I wake up Wednesday at 4am to a phone call: The Guardian, in London, asking for an interview about my miscarriage twitter. Then a half-hour later, an Irish radio station. And then the phone kept ringing.
I tell Now Magazine (I think it’s basically People magazine for the UK audience) to call back after I got the kids off to school. I ask my housemanager to come early because I can't handle the sleep deprivation and the early-morning interviews and school lunches all in one morning.
I block out the morning to write a thousand-word essay for the Guardian to justify tweeting about my miscarriage. Which the Guardian wants done in the next 20 hours.
Now magazine wants to know if they can send a photographer to take a photo of my kids.
No.
Or the Farmer?
No.
What about if their faces are blurred?
No. (But this at least makes the Farmer laugh.)
The Today show called Tuesday to see if I could be on the show on Thursday. I said yes. They call in between the Guardian and Now magazine to ask if I can fly there.
The first thing I think is that my kids were so sad that I was not taking them to school as usual that I promised to pick them up after school, and I don’t want to break the promise.
The only reasonable flight to NYC is at 3:08. I decide that the only thing to do is take my kids with me. I can’t bear to simply be gone when they come home from school. I did that so much last year. I don’t want to do that anymore.
So I tell the Today Show that I can make it only if they will fly my kids and the nanny with me. And pay for two hotel rooms.
The Today Show says yes. They start booking tickets. I finish interviews and the nanny starts packing. She calls the school to get the kids ready to leave early. She cancels violin lessons and cello lessons and a reading tutor.
I call the Farmer to offer him one last chance to go with us. He doesn’t answer. He doesn’t take the offer seriously because it is so far from anything he’d ever do. He says he can’t believe I’m taking the kids on a trip again when the last business trip I took them on turned out so bad that the police came.
He has a point, but I tell him that I’m taking the nanny along this time.
Then the new CEO of Brazen Careerist calls. He’s concerned. I have given a one-hour interview with a tabloid that was not recorded and it’s being taken out of context all over the UK.
So we have a two-hour phone call about the Brazen Careerist brand. Should it be tied to me? Is miscarriage a workplace issue? What drives people to sign up at Brazen Careerist anyway?
Wait. Can you just go sign up at the site right now so the CEO can see that a post like this does not hurt the brand and I should just write what I want on my blog?
Okay. So the nanny is decked-out in black, with blown-out blond hair, and she almost looks a little New-York-y for her first-ever visit there, when the Today show calls to say they need to move me to Saturday.
Really?
This is what I thought: Is there enough time for me to get really drunk on junk wine in the fridge before I have to go pick up the kids?
I say no to Saturday.
Later, I get a death threat. This is not new. I have been getting death threats all month but today’s death threats are different. They are from the UK, and then from the Australian Christian Coalition. No kidding. Three calls in a row.
This all might be the end of me catering to mainstream media. But. Wait. I’m so happy to be in Inc magazine this month where Max Chafkin wrote a great list of top bloggers. And Max was so easy to deal with. He scheduled a call. We had a nice conversation. And he wrote an intelligent article. He’s so good, and considerate that he’s almost like a blogger.
But for now, I’m exhausted. And I am thinking that dealing with mainstream media just isn’t worth it. I get my own story out, the way I want it, on my blog. I have a smart, engaged audience that is fun to talk to and, when there’s something really good, they tell their smart, thoughtful friends. I don’t think I need mainstream media. And I know I don’t need the ridiculous way they've been talking with me.
(Hi, Penelope Trunk? This is Steve from the early show –
What? What early show?
It's the morning show on CBS.
Oh.
Can you tell me how you justify your tweet?
What?
Just quickly. I’m going into our 4pm meeting and I need a summary of your position.)
So, mainstream media, here's my position. More than feeling compelled to justify myself to your audience, I feel compelled to protect my schedule and my family from your intrusive calls and seemingly random deadlines. I feel an urgent need to separate a sane online conversation about women at work from an insane media that is doing exactly what destroys women at work: Making it extremely difficult for me to have a manageable schedule for parenting.









I found you via the Guardian, and I'm going to write to thank them, because I think you're brilliant. Refreshingly open gobbed about what many other women are thinking but too frightened to say.
Posted by kate on 11/06/2009 at 01:55am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I was writing to say the same thing. Thank you for your honesty & courage & writing skills!
Posted by tara on 11/06/2009 at 05:40pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I have been following your blog for the past year, don't always agree with what you say but love your honesty and sincerity in sharing your thoughts here. I am so glad that The Guardian has brought you to the UK.
Posted by Britt Yip on 2009-11-08 18:55:40 | (Comments wont nest below this level)
Good on you for your Guardian article. Brilliant. Thankyou for having the courage to tell it like it is. Why should women have to hide this stuff in shame? Says who? No-one I'd have any respect for, that's who.
x
Posted by Rae on 11/06/2009 at 02:09am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Sounds like a juggling act that Penn and Teller could never top. Also sounds like you are doing a good job at doing your job. Your little twitter has added a huge flake to the snowball of feminist chatter I hear in the halls on campus and I wanted to thank you for that.
Posted by B. Rodriguez on 11/06/2009 at 02:13am | permalink | Reply to this comment
It's amazing how smoothly the phrase, "stuff yourselves" can come to the fore when people are rude and anonymous. It's also remarkably freeing. I recommend it highly. "Hey, wannabe-mainstream media, stuff yourselves, ok?"
Practice it, it's much easier after just a few reps. Believe me.
Posted by Turtle on 11/06/2009 at 02:33am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I saw this story blowing up on the mainstream media, and then the barrage of venomous comments, and wondered why well over a month after you posted that it flared up. It made me feel relieved too not to live with such hate gnawing at my soul. I read this first on your blog when you wrote about it. I think your Guardian article was excellent but beyond that I'd leave the mainstream media well alone on this issue. I used to work in it and can't bear it any more. They will do what they want. You're right, your kids don't need you to further engage with it, and you don't either.
Posted by MJ on 11/06/2009 at 02:42am | permalink | Reply to this comment
It's so ridiculous. People harp on dishonesty all the time but the truth is, they don't want real honesty. Real honesty can be ugly to some people. In their own hearts, they are afraid they might have felt the same things. They're just not big enough to admit it.
A-holes.
Posted by BB on 11/06/2009 at 02:51am | permalink | Reply to this comment
loved your Guardian piece!
Posted by LZ on 11/06/2009 at 03:04am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope,
The clue is in the Now byline: you're a celebrity. Congratulations!
This means that the rabid UK tabloid press will see you, and your family, as fair game. Assuming for a moment that you don't want to follow Katie Price down that well trodden route (http://twitter.com/misskatieprice), you might want to take some advice.
However, The Daily Mail (ugh! http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html) picked it up a couple of days ago and it isn't all over the press and TV here today, so you may have got away with it.
Even if not, I can't see that this would damage your website. The sort of people you are looking for will be well aware of the media circus. And the Guardian (once upon a time the Manchester Guardian – NEVER the London Guardian, even though it is now run form London) is a high end, intelligent paper (equivalent to the New York Times) many of whose readership would enjoy and add value to BrazenCareerist.
Good luck! And thank you for your provocative, profound and moving blog.
Posted by TwistedByKnaves on 11/06/2009 at 03:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
In the Guardian you wrote: "I didn't think about any of this when I wrote my tweet."
Wouldn't it be more accurate to write "I didn't think." ?
Twitter is the great dumbing down of humanity. It is the immediate emotional taking precedence over the time to think. It is the egoism of believing that one's every thought must be relayed to millions around the world.
Have a miscarriage; fine. Be pleased about it; no problem. But spare the rest of the world from your thoughts about the subject. You were lucky this time – people want to talk about it – but that's just a fluke. Most twitter is the intellectual equipment of vomit. Ideas empty of value that empty minds throw out into the cyber world.
