 9, 2011 at 5:56 am | permalink |
You will for sure bounce back, P.
I wish you peace and happiness in the new year.
Posted by James Fowlkes on January 9, 2011 at 7:05 am | permalink |
"…each time I had a personal crisis, my career is what helped me rescue myself." I like this; it's true. Here is my version of your story:
http://creativecontentcoaching.com/the-benefits-of-taking-a-break/
Posted by Anne on January 9, 2011 at 12:23 pm | permalink |
That's some article. Your writing is so good–brewed in guilt, steeped in pain, and poured out in anguish. Not all marriages have glass on the floor. Not everyone is so exquisitely sensitive to pain. Not everyone is so irresistible to people who want to heal and fix them until they discover they can't.
I don't give advice, and after reading all of those articles you've written, I might be fascinated, but I don't feel pity, although I feel sorrow. I began to read your articles because I have a client like you–needy, ready to abandon any forward work because change is only a promise of more change, not of resolution. Her life is much like yours–harsh, wonderful, anguished.
She asked me to read a book, and I did. It was about something called Borderline Personality Disorder. She was very ashamed, felt exposed, but I was very relieved when I read it. I understood more, I wasn't so confused, I could be more helpful to her. The book is "The Budda and the Borderline."
I'm not suggesting you read it, like I said, I don't give advice. It's a good book about a topic not a lot of people talk about.
Posted by QuinnCreative on January 9, 2011 at 12:41 pm | permalink |
I originally came to this blog for career advice, and then when it would seem more self-serving, I would back off. What amazes me is this attention seeking and the following. Seems to me the numbers were low, it was time to drive it back up.
You wrote manifests of posts about how the farmer's family could rip him off, and you demanded he stake his claim for the betterment of the relationship.
You write of your vivid success and the money you have made, but can't pay a tax bill, or any bill for that matter.
You claim to have a "wedding" but not a real one because of your tax issues. Your agreement with the farmer is the only valid item I find in your post. Why would he support a live-in with baggage? He is not your children's Father, he is not your legal Husband, and watch and see how quickly that plays out.
I hope this drives the traffic up for you and the saga of your career advice can continue. Unless this is a hoax too.
Posted by Gigi Franks on January 9, 2011 at 8:42 pm | permalink |
In her post where she got arrested, she claimed a salary of $150,000, which probably puts her on the list of the top three highest paid people in Darlington. And yet three months later she doesn't the money to move. Either her money management sucks beyond imagination, or her salary claim is inflated. Left to her readers to decide.
Posted by Brad on January 10, 2011 at 8:55 am | permalink |
Ok, so it is now a week later, how did this all get resolved, or did it? Did you kiss and make up, or is the farmer still at his parents? Subsequent post did not say and I can`t be the only one wondering….
Posted by Helen on January 10, 2011 at 6:32 pm | permalink |
Try to follow your heart not your mind which can really make you happy.
Posted by Campervan Christchurch on January 11, 2011 at 1:01 am | permalink |
How about try fixing your mind so that you can use it when your broken heart tries to keep you from making the right decision at the right time in your life instead…
Posted by ROFLCatDown on January 14, 2011 at 12:45 am | permalink |
As the writer of a blog based on my own journey of personal growth, I was extremely moved by this post. This is the first I have ever read by you, but it made me want to stay. Most people are afraid of revealing themselves to the public (like Paul and Tracy from earlier comments.) But you… YOU, Penelope Trunk, have become an inspiration to many. Myself included.
There was broken glass twice in my household last night during an argument (although no one was hurt during the feud.) There's something calming about the moment something shatters all around you. I don't find it particularly crazy. Simply put: it is a release.
Thank you! I hope things have begun to look up a bit more for you, and I can't wait to dive into more of your posts.
Peace and blessings my friend.
Posted by Tara Seaks on January 12, 2011 at 8:52 pm | permalink |
Crazy has its own set of rules when it comes to a lack of perspective. You have admitted all of these faults about you, and you're threatening to leave him in thought, but when he's had enough of your crazy and wants to sleep elsewhere you "Won't let him".