The next time you want to twitter on any subject, stop and really think. Why am doing this? What are the implications for my life and those around me? Is this something that I will be proud to have done ten, twenty, thirty years from now? Then make the decision whether to hit the keys or not.
Congratulations on the miscarriage if that's what you wanted. My sympathy on the compulsion to twitter.
Posted by twitterfree on 11/06/2009 at 03:23am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I am baffled by this comment.
I fail to see how posting a comment on a blog post is any different to posting a comment on twitter. Both are "relayed to millions around the world" on the internet.
If Penelope's twittering about her miscarriage is an example of "the immediate emotional taking precedence over the time to think" I don't see how expressing this kind of opinion about Twitter could not also be an example of this. Statements such as: "Most twitter is the intellectual equipment of vomit. Ideas empty of value that empty minds throw out into the cyber world." seem to me to be expressing a personal, emotional position. Which is fine but the author of the comment does not seem to acknowledge that others have a comparable right to express themselves as they see fit.
I am not in a position to know whether in thirty years' time, Penelope will be reading her past blog posts in regret. The point is moot however, since irrespective of how she might come to feel about her writing, it is clear to me from people's reactions and my own that she has enabled a platform for discussion and thought on a number of issues worth considering.
Posted by pp on 11/08/2009 at 05:43am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Please could you stop referring to the Guardian as the London Guardian.
You have done this before and were corrected (politely) by a number of commenters. The Guardian is not, nor has it ever been a London newspaper. It is national, and started in Manchester.
Repeating this mistake distracts from the substance of your post.
Posted by James on 11/06/2009 at 03:27am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Loved your Guardian article, but can't believe this is even an issue for anyone. It's been a real eye-opener for me.
Congratulations on missing the point, 'twitterfree'. :)
Posted by IJ on 11/06/2009 at 03:27am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Death threats?? Well that's it. No more snarky comments from me, even though I will always think you're pretty much nuts (that doesn't count.)
Hope you find peace.
Posted by Brad on 11/06/2009 at 03:29am | permalink | Reply to this comment
You BELIEVE her?? Why? She lies chronically.
Posted by john on 11/07/2009 at 11:42am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I found it difficult to read your article in the Guardian but ultimately your honesty and candour convinced me.
When I first saw the story break, I just presumed "there goes another attention-seeking new-media-knows-no-barriers wierdo" but now I'd defend you to anyone who talks about the story.
Posted by Matthew Cain on 11/06/2009 at 03:40am | permalink | Reply to this comment
This story has generated such shock purely for one reason: people in modern society are not able to talk about their real emotions. This is forbidden. And it's just too much for an average brain, to open to that extend… Therefore, they fear what they cannot understand (purely because of their limitations). I personally think that everyone has the right to express themselves in the way they want, and social boundaries set today are just… Silly sometimes. Honesty isn't a value any more. All that one has to do is to hide behind a mask, to function well in the world which takes the truth as the most painful thing.
Posted by Wojtek on 11/06/2009 at 03:49am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I can understand the death threats only because I explained your twitter reveal to some colleagues ( We are all in Australia). Their immediate reactions were shock and knee jerk outrage. I then explained what the bigger issues were. The fact that miscarriage is so very common that it is a workplace issue and that even though abortion is legal in some states in the US there are people who make it nearly impossible to exercise that right. My colleagues immediate reactions rapidly turned to understanding and support for the purpose of your twitter message. Perhaps you have an opportunity to make alot more people understand what is at stake here.
I think you show a lot of courage even if you stay at home with your kids.
Posted by Heather on 11/06/2009 at 04:39am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Good on you, Penelope.
It's sad, but sadly not surprising, how much unpleasantness this has attracted. I think a lot of people are very reluctant to comprehend that there is not just one 'correct' reaction to either a pregnancy or the loss of a pregnancy. But the reinforcing of those stereotypes is an insidious form of social control. We need people who are unafraid to speak about the reality.
Best wishes.
Posted by Eleanor on 11/06/2009 at 04:59am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Australian Christian Coalition – way to embarrass your country and religion.
On behalf of normal Australians – sorry. And thanks for your blog.
Posted by Craig on 11/06/2009 at 05:10am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Good on you. I read your piece for the Guardian and your most recent blog, and I agree with everything you say, and fully support your right to talk about your life and the events in it, wherever, whenever and however you like. The more open we are about miscarriages, abortion and whatever else the idiots out there think we should shut up about, the better.
Posted by Pauline Brown on 11/06/2009 at 06:26am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Read the Guardian piece, very good and eye-opening. Thanks for being honest and well, this is what public forums are for, talking about everything, even something like miscarriages. Sadly the nutjobs will always be with us. Best of luck.
Posted by SC on 11/06/2009 at 06:45am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Bravo. To be asked by a reporter to explain the thought process behind deciding to tweet/blog about a topic? yes. But to be asked to "justify" your tweet/blog posts? no way.
Posted by K. Martens on 11/06/2009 at 07:12am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hi, read your article in the Guardian and agree completely that making certain subjects and words taboo don't do women – or anyone for that matter – any favours. You should Tweet about whatever you want. Well done for facing the storm so well.
Posted by Ana on 11/06/2009 at 07:14am | permalink | Reply to this comment
That was a very straightforward message which reassures me two things:
1. We own the (new) media.
2. The old media is not doing enough to save themselves (or maybe accelerating the trend)
On a different note the whole incident makes me scary, because after reading this article I would discount articles written in the aforementioned media, especially when the topic is related to twitter or miscarriage. Unfair, of course, but I think it will happen even subconsciously.
I believe you are the one who is doing what is best for you and your family, no matter what they say.
Posted by Isao on 11/06/2009 at 07:16am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Thank you for your honesty and courage, Penelope. Some people will never get it. That's their loss.
Posted by Heidi on 11/06/2009 at 07:17am | permalink | Reply to this comment
There is one reason – one reason only – why I am an avid follower of Penelope Trunk and Brazen Careerist. It is her honesty. Her unabashed talent for telling it like it is, with no sugar coating. I applaud Ms. Trunk's courage in posting about this time in her life honestly. Hang in there, Penelope. This will all blow over, eventually.
Posted by Jessica Hughey on 11/06/2009 at 07:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
P.S. I went and signed up at Brazen Careerist just now. Take that, CEO. Penelope is helping women with her honesty and openness, not hurting some "brand."
Posted by Heidi on 11/06/2009 at 07:23am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I learned my lesson regarding mainstream media quite recently (though obviously not to the extent you have) when a major news network asked permission to come to my home and interview me about my past spending problems. They had read an article I'd written for Tango, about how being married made me realize that the bad decisions I made affected not just me, but also my husband and our future together. My article explained my thought process, and how I was able to move past my problems.
The short clip that appeared on TV was not nearly as thoughtful. Rather, it was sensationalist, and unhelpful to others who might have been experiencing the same problem.
I'm with you. It's a luxury to be able to control how we are portrayed, using blogs or even appearing live on a radio show (no time for editing!). Perhaps it's best to avoid the mainstream media, unless there is the chance it can extend our brand in a way that is helpul.
Posted by stephanerd on 11/06/2009 at 07:29am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hi Penelope,
I am a young head strong woman who is currently trying to make it in my career, which does involve the mainstream media. I began blogging about a year and a half ago and unfortunately mine does not remotely compare. I am very inspired by your blogg and the messages that you portray through it. And as for those of you that feel the need to be rude, critical and down right pigheaded about the miscarriage tweet, have you not got better things to do with your time?! Nothing stops nature, and if someone wishes to talk about it why not? Doesn't change the end outcome…
Your blogg has just gained another reader.
Posted by Natalie on 11/06/2009 at 07:32am | permalink | Reply to this comment
also noticed went a bit g crazy there *Blog
Posted by Natalie on 11/06/2009 at 07:34am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I really boils down to we as women as still in many ways encouraged to be seen and not heard. Good for you for being open and honest. To go through life with blinders on and think that these things don't happen is ridiculous! So what if you made some folks uncomfortable? Discomfort spurs change, education and understanding as we search for our own personal truths. I have always and continue to find you thought-provoking, insightful, and sometimes amusing. Rock on sister!
Posted by Snyder95 on 11/06/2009 at 07:34am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Not to be obvious, but isn't it called "BRAZEN Careerist" not "Wimpy Careerist" or "Lockstep Careerist"? I think you are living and embodying the brand.
I had a miscarriage and of course it happened at work. Based on television, I thought it happened and was over – I didn't know that it can take weeks for a miscarriage to fully occur. I told my whole department (so they'd know why I was weird) and was really open with almost everyone. It made people really uncomfortable, but that was about them – not about me. Good for you for exposing a topic that doesn't get talked about.
Posted by Barchbo on 11/06/2009 at 07:40am | permalink | Reply to this comment
actually… the correct definition would be
Narcissist
[n] – someone in love with him or herself.
And maybe, if women in general were a little more narcissistic, we wouldn't be apologizing all the time and giving away our own rights to be happy.
So, I say? Narcissism ftw.
Posted by MaryKate on 11/06/2009 at 09:26am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Narcissist
[n] – someone in love with themselves
Posted by Erica Mani on 11/06/2009 at 08:09am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I like your new attitude. You have the power. They want to interview you. They can do it on your schedule or skip it. And, lets face it, the main stream media is interested because it's controversial and a bit juicy-gossipy. The media needs conflict — this generates it. Death threats? their dream as it creates a new juicy story.
Also, the sudden new interest in your tweeted miscarriage from two months ago strikes me as a "slow news day" moment. As soon as something else interesting happens (shootings at a military base, for example), they'll drop you. You don't need to rearrange your schedule and your children's lives to help the mainstream media fill in a "slow news day." They can come to you.
Posted by Wendy on 11/06/2009 at 08:10am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Best.Post.Ever.
This is why I am crazy about you and think you're brilliant. If anyone there questions whether your name should be tied to the Brazen Careerist brand they need to check themselves. YOU are the Brazen Careerist brand. You are about teaching people to live their lives on their own terms–and that includes their careers.
Anyone else would be falling all over themselves trying to get on the Today show. They'd have the nanny explain to the kids that mommy had to go on a really important TV show and that she'll call them tonight. Because other women are scared to do what you do: make demands for anything. Women are supposed to fall over in gratitude anytime anyone wants to interview them and they're supposed to jump through hoops to make it happen on the other guy's time. They're supposed to settle for whatever anyone offers them in the workplace, and be scared to mention their kids for fear of not being taken seriously as a career woman or whatever.
Everyone in the world goes crazy when Dooce uses her influence to get a free dryer for a women's shelter. You're using your influence to empower women to not apologize every single day of their lives for stuff like having a miscarriage at work or the fact that they should have the right to choose abortion in Wisconsin, and on their own time-frame rather than the state's.
Posted by Maggie McGary on 11/06/2009 at 08:11am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Bravo!!! Well said, Maggie!
Posted by Jessica Hughey on 11/06/2009 at 08:22am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope Trunk is the Brazen Careerist brand.
Posted by Jay Godse on 11/06/2009 at 10:39am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Right on Sister Suffragette!
Posted by Jodi on 11/06/2009 at 08:22am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I also found you via the Guardian and wanted to offer support. You seem to me to be a very sane person with a compassionate and courageous take on life – props to you and your kids.
Posted by Kim on 11/06/2009 at 08:35am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Yeah, sane people change their names six times, blog about their husband's sexual inadequacies and child's conditions, lie openly on their resumes, write online porn and play beach volleyball and claim they are serial entrepreneurs who have founded either two or three companies depending on which online lie you come across, and always decline to name those companies even when someone meets you at a workshop and asks you point blank.
Posted by Neville on 11/08/2009 at 02:10am | permalink | Reply to this comment
As always, sheer brilliance.
Posted by Shannon Nelson on 11/06/2009 at 08:41am | permalink | Reply to this comment
You are awesome. What a courageous, sane, dignified stance you're taking on behalf of your life, your family, and the lives of many women–all while pointing out why mainstream media is not only losing its monopoly but why it can be downright destructive.
The death threats. Ugh. That makes me cringe and feel sorry all over again.
Posted by Joselle on 11/06/2009 at 08:46am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hang in there, P.
Posted by GenerationXpert on 11/06/2009 at 08:49am | permalink | Reply to this comment
This is why you rock my world. Kick. Ass.
Posted by Beckie on 11/06/2009 at 08:50am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Just read your article in the Guardian. Eloquent, honest and compassionate. Thank you. Ever so.
I've never submitted a comment to anything before … all the best Penelope.
Posted by Toni on 11/06/2009 at 09:04am | permalink | Reply to this comment
What can I say Penelope? You tell 'em.
Posted by J (the regular) on 11/06/2009 at 09:06am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hello again, fascinated to read that you have Asperger Syndrome. My son has it (I score pretty high for it too), and it made me wonder if it is partly that that makes you so straightforward and honest, and perhaps a little part of what made you tweet about your miscarriage (for which I applaud you, it's not in any way a criticism). My son has a tendency to 'blurt', which is sometimes good, sometimes bad. I'd be fascinated to hear your thoughts about it.
Posted by Pauline Brown on 11/06/2009 at 09:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I signed up on Brazen Careerist *just* because of your blog today. Go you! Go me! I appreciate your openness, your integrity and your dedication to the cause of women. Keep up the great blog and the great website!
Posted by MaryKate on 11/06/2009 at 09:21am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I appreciated your tweet, I appreciate your blog, and I think that you should stay associated with Brazen Careerist. We women are now a major part of the workforce, and we should be able to talk about our lives openly. Thanks.
Posted by MP on 11/06/2009 at 09:21am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Go You!!! Keep it up.
Posted by Jennifer Lynn on 11/06/2009 at 10:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
You are not a slave to the media, Penelope. Just keep being you and stop justifying your statements. All it takes is a look at your blog to see you say what's on your mind. The rest of the world can shove it. We need more women like you.
Posted by Winter on 11/06/2009 at 10:51am | permalink | Reply to this comment
If it is any comfort to you I first heard this story break on this blog. Ditto for the miscarriage story. I guess I'm just one of those people who opens up the blog reader before turning on the TV. I find the content from my favourite bloggers to be much more insightful than that from most TV news shows. (My favourite bloggers are Paul Graham, Seth Godin, Kathy Sierra, Laura Ries, Bob Sutton, me and of course, Penelope Trunk).
I think your best response would have been to offer a video interview from your living room, your company offices, or from a video conferencing studio in Madison. There is no reason for you to disrupt half a week just so CBS can get 5 minutes of filler. I sure that the 70 million Americans who don't live in New York or its suburbs but watch the show would understand.
If "Steve from the Early Show" wants a summary of your position, he can get it pretty easily from a half-dozen of your blog postings. Your themes and motivations are very consistent.
Posted by Jay Godse on 11/06/2009 at 11:03am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Your Guardian article is very inspiring. I think that women like you who are so completely at comfort with themselves should be honored, not ridiculed.