So far he sounds like the stable ground you need, and you're doing everything you can to avoid having to take responsibility for fixing your personal life. Yeah, bad things happened to you. No, they weren't all your fault. It's still your responsibility to fix.
And, you're dragging your kids into it and using them as some sort of argument tool. That's not right, and they deserve better from you.
There's a difference between you're crazy and you're just trying to be responsible for yourself and you're crazy and you're threatening to drag everyone to hell with you.
I'm married to an abuse survivor. It's taken her a lot of therapy, a lot of pain, and a lot of antidepressants just to get her mostly stable. Even then there are days I come home and I want to call a priest to perform an exorcism.
And you know what I do? I'm the farmer. I simply wait her out until she calms down enough to have a meaningful and productive discussion (even if it is an argument) about how to help her next. But, we talk. Not only that we communicate. I can tell her to stop being a bitch, and she can tell me to stop being an asshole, and you know… That's how we tell the other person that they are being really unreasonable and need to calm the hell down.
You have a man that loves you, who agreed to marry you (even if not quite as a legal standing) knowing that you're crazy. And you can't understand that you're doing wrong by him, yourself, and your kids?
Maybe you need to step back from your career and keeping that together, pay off whatever debts you have, and focus on saving your life. Your real life. Not the you that prattles on about how you wax to feel closer to those you're trying to market to. The you that you need to be in order to get better.
People talk about how watching your diet is important, and exercise is important, and conflict avoidance is important (it isn't), and how all of these things are important. But they never stop to tell you that spending money on helping you cope with your mental health issues is important to simply being able to live. That every dime you spend on therapy and medication is a dedication to living your life in less pain.
As for calling his bluff. You're simply escalating an argument in an attempt to win. If he sets an ultimatum before a talk happens, say OK. Don't call his bluff in order to feel superior. Give a little so that you can actually start the conversation, and hold him to it.
There is nothing in this world that would get me to leave a woman faster than her repeatedly refusing to deal with her shit. So… Deal with your shit… And sweep up the damn glass, it's not a metaphor for anything other than a potential trip to the ER for stitches. If you have to start somewhere, start with cleaning up the messes you make instead of just abandoning them.
Posted by ROFLCatDown on January 14, 2011 at 12:44 am | permalink |
I went to lunch today with a bunch of coworkers and talked about stuff like you mention in your blog. They looked on in shock and horror and were sorry for me. I hated it. They started offering advice. I also hated that. I wanted camraderie, not judgment.
But it came out later, in private with me alone, that they too have similar issues. Just didn't know how to share in the group. They did with me though, because I broke the ice.
When I am doing it, I feel like a pariah, but I do it because of what you said. The world becomes a lonely place if we don't talk about what we are all experiencing. And I refuse to be silenced out of shame. I did that for too long and it ruined me. I'm trying to improve my life now and recognizing and sharing pain is part of that attempt. It may not go swimmingly all the time but it's a hell of a lot better than it WAS. There IS improvement. It DOES matter.
Anyone who makes a judgmental comment about what you write doesn't realize that they are allowing your comments to take them out of their own troubles. If they judge you they don't have to judge themselves. It feels good to feel better than someone else. But no one is, really. Your honesty and vulnerability and bravado helps us tiptoe into ourselves to examine our own rooms of broken glass, and for this, goddamn, I thank you. I don't possibly know how I could thank you enough.
Posted by me on January 14, 2011 at 5:44 pm | permalink |
I would say just one thing!
"Stop Blaming others and realize that the best place to find a helping hand is at the end of your arm; Change yourself; it is always possible"
Best of Luck
Posted by Zain Hameed on January 15, 2011 at 5:08 am | permalink |
Hm… it really seems like you've lost it. Happy balanced people do not smash lamps over their heads. My dad used to punch holes in the wall and that left deep scars mentally for me and my siblings. You should think about the kind of home environment you are creating for your kids.