Posted by rawnaeris on 11/06/2009 at 11:16am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I began reading your blog long before you ever sent the-tweet-heard-'round-the-world and I find your writing eloquent and your points valid. I also work for a corporation and recently had a miscarriage at work. Sadly, because of the culture at aforementioned corporation, I was not able to speak of the miscarriage at work in any context other than to inform the (male) manager. He made some bizarre and vaguely insulting comments on my attitude and asked me why I was not calling an ambulance. It was difficult for me to pretend, with a smile, that everything "was business as usual" while I suffered secretly in my cubicle.
Although my situation is slightly different in that my pregnancy was intended, I honestly applaud you for being so forward about your experiences. I am excited to see that, in some part of the universe, people can speak of sensitive subjects sensibly and I am proud to be among your readership.
Posted by Courtney on 11/06/2009 at 11:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Thank you for writing this, Courtney.
I really appreciate all the comments in this string. Thoughtful and supportive and of course, really nice to read.
But what a lot of us are saying, I think, is that we hope this leads to more honest, discussion. So it's nice, in all of the hoop-la, to see Courtney's example of what I think we'd all hope for going forward – a genuine discussion of the complicated nature of being a real person at a real office.
Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on 11/06/2009 at 12:46pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Actually this post does make me slightly less likely to sign up for the Brazen Careerist site. Not because of the miscarriage article at the Guardian though; that is fine.
But it's not really that professional to turn your blog into a rant against the unprofessional treatment you feel you received from certain members or organizations in the media sector. There is a way to be personal at work or discuss personal issues at work that is meaningful and interesting and often I think you do that very well.
But launching a screed on an entire industry – the very industry that could help you reach more members for your site – is not that smart when it comes to promoting your brand. And I'm not sure I really respect a brand that relies on someone to raise their profile who is willing to publicly trash organizations to do it. Did you talk to the producers about your issues? Did you attempt to resolve your concerns? Did you ask about why the tight deadlines? Did you treat those people with the respect that you would like to have if someone is having an issue with your organization or service?
A rant will get attention and traffic, in the same way that you complain there is a sensationalist aspect to coverage about your tweet.
But IMO it's not a very classy way to build a brand.
Even though Twitter and Facebook and your blog are good promotional tools and even reasonable tools for disseminating information, they aren't necessarily bastions of credibility. And sure, many MSM outlets also have credibility issues – but not as large as Twitter, etc. Your "about me" blurb definitely leverages your MSM columns in order to establish credibility.
So when you turn around and trash the entire MSM, to me it says you've lost sight of real networking and real people beyond the blogosphere. No, not everyone influencial in every — or even most — industries reads blogs or has a Twitter account or even cares. I want to build a career in the real world, not as a Twitter junkie. if Brazen Careerist wants to be that point, I hope they take their brand management a little more seriously. Right now, I can't see becoming a part of this particular community as reflecting well on me as a professional.
Anyways, yes, I think your CEO has a point about whether you should just say what you like or not, if you're seriously representing the company.
Posted by Shandra on 11/06/2009 at 12:22pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope Trunk is the brand of Brazen Careerist. As soon as the new CEO changes that, the company just becomes another social network. (yawn)
I didn't hear of Penelope from the mainstream media. Furthermore, I have not ever seen her on mainstream media.
If you want to get exposure through mainstream media, you need a concentrated blitz over the major talk shows for a period of 2 weeks. She wasn't doing that. It was just filler.
Posted by Jay Godse on 11/07/2009 at 10:09am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Shandra,
I think you're missing the whole "brazen" brand of Brazen Careerist. Brazen Careerist isn't about conventionalism, it's about being bold, taking the unchartered road, and making your own way.
Mainstream media was unreasonable in their requests and they treated a potential story (Penelope)like dirt. Don't get the mistaken idea this was some "favor" they were doing, that Penelope was being "graced" by their exposure. The media makes their money from stories like this, and, if they want to continue bringing them in, they'd better start treating people with respect. Mainstream should realize we're no longer dependent upon them for exposure. People today can create their own.
And that is what Brazen Careerest is all about.
PS. Looks like the CEO also doesn't recognize the Brazen Careerist brand. I'd seriously question his/her capabitilies if he can't even do that. Get with it, dude.
Posted by rennie on 11/08/2009 at 03:19pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
That's the thing, S, there was no "turn around". From the getgo, the MSM proved themselves to be rude (yes, time zones are a reality), incompetent (a little research/reading would have revealed the "justification" for the Tweet), and fickle (drop everything and fly out now…no, wait, maybe tomorrow).
Then you ask why she didn't attempt to resolve these things. Why is that Penelope's responsibility? She weighed the unpleasant interactions against what she had to gain and decided it wasn't worth it. Her branding is rooted in honesty, self-loyalty, and the realities of being a powerful businesswoman. If she'd pandered, that really might've damaged her brand. If these folks wanted to redeem the relationship, it was up to them. Meanwhile, Penelope's blog continues to flourish in a way that's in keeping with her brand.
So, if MSM is tanking, it's not because Penelope is making unfounded accusations. It's not relevant, and it's not worth the hoop-jumping. If this rampant disrespect is the face of MSM, I can only sympathize with the folks at Inc who are trying to keep the slime off of the biz.
Posted by Dree on 11/10/2009 at 02:51pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope,
Maybe it's time you hire a PR rep for yourself ;)
Posted by Kathrine on 11/06/2009 at 12:22pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I re-discovered your blog during the whole abortion brouhaha and promptly signed up to follow your blog. As a woman and a business owner, I can't tell you how much I appreciate your honesty. I don't always agree with you point of view; however, you are a wonderful example to those of us constantly worried about how authentic we can afford to be in our professional lives. While your detractors seem to be rather vocal, know that there are many of us out there attracted to you for the exact reasons you are being vilified. So, THANK YOU and keep up the great work!
Rose
Posted by Rose Jeudi on 11/06/2009 at 12:24pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I think it is pure silliness for anyone to imply that your candor and honesty is somehow inconsistent with the Brazen Careerist brand. I so appreciate that you are willing to discuss the challenging things that all working women face every single day of their lives. Women have often pretended that everything is always fine so as not to make others uncomfortable. I am seven months pregnant and every day I pretend like my hemorrhoids are not killing me, that I'm perfectly happy to trek to others' faraway offices for meetings, that it's no problem to work on a project from home while I have the fucking swine flu, that it's a piece of cake to make it to 7:00 a.m. meetings looking fabulous when I really had to get ready by candlelight so as not to wake up my kids before I left. The shit women have to go through to be successful in their careers so surpasses that of men that it's ridiculous. So for people to get soooo upset that a woman actually had the nerve to mention the personal difficulty she was dealing with one day while at work just really pisses me off.
Posted by Casey on 11/06/2009 at 12:54pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
You're absolutely right. This is one of the big challenges that working women face, and I'm so glad that you've publicly commented upon it.
Posted by Mneiae on 11/06/2009 at 12:57pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
BAM!! You nailed this one – great job P
Posted by Siri on 11/06/2009 at 01:11pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Good afternoon
I've become accustomed to how you mix your personal and professional life and I wouldn't think of asking you to be any other way. I am cautious though when I start seeing posts from people that feel you are somehow a representative of things they agree with and yet wouldn't do themselves. I would rather hear their own personal stories of empowerment and if they can use you as a jumping off point then you are definitely doing something right. I guess what I'm saying is while you set a good example I wouldn't set you up to be an icon. With that said I can't wait to read another post that shows you coming into your own.
Posted by Shelly on 11/06/2009 at 01:24pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
"… here's my position. … I feel compelled to protect my schedule and my family from your intrusive calls and seemingly random deadlines. I feel an urgent need to separate … from an insane media that is … Making it extremely difficult for me to have a manageable schedule for parenting."
QUOTED FOR TRUTH. Because you said it better than I ever could have. Calling you at 0400 is absolutely beyond the pale. Ludicrous. People who engage in global business learn to be acutely aware of global time-frames, and 0400 is simply not done without prior agreement.
And the whole bit about your kids and your family. SO GLAD to see you finally having the self-confidence to say "oh hell no, I am not disrupting my family for you people. You want me, take me on my own terms." GOOD FOR YOU!!
Posted by Editormum on 11/06/2009 at 02:04pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I think it was 4 pm, unless I read it wrong – to be fair.
Posted by Shandra on 11/06/2009 at 02:38pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Nope. It was 4 AM. I cannot believe anyone would call at such a time.
Posted by sophie on 2009-11-06 20:31:28 | (Comments wont nest below this level)
You write very well and in a composed manner for dealing with such media insanity. Not ever having to deal with that before, it would make me completely frazzled! You're doing a lot for women by continuing to write your blog and standing up for yourself and your beliefs. Thank you.
Posted by Amanda on 11/06/2009 at 02:15pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
So how does a death threat over the phone sound? "Hi Penelope, this is X, a representative of the Australian Christian Coalition. I'm calling to let you know that we're issuing a death threat to you." ?
Posted by Irina I on 11/06/2009 at 02:19pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Now that I've had a bunch of threats, I do have some commentary, actually.
Do you know what's so interesting about a death threat on the phone? It's always a guy, and he always starts out with a very intimate voice. Like, the kind that a boyfriend who is missing you uses. It's deep and soft and slow. So at first (now, it doesn't work on me) but at first, the guy would actually draw me in. I would think I should be talking to him just based on the tone of voice.
It's very surprising to me. It's amazing to me that all the callers intuitively know to use this sort of voice.
Penelope
Posted by Penelope Trunk on 11/06/2009 at 08:52pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
So after he says, "Hey, baby, whattayou wearing?" all deep and soft and slow and stuff, then what does he say? Is the FBI interested in this stuff? They should be.
Posted by Maureen Sharib on 2009-11-11 06:53:47 | (Comments wont nest below this level)
I like what you wrote for the Guardian.
I'm puzzled why this is suddenly making news in Australia and the UK a month later. I know that Mia Freedman wrote about it on her blog Mamamia.com.au and maybe that got the Australian press interested. But still, it's seriously old news.
I'm a freelance journalist for publications in both those markets and it never occurred to me that they would be interested in this as a story, after CNN had already interviewed you. Maybe I need to be more derivative as a journalist because clearly I was wrong about that!
Posted by Caitlin on 11/06/2009 at 02:27pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
This is seriously blowing up as a media issue again, quite a ways after the fact? Get real. And as you've pointed out many times, a better conversation would be not about the perceived "shocking" nature of your tweet, but why we can't talk about this sort of thing.
Obviously miscarriages happen–otherwise women wouldn't do so much to not tell their coworkers they're pregnant until they are several months pregnant (never mind that they're probably exhausted, distracted, and feeling like crap whilst trying to do their jobs those first few months.)
If we could be honest about our pregnancies–without having to face subtle (or not) questions about whether we will be good little worker bees once the kid is born–the workplace would be a much more enticing place (and might do a better job of convincing women to return to work after their maternity leaves!)
If we could be honest about our pregnancies, maybe we could have an honest conversation about how work doesn't exist in a vacuum, and how there must be better ways to navigate work-life balance.
If the new Brazen Careerist CEO doesn't get that… I'd be mighty concerned that he doesn't get the great idea behind the site in the first place.
Thank you for standing firm amidst this ridiculous media coverage. I'm heading over to create my account at BC now.
Posted by Leanne on 11/06/2009 at 02:51pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I always love your posts and tweets. I signed up already for BC, but if I could, I would do it again for you. I honestly haven't gotten that much out of it because I am a scientist and the site seems to mainly cater to communications majors or office workers, but I still check in from time to time. I signed up for the site because I am not sure what I want to do with my career and I thought the articles there might help me decide.
Thanks,
Beth
Posted by Chickybeth on 11/06/2009 at 02:55pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I don't always agree with what you write on this blog, but I wanted you to know that I loved your piece in the Guardian. It was perfect. Thank you.
Posted by Kristen on 11/06/2009 at 02:56pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I too found you through the Guardian piece and enjoyed it. Something quite different is always refreshing
Posted by Bluehill on 11/06/2009 at 04:16pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
What a golden example of why Media 1.0 sucks and does not work. When blogs and other forms of self-publishing gained popularity, we started to hear all of the traditional journalists whine “but there’s no quality control! ANYONE can publish anything on a blog waah buh blah!” Of course this is from people who are too intellectually uncurious to find out about “network effects” and why these things work. So they whine about no quality control on blogs and serve up this steaming pile of absolute shit for us to consume as news. These are the professionals, the gatekeepers, and they remind me of the record companies circa 1998. Sure it is scary when technology changes the business model. You can say, I’m going to whine and fight this and be the exception and the one person in history who will defeat a cheap and ubiquitous technology. Or you can say “wow technology has discovered a way for me to reach untold numbers of people that I couldn’t reach before, there’s an opportunity here.” Newspapers are doing the first thing, sadly. They would not do this if they respected their readers and did not think of themselves as being entitled to this gatekeeper role no matter how many times they screw it up.
I used to wonder why newspaper commenters are the dregs of all comments online. It is because people who engage with an online newspaper to the point of registering and commenting are engaging with a form of media that doesn’t respect them. And if they don’t respect their readers they certainly aren’t going to respect Penelope Trunk’s time.
The fact is that this blog is getting maybe fewer readers in numbers but it allows you to engage with people who are going to add value whether to your blog by making a non-stupid comment or with your company. Old media hangs on to a sense of importance out of tradition but they could not be less relevant to your interests. It is interesting that the New York Times “TimesPeople” thing won’t let you delete your comments or make it easy for you to post under an online identity as you see fit. They don’t think you should own your information or control it, they think you should cede it to them completely. And that is how they treat people they interview. If Old Media pays attention to you and they decide it will be in a way that degrades you, you just have to knuckle under, according to them. Except you don’t. I already know that Old Media is not going to tell me anything I want to know about Penelope Trunk. I am glad you told the cheeseball “Today” show or whatever the fuck it is to naff off. They are irrelevant.
Posted by CCS on 11/06/2009 at 04:54pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I'm behind you 100%. Found your blog from Jezebel & Guardian article. Bravo. Tell it like it is, girl! More people need to hear it.
I haven't checked out the hostile comments you received, but I can guess: its likely related to your relief at the miscarriage. If you had been devastated, it would have been considered "appropriate". Subtext: anti-abortion maniacs.
Also I totally get your impatience with the mainstream media. They don't want the news. They want to manipulate events from their point of view. Bah Humbug. Had a good laugh at your recap of a conversation :)
And I was somewhat bemused by Shandra's disapproval of your take on the MSM…she seemed to assume it represented the "real world"!@#$%^&* Wouldn't know where to start in repudiating that claim, so I won't bother. Suffice to say: she is dead wrong.
I do like your style of writing. I'm glad I found your blog. You are now bookmarked. :)
Posted by dc on 11/06/2009 at 05:36pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Well dc, what I meant is that using your blog to trash the MSM is not what most companies who want and need publicity would consider "good PR." That's what I mean by the real world. I don't think it was necessary to do the interviews, but I also don't think it was necessary to go off on a rant about them either.
Posted by Shandra on 11/06/2009 at 08:03pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
And just to further clarify – if people are thinking that joining BC is going to give them professional credibility, I'm just not sure it is going to work out that way if this is the level of professionalism the company's spokeswoman displays when it comes to media requests. And – that's it, really.
Posted by Shandra on 2009-11-06 20:05:04 | (Comments wont nest below this level)
Looks like the Guardian piece got you a whole pile of new people, so yay for that. I spent a couple of hours truffle-pigging around here yesterday and have sent the url to pals. I clicked on the House Manager link before reading all of today's post – I am a housewife – I think you're fantastic! And I'm Australian – ignore the insane Christian Fuckers.