I think the ultimate irony is that you are dispensing ADVICE of any kind to your readers. People that tries to explains away your incredibly self destructive behavior are trying to pretend their own messed up lives are OK. It's really a pity fest all around and no one is the better for it.
In terms of the farmer wanting to leave you… perhaps you weren't taking your own advice in managing up!
http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2006/05/22/the-importance-of-the-kiss-up/
Posted by Ellen on February 3, 2011 at 6:45 pm | permalink |
The people "explaining away" Penelope's behavior are the ones who are understanding of tough times. Not a single one of us rights it off as "normal," if this thing called normalcy actually exists in the world. We are understanding because we do have messed up lives. I'm glad yours is too perfect to see outside the wall you have obviously built to shield yourself from the pain of life. I hope one day you will gain a better perspective of the world we live in and learn to generate more care for the people living in it with you. We are all in this together.
Posted by Tara on February 3, 2011 at 8:54 pm | permalink |
OH! One more thing. Maybe get a new therapist. I am sorry to say but the one you got simply ain't working!
Posted by Ellen on February 3, 2011 at 6:49 pm | permalink |
Penelope: The reason you can go to the gym everyday, but not control your temper is that one is something you DO. You know it makes you feel better. It's soothing. It's routine. You do it once a day, it's done. Yea!
Those more difficult, constant things:controlling temper, dieting, being organized, watching budget, clutter control…those are things you must NOT DO (shout, eat "bad" foods, be lazy about filing, plan purchases/resist impulse buys/ save when you want to spend, find bargains at yard sales you can't resist. that's constant temptation.
You love your work. You love blogging… so when you SHOULD be working on those constants, you're not, you're doing the easier thing: blogging. You're working on your strengths (good) but ignoring the work your weaknessess need (bad)…
I know all this because I do it too. You're addicted to the feeling of accomplishment writing/blogging/succeeding at work gives you and you do that instead of addressing all the things that can make your personal life more peaceful. You have to set limits on yourself. Sorry if this is redundant advice that you yourself dole out. Your blog is so interesting , if I go and make sure I'm not duplicating all the advice, i've wasted another hour that i should be 1) turning off computer so it doesn't supress melatonin (so that I do sleep well tonite) or 2) cleaning house. (nope no energy for that at 10:49pm) or 3) taking bath, going to bed or 4) relating w/ my husband … typing this comment is so much easier than any of those things…
in short: reap what you sow. they are his hands.
re: getting help… c'mon you KNOW what you need to do. Just do it. giving all your money (one of your problems apparently) to someone to tell you what you know won't change you. only you will change you. eat right. exercise for endorphins. apply the business advice for conflict resolution to your own personal life. I just edited a report on workplace conflict resolution. Read it b/c it will be good ideas for career advice but also addresses your "craziness" at home. Even w/out downloading the (free) report, the advice/tips at this link will remind you what you already know you need to do…but print out the report to read at your leisure, (read yourself to sleep?) OFF the computer…so you can reengage w/ farmer man in peace, not all irritable from too much screen time and because you're too hard on yourself and him. relationships are hard. esp for aspies. be gentle with yourself. http://www.businessmanagementdaily.com/glp/17703/Workplace-Conflict-Resolution.html
Posted by Susan on March 24, 2011 at 10:02 pm | permalink |
P.S. I love your hardwood floors
really. It's a nice picture and photography IS soothing. It's ok. But of course you have to clean it up or your kids will get hurt. And you don't need a visual reminder if you have a photo. that why we take photos…
Posted by Susan on March 24, 2011 at 10:06 pm | permalink |
Wow.
You are crazy, huh.
Seriously, why would you write stuff like intermixed with your job persona and then expect to be taken seriously as some kind of counselor…about anything?
I have read three postings so far, and each one has made me more sure that I would never ask your advice on, well, anything, unless it was how to be crazy. You seem to be really good at that.
Posted by WowYouAreACrazyPerson on March 29, 2011 at 2:00 am | permalink |
Next time, give yourself "electroshock therapy" by dunking your head into REALLY cold water, polar bear plunge-ish. but it can be in a pool or sink or bathtub, better yet a swim. I love the cold water/waves in Maine. Promise you'll feel better afterward (in a healthier way!!)