Posted by Amber on 11/06/2009 at 06:06pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I always thought death threats were a bit of a compliment for any blogger or writer. It says that people care enough to risk legal consequences because of something you wrote.
Posted by Michael on 11/06/2009 at 07:12pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I don't even want to read your interview on the guardian because you don't have to justify anything. It happened what it happened, I can understand your relief at that time, I can also understand that some people were offended by your tweet.
But in the end, that's your life, nobody's else.
I think your position More than feeling compelled to justify myself to your audience, I feel compelled to protect my schedule and my family from your intrusive calls and seemingly random deadlines.
is the correct (and sane) one to have.
So now people : move on !
Posted by Cyril on 11/06/2009 at 07:49pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I'm so proud of you Penelope for standing your ground with the big media dogs. Way to go, for putting your children first!
Posted by sophie on 11/06/2009 at 08:35pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Soooo sorry to hear about all the stress, paltry treatment by the MSM, death threats, etc.
I tweeted your post on Twitter. I have about 1700 followers.
And yes, I tell my friends about you!
You are a hero for some, and that includes me!
Take care. Thinking of you fondly and wishing you the best as you go thru these trials.
Sincerely,
Tina
Posted by Tina on 11/07/2009 at 12:26am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hi Penelope,
I've been reading your blog for about a year now and your honesty, passion and humor constantly inspire me. I also think one of the greatest things about your blog is that it helps remind people that they are not alone. Thank you for that and all the best to you.
Posted by Robin on 11/07/2009 at 12:26am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I liked this post, Penelope. And I liked the Guardian article (I live in the U.K.) You are definitely in a position to set your own agenda and you should. Otherwise, you will resemble this other woman who recently wrote about work/life balance (or lack thereof) in the Guardian and just quit her job as an editor there:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/culture/2009/nov/01/gaby-hinsliff-quits-working-motherhood
All best
Delia Lloyd
http://www.realdelia.com
Posted by Delia Lloyd on 11/07/2009 at 02:08am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I started my career in the mainstream media (back then, that's all there was) and for many reasons become disillusioned. I'm so glad to have found another way to work and not to have to play that came in order to survive professionally. You are lucky – but you've made that luck – to have our own options. Your stated "position" with the mainstream media is loud and clear and powerful. Maybe if everyone stopped kowtowing to their whims, they'd start reporting for real again.
Posted by MDTaz on 11/07/2009 at 02:33am | permalink | Reply to this comment
The fact that you are taking this stance with the mainstream media makes you so much more admirable in my book. It send a powerful message. Please stand your ground here.
Posted by Amanda Hite @sexythinker on 11/07/2009 at 03:25am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I read your article in The Guardian. At first, I expected to be annoyed but your comments about how we handle emotion were very well put and felt quite moved by the end. It's no surprise that "religious" people are the ones attacking you. Organised religion hasn't had anything relevant to say for a long time, so they need to find other ways to draw attention to themselves. Be strong.
Posted by Harry on 11/07/2009 at 05:33am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Thank you very much.
You're great!
Posted by Zoe on 11/07/2009 at 06:26am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I love this site. You are a very refreshing blogger. I am a mother of two and it's good to see somone else feels like me.
Posted by April S on 11/07/2009 at 06:49am | permalink | Reply to this comment
You go girl! Tell it like it is. We have been hiding these issues for generations. No more.
Admire your courage and honesty.
Posted by Sandra Jonas on 11/07/2009 at 07:37am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Excellent post. Demonstrates microcosm of the sad but true reality of Mainstream Media vs Social Media. In a Blog, MSG is rec'd directly from Blogger to Reader. No layers. Then you make a decision. Which is exactly why we like it & PRECISELY why Big Media doesn't. Without these layers, they not only lose their job, they lose the ability to bias the story to their liking.
1 word to describe big Media? ARROGANT. Guy from CBS? LAZY.
People making threats? TERRORISTS.
Posted by Kirk in Indy on 11/07/2009 at 07:57am | permalink | Reply to this comment
You are a brazenly brave woman! I am inspired by your work and read your blog regularly. Let your CEO know that the entire "you" is your brand and the whole idea of dicing you up into some kind of "package" so the brand in protected is very old media thinking. One of the reasons we blog is because of the freedom of expression and the ability to actually speak the whole truth, not just the tidy bits that make for cute sound bites or cardboard celebrities.
Your tweeting and writing about all of what's going on is great. Keep it up. This IS your brand and the CEO might want to reconsider whether he/she can handle new social media transparency and authenticity.
I'm still in awe of one of your posts about your early family years and use it to be strong and honest in my writing.
Posted by Barbara A. Zelnick on 11/07/2009 at 09:05am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Women have what it takes in a tough world: they have thick skin.
Everyone still dodge low balls in the public sphere, including women. They are ready to brush off personal attacks to focus on what matters to them in politics or in the workplace.
Whether we are talking about Hillary Clinton or Sarah Palin, we all agree that thick skin pays off in leadership positions. The most humiliating moments for either one of these two candidates may have been when their personal lives were questioned: for Palin, needing to "prove" to the world that her youngest son was really hers and not her daughter's (a lioness in defense of not one but two of her cubs) or putting up with the media's criticisim of a woman not being able to be a good mother and an effective leader at the same time.
While hers has been a recent bout with the sometimes heartless media, Clinton's putting up with her husband's infidelity disclosed to the world while in power has been public for years. After something as embarrassing as her marriage made public, I don't believe there is anything that nominee for Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton, can't face. These women have what it takes in a tough world: they have thick skin.
Pros of having thick skin in the workplace:
1. Although most people like to be liked, others strive on getting things done regardless of whether they win the popularity contest or not.
2. Disregarding both hurtful and senseless criticisms will allow you to focus on the bottom line, the common goal, without being distracted by personal attacks. This does not mean that leaders don't listen to others' advice; it just means they should be able to filter personal attacks and dismiss them.
3. Inner strength shows itself not when the world is praising you but when others are critical. It is easy to feel powerful when everyone around you is smiling at you, but the criticisms truly show who your true friends and foes are.
Some cons about having thick skin in the workplace:
1. Many see this inner feeling of self-assurance as outward arrogance, creating distance between the leader and his or her employees.
2. Because others may perceive this "arrogant" leader as cold, robotic, and manipulative, many will suggest that the leader does not care about or even understand them.
3. This strength may be perceived as unemotional in others, particularly if the leader is a woman. The gender expectation is that a woman leader is generally more dramatic or more emotion-driven.
Food for thought: Do you have thick skin or are you a drama queen? What are the advantages you've observed in leaders with thick skin versus the prima donnas? When is it a good idea to have thick skin and when is it a good idea to speak up about unfair comments? Do you notice gender differences in the way men and women control their emotions in the workplace?
Beth V.
Posted by Beth V. on 11/07/2009 at 09:10am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Food for thought: do you have a blog or ?? Obviously you have some insight in these areas…
Posted by Kirk Abraham on 11/07/2009 at 03:30pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
This death threat stuff just blows my mind. I hope you're spending a little time notifying the authorities about this and getting the information into whatever databases are out there. I suspect that people like this are targeting people other than you also, and disseminating information about them to the extent possible would be a service to others.
Posted by Kerry Kimble on 11/07/2009 at 09:25am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hi. I've been following the "controversy" about your miscarriage as it tempested around the teacup, & I wanted to tell you– you are great. People's faux outrage at being forced to acknowledge their messed up standards– that there is an onus on you not to mess up their lives by telling the truth, that unethical attempts to make legal medical care impossible to get impacts actual lives, the whole kit & caboodle– is really messed up. You are doing an admirable job suffering the slings & arrows of outrageous fortune, & you're story has helped me with a similar issue in my life. So thanks, & yeah– I'm on Team Trunk.
Posted by mordicai on 11/07/2009 at 09:44am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I love your courage to say "enough already". I admire your ability to stand ground and say "no" with clear boundaries around your priorities. The reason the media gets away with with their bullying tactics is everyone is so quick to have their ego's massaged for exposure. As for your "brand" I am glad you CEO wants to protect you but from what…being misunderstood, being taken out of context? There is no protection for that anyway. Your actions speak louder than words and Penelope, your words are pretty loud.
Like in Atlas Shrugged, the looters and the commentators only have as much validity as you are willing to contribute to them, a contribution you make by participating and responding.
Posted by Nancy Carroll on 11/07/2009 at 10:37am | permalink | Reply to this comment
"Like in Atlas Shrugged, the looters and the commentators only have as much validity as you are willing to contribute to them, a contribution you make by participating and responding."
That's not the first time Ayn Rand comes to mind regarding Penelope.
Posted by Maureen Sharib on 11/11/2009 at 06:56am | permalink | Reply to this comment
A DEATH THREAT?!? Ah, Pee, you do manage to keep 'em coming. I can never figure out what you'll invent next.
Posted by john on 11/07/2009 at 11:30am | permalink | Reply to this comment
> But IMO it's not a very classy way to build a brand.
I wish more people stopped noticing how she's building her "brand" and notice that she HAS no brand to build.
"Branding is what you do when you don't have a product." –Roy Disney
Posted by john on 11/07/2009 at 11:37am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Where are these death threats coming from? And do you take them seriously?
Posted by Trainerpack on 11/07/2009 at 12:31pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
PT, I was one who initially objected to your miscarriage Twitter…not because I don't think it should be talked about and not because of your stance on abortion. What bothered me was the perceived callousness of the post.
Now I realize it's because Twitter was the wrong venue for posting such news. Your Guardian piece is so well written and so explanatory of your thought process. Even though I personally am against abortion, because of your expressed thoughts and situations, I can better emulate where you were coming from. This is true especially when you worried about how a baby might affect the time and care you have for the two children you already have.
We have such a wide range of online communications. Here's an example, where sometimes some are better suited to specific situations than others.
And, way to go, for standing firm to mainstream media. Those jerks.
Posted by rennie on 11/07/2009 at 12:50pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
First of all, I am a career woman myself, and I understand how important it is to have courage and be strong and brazen in the workplace. Also, I am not religiously affiliated with any certain church, and I am pro-life. That being said, I think the way you were so happy at the death of your child is absolutely sickening. You say it's wrong that people accuse you of belittling all the women who go through heart ache when miscarrying their child, but that's exactly what you did. Abortion is not birth control! Wear a condom if you don't want more children! I'm sure you could get the pill or the patch or whatever. Getting pregnant and then hoping that your baby dies is horrible. You are a heartless, pathetic excuse for a woman and I feel sorry for your kids. They are lucky to be alive, apparently. Good thing they weren't conceived a few years later or they may not have made the cut. Miscarriage is a devastating thing to most women, at least the ones that have souls. Would you have told the world how happy you were in the middle of your abortion? Abortion is your choice. We don't make the choice to have a miscarriage. Miscarriage is not something to be aired out publically, especially in a joyful manner. Take a good, hard look at your kids and think about how much they mean to you. That baby that died was just as special and beautiful as the children you have now. You are sickening. Wear a condom next time, and for goodness sake don't put your miscarriages out there like they aren't one of the most devastating things that can happen to a woman.
Posted by Angela on 11/07/2009 at 01:01pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
My boyfriend's extended family called to make sure he was dumping me (From PT. Guardian essay)
Oh, how I can relate! I have always suspected my husband's family thinks I'm a little odd. A lot of their feelings are simply characteristic of small town Wisconsin, where things are always done the same and diversity in people as a whole is very limited. Small, rural towns don't know enough about the rest of the world to understand that "different from them" is not always wrong.
I have to wonder if the farmer's extended family fits into this characteristic. If so, then just smile and go on giving them something to talk about. It gets to be rather fun.
Posted by rennie on 11/07/2009 at 01:08pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Its what destroys WOMEN at work? Not MEN? Just Women……..If a male blogger had made that same mistake this comment is the only type of comments there would be.
Just women… Thats insulting quite frankly….
Posted by Timothy on 11/07/2009 at 01:29pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Good for you. I worked in television news for the majority of my twenties and then for PostNewsweek after that… I now run my own company and couldn't be happier to get away from the INSANITY and utterly low pay……..
In defense of the mainstream media, I'm happy for the people and soon to be fans watching and listening to these networks/publications who wouldn't have found your delightful blog otherwise….
Use the mainstream media, as they use us……….. and ignore the rest.
I do believe there's more positive outcomes from your engagements with them……
Carpe Diem.
Posted by Nichole Rhodes on 11/07/2009 at 01:44pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
About mainstream media – I think you are right. On one hand, there is an opportunity to reach a mainstream audience, on the other hand, the hoop jumping…Maybe – at some point in your career – it is just not worth it.
I blog, and my readership is nothing like yours, but I've been contacted by what I consider "big" media. Excited, I jumped through all of their hoops. Canceled an appointment at the last minute to arrange to speak at a different time. I even called the reporter (shouldn't he have called me?) – and spoke to him for close to an hour. Imagine my surprise when he used all of the information I provided and DID NOT EVEN MENTION MY NAME! That's when I learned that I was just a pawn.
I have since been quoted in many "big" mainstream media stories. The only good thing about it is that I can say I was quoted. Because we still (as a culture) value that endorsement.
Maybe, someday, I'll be able to say "no" to the Today Show, too. But, first, I will wait until I have a chance to say yes!
Posted by Ann on 11/07/2009 at 05:28pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I subscribed to your blog several months ago. I subscribed to several others around the same time. A few months later I decided I needed to cut back on daily email and unsubscribed from all but yours and one other (Seth Godin's, in case you are curious).
If you stopped including your whole, real, life as part of your topic, I would unsubscribe within a few weeks. I'm not sure that the Brazen Careerist membership fits for me (I've been self-employed for decades) but I may well test that assumption and give it a whirl. But I certainly wouldn't bother if you were just another 'brand'.
Also, I appreciate the stand you have taken in standing up for the right of women to talk about issues like miscarriage openly, but if you had written about miscarriage in the workplace without grounding your writing in your own experience, it would not have carried nearly as much weight with me.
I'm interested in all of what you have to say, not a sanitized version. Hope your CEO gets the message that your blog is an irreplaceable asset just as it is.
Posted by Kye on 11/07/2009 at 07:34pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I found you through the Guardian also! And I too, want to say – thank you and more power to you (and us)!!!!!
Posted by Sue on 11/07/2009 at 07:34pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Wonderful Guardian article. Thank you for sharing it.
My mother had four miscarriages. I wish she had discussed them with me. Until I read your blog, I had no idea that a miscarriage could be such a long, drawn-out affair. We're definitely empowered when we discuss the details in our lives.
Bravo, P.!
Posted by Annette on 11/07/2009 at 09:08pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I question whether you have the right person as your CEO. I also wondered when you previously mentioned you would need to separate your blog from Brazen Careerist.
Isn't Penelope Trunk Brazen Careerist? I think most readers view them one and the same. Be careful, CEO.
Posted by wondering on 11/07/2009 at 10:00pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
So true! Until this incident, I believed Brazen Careerist WAS Penelope Trunk and vice versa. Didn't even know there was another CEO. No Penelope and I'm outta here! Be very, very careful, CEO.