Posted by Susan on March 29, 2011 at 7:55 am | permalink |
I find it interesting that because an individual has a bad day, an argument with their husband, takes part in harmful behavior to self and then shares the experience-they suddenly are 'crazy' and worthy of judgement.
Everyone has 'crazy' emotional days where they run the gambit of emotions, on occasion. And everyone takes part in self sabotaging behavior. No? Think again.
Tell me you haven't done one of the following when upset: eat a quart of ice cream, though you are overweight or maybe even diabetic. Tied one on at the local bar or even at home alone. To ad to it, maybe you crashed your car, got a dui, or have done something you regret terribly as a result. Maybe you even hit someone or had a one night stand when over wrought with sadness.
Come on folks. Clinton didn't have sex with that woman but he stayed in office and we followed his lead.
The fact is, none of us are perfect, we all have our weaknesses and we all can contribute in a positive way. At least Penelope didn't smash a lamp over her husband's head. Sure, it's extreme but so are drug and alcohol overdoses.
The beauty of Penelope is she sees that ADMITS she has crazy moments, sees the lessons in them, learns from them and then has the guts to share it all with the rest of the world.
I would suspect that anyone calling her too crazy to take advice from, has some skeletons in their own closet.
Go forth Penelope! I find you refreshingly honest and candid. A quality that is hard to find in our uptight society filled with facades.
~Robbin
Posted by Robbin on March 29, 2011 at 8:23 am | permalink |
wow. i love that last comment by robin.
Posted by Susan on March 29, 2011 at 3:50 pm | permalink |
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seen the result of the spell i did with greatokija@yahoo.com… he is real
and genie and i got real results.. never let this mad people online here
pretending to be what they are not get your money anymore.. he gets paid for his
services after he has giving to you what he wanted.. anyone asking for payments
before results is a fake.. its a life time opportunity i have gotten.. never let
it go too..
Posted by williams anita on June 24, 2011 at 10:15 am | permalink |
I absolutely identified with the broken glass. When we have those big, blow-out fights, I throw things. And those things tend to leave big marks on my walls.
Posted by Gena on July 25, 2011 at 3:36 pm | permalink |
The Forest Path
The safest place is in the forest on a path bordering the ocean. Tall fir and cedar trees capture the breeze and fill my ears with a gentle, soothing sound; the fir needles drop from the sky and have created a soft cushion for my bare feet as I slowly walk in this familiar place. It rained in the morning and now at mid-day I choose a dry place to sit. I see the sun shine through the trees and watch rainbow sparkles through water droplets hanging on ferns for a moment before they drop heavy to the soft ground near where I am seated.
I smell cedar and indescribable scents of the forest vapors drying from the earlier rain. This place fills my senses and I am safe here in the forest on a path bordering the ocean.
Closing my eyes, I listen, smell and feel the warmth of the sun on my shoulders, the back of my head and down my spine. I notice how safe and comforted I feel, grateful that I have unlimited time to spend here in this place.
I breathe calmly in through my nose and exhale through my mouth. The calm and serenity are interrupted by a thought of a person, place or thing I lost or neglected or abused. More thoughts remove me from the safety I felt moments ago. My shoulders tighten. I am thinking now rather than sensing. I want to smoke and I fear the day will be filled with negativity, negative thinking, and remorse, a desire to escape through sleep or get so bad that I will lose all sanity and think about substance abuse. I feel panicky, my heart races and blood pressure rises. I pace and I am no longer at peace in the forest.
I can choose to return to a place of peace and safety by first making a decision that I would rather feel safety and comfort rather than fear and isolation. I just have to remember to breathe and to activate my senses. I notice all the beauty around me â and I sense how it feels in my body to be safe in the forest. I close my eyes, breathe and remember what my body senses when it is at peace in the forest. I sense, imagine and feel rather than think thoughts in my head.
When I am fully calm, when my body is calm and relaxed, I can safely hold a scary thought in my hands, wrap it in beautiful paper and ribbons, and tell it, "Not Now â But Later I Am Certain to Be Ready to Look at Thisâ¦." I carry it to my stainless steel, ¾"-thick, 55-gallon barrel drum, and place it inside, closing and locking the hatch. If, while I am still safe, other scary thoughts arise, I can do the same thing with them.
The scary thoughts and deeds are in the barrel drum. While they are there, my unconscious and a Power Greater Than Myself knows they are there and I am becoming willing to do what is necessary to heal, to work the steps, to experience, learn, and become free. When that Power Greater Than Myself knows that I am ready to take a package out of the barrel, I will be instructed to do so, or That Power will gently and miraculously place it in my path of daily living and I will know that I am ready to heal â the tools will be there and I will be ready. I will find a beautiful opportunity to grow through it. Once healed I will be free from the fear and negativity of it and have something wonderful to share with others: The Third Step Prayer says, "Take away my difficulties that victory over them will bear witness to others of thy glory, thy love and thy way of lifeâ¦"
I will be healed and will assist in the healing of others by visiting the forest path bordering the ocean as often as I can.
Posted by BeachP on August 27, 2011 at 3:15 pm | permalink |
I'm sorry but this blog isn't helping you or anyone else. You're over-thinking and over-sharing. Just clean up the mess and keep it simple. Do one thing at a time.
Posted by Davidl on September 13, 2011 at 7:14 pm | permalink |
Penelope-
You are not great at earning it and bad at managing it.
You don't make as much as you might. You don't make all that much at all. You are great at revenue, bad at net net bottom line. If you're even great at revenue. I'm guessing that's not the case.
I deluded myself for ever. You are great at that. And it's not all bad. HAving a story to telll is not all bad.
Posted by Chris Johnson on September 29, 2011 at 11:00 pm | permalink |
Wow. Just read this. You're really very crazy Penelope but it's OK. You are loved anyway. Much loved. But you have an addiction that developed by no fault of your own. An addiction to turmoil/ drama/ trauma, whatever you want to call it. It's like any other addiction. Everyone is troubled in one way or another but how you react to that trouble in your life is what defines you. You're addicted to wild reactivity. I'm not being at all accusatory (I have my own addictions). I'm only saying it in case it helps to see something more clearly. We're all trying our best in this life. And I promise, lots and lots of love is flowing your way.
Posted by Rhetormaniac on October 13, 2011 at 9:54 pm | permalink |
You should have taken pictures of the gash in your head.
Posted by Salemskc on October 23, 2011 at 8:14 am | permalink |
About the farmer's hands:
To give skin some moisture with something that is more medical-seeming than girly, get a 99-cent bottle of glycerin from the drugstore, mix it with water in the ratio recommended on the label, and apply to the skin a couple of times a day, especially after washing the skin & while it's still wet.
It's not a feminine sort of beauty product. It's pretty much "neutral". Glycerin is clear, it's runny, it tastes faintly sweet but that's all – no odor or anything, it's safe, it's a pharmacy kind of product, it's old-fashioned, it's simple, and one bottle lasts forever. It draws moisture to the skin and wards away dryness.
I use it on my lips, because my lips had become sensitive to so many things and I was having constant chelitis. The flaking problems are about 20% still there, but the glycerin-water mix twice a day does a LOT to improve their condition.
Posted by m on December 21, 2011 at 1:15 pm | permalink |
I want to thank AYELALA SHRINE SPELL TEMPLE. After 4 days my ex-girlfriend of 1 two years came back in tears. I used spell from ayelalashrine@gmail.com and maintained a strong faith that we could be together. I was prepared to lose her forever if that's what it took. I am a better boyfriend and she is a better girlfriend. I guess that despite the break-up pain, it had to happen to make things better for the future. I am so very happy with the outcome of the spell and I want to congratulate ayelalashrine@gmail.com on the excellence of his spiritual work. Thanks a lot again, DOERA
Posted by doera on January 21, 2012 at 11:52 pm | permalink |