Posted by Jessica Hughey on 11/07/2009 at 10:20pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Who watches TV anymore?
Yes, the influence of TV is dead. I imagine younger generations have evolved to see when another is true to one's self. There's demand for real, passionate people. And identifying these people isn't transparent enough through the TV box.
Posted by Ann on 11/08/2009 at 03:55am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Ann, you're right. Who watches TV anymore?
On this morning's news (okay, I still watch TV – I'm one of the remaining relics that doesn't have cable)…anyway, I saw that Oprah is considering leaving her syndicated talk show, moving to LA and starting her own network. Her reason, according to mainstream news sources: The conventional television audience is a dying thing, including those who watch Oprah.
Posted by rennie on 11/08/2009 at 03:41pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Fascinating, rennie!
I have a feeling that anyone that profited from mass audiences is now suffering from identity crisis.
Well I'm 24 and Oprah is a world away in my view. I live where she has a vacation home (Santa Barbara) and her influence is all but a whisper in the wind here, a semi-home.
Without roots, there is no echo. Without feet, there is no community.
Posted by Ann on 2009-11-08 20:32:13 | (Comments wont nest below this level)
Bravo. About time someone sets the stage for saying no to a stupidity we've all come to accept. Next step? Figuring out how to say no to the artificial hoop jumping in the corporate world as well.
Posted by Cindy on 11/08/2009 at 06:53am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope, I love you! You've inspired me to be real about who I am, even at work! Imagine that!
Posted by Cindy on 11/08/2009 at 10:00am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Perceptions. Perceptions. And more perceptions.
Ryan Paugh is a co-founder of Brazen Careerist, Inc. and has been interviewed on "How to use social media to build a business and online network."
Ryan Paugh graduated from Penn State University in 2006 with a Bachelor’s in Journalism. He joined Merck & Co, Inc. in the corporate communications field, where he became interested in workplace issues facing Generation Y. He also took an interest in how social media can impact the way we approach our careers. He founded Employee Evolution with Ryan Healy, where he found an outlet for his curiosities.
Paugh currently lives in Madison, WI and is a co-founder of Brazen Careerist, Inc. His passion is making Brazen Careerist into a community for young professionals to make their voices heard.
Paugh has been featured in The Wall Street Journal and The Associated Press. He speaks to companies, organizations and students about issues affecting Generation Y and how to leverage social media to better your personal and professional lives.
During this interview, we discuss how to use social media to build a business and online network. Great stuff?
Reference Link:
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/Y-Talk/blog/2008/05/14/Interview-with-Ryan-Paugh-of-Brazen-Careerist
Interesting.
Beth V.
Posted by Beth V. on 11/08/2009 at 11:03am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I don't understand – are you trying to make a point about Ryan or just sharing an unrelated article about him?
Posted by Caitlin on 11/11/2009 at 02:00am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Thanks for your willingness to discuss the good, the bad, and the ugly of women's lives, including how personal problems affect our work lives. I have little doubt that your fearlessness will make my life better down the road, when I may be pregnant (or not), miscarrying (or not) and feeling about it however I feel without fear of repercussion.
To me, the most important issue here is not your personal life, or an abortion, or a miscarriage, or how you felt about it or even Wisconsin laws (though, yes, they seem to have placed you in a shitty situation), but rather the fact that women are virtually forbidden from discussing these commonplace occurrences at work.
I'm not saying I want to get into the nitty-gritty of my menstrual cycle on the job, but to force women to clam up 100% of the time about issues that clearly influence a majority of us doesn't help anyone–male or female.
Posted by Anonymous on 11/08/2009 at 11:40am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I signed up for Brazen Careerist last week. I learned about it from your blog. Without your blog, I wouldn't have signed up.
Posted by Jenny on 11/08/2009 at 01:56pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I subscribe to your blog not because I always agree one hundred percent (though this is a case where I do) but because I respect what you write and therefore you. I am grateful for what you share with me your reader.
Thank you.
Posted by Suzanne on 11/08/2009 at 02:47pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Maybe this is a stupid question, but…did you actually have a miscarriage–or was your tweet a figure of speech–like "I want to shoot myself this meeting is so boring"? I spent ten minutes browsing your site, and I really couldn't tell!
Posted by CrazyGirl on 11/08/2009 at 04:51pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Last year my 28 yr old daughter had an ectopic pregnancy. I rescheduled a business trip so I could be with her and take her to several dr appts. This year she was due to deliver my first grandchild. I told work associates out-of-state that I would not be there to do a training class and why. They applauded my choice and said they were glad to handle it for me. We are making some progress in the workplace. And it's with the help of writers like you.
Posted by Barbara on 11/08/2009 at 05:57pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
You might be interested in looking at this:
http://www.abc.net.au/iview/#/series/andrew
In Australia we've recently had a series of media "outrages." Julian Morrow, who was partially responsible for one of them recently gave a lecture regarding the phenomena of the media outrage itself and explored the issue of the secondary audience – those who didn't actually see, hear or read the original broadcast (or tweet!) – but, aided and abetted by media and the broadcast platforms of new media, become outraged and offended, and create a media storm that was not created by the original broadcast itself. Exhausting really.
Posted by Siobhan on 11/08/2009 at 07:56pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope, I thought your piece for the Guardian was very good. However, you say this:
"Others say I should not have discussed my experience on Twitter, but Twitter is not a public forum. Those who want to read my tweets have to sign up to receive my updates."
That isn't the case. Your Tweets are not protected, which means that people do not even need to be logged in to Twitter to read them.
I'm sorry to hear about the death threats. That's reprehensible of everyone who has issued one.
Posted by KateNonymous on 11/08/2009 at 08:47pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Kate is correct. People have to opt in to have your tweets appear on their Twitter home page but they are visible to the world on your profile page at http://twitter.com/penelopetrunk.
Posted by Caitlin on 11/11/2009 at 01:59am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Not to mention here on this blog!
Posted by KateNonymous on 2009-11-12 11:04:16 | (Comments wont nest below this level)
I love what you do! Your wit, self effacing humour, your unabashed honesty…Be Yourself and I'll try harder to take my own advice and follow your lead.
From an Australian that doesn't wish you harm
Posted by Steve Wisbey on 11/08/2009 at 09:55pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Nicely said, and nicely played. I thoroughly enjoy your blog and the way you think through life decisions. Good luck and keep on truckin' :-)
Posted by Sarah Wood on 11/09/2009 at 01:19am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hi Penelope :)
I read your blog reguarly and moved to London about a year ago (from the midwest). I saw a small blurb in the Metro morning paper where it was just your twitter, trying to make it sound bad but I rolled my eyes as it was a month later and only JUST now hitting here….
Then The Guardian on Friday, and I thought it was rather well-written actually.
I was surprised actually that it takes that long to have a miscarriage as I didn't know. I'm glad I know now as I doubt any women would have actually shared that information. :)
Posted by Devon on 11/09/2009 at 03:37am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Kind of baffled by the media furore that followed your Twitter. Have to say, I'm not a twitterer (impossible to say anything in 140 characters and enough Crackberry issues already) but that such a small message could cause such a hoo-haa (sp?) says a lot about how little progress women have actually made.
I'm recently pregnant, well nearly 4 months in, and I'm constantly amazed at how I've become public property and that people who really have no business telling me how I should be doing this or questioning my approach to child rearing (most often, women who have no children…). Since when did a pregnant woman become public property? Since when did we lose all the hard-fought rights to manage our own bodies and childbearing decisions?
To read your responses to the frankly none-of-their-business commentators and fuss has given me hope – hope that we can stand up and say we do or don't want to be parents, we might have a glass of wine or cigarette whilst carrying, and that frankly it's no-ones business whether I give my child pre-packaged food.
But I'm ranting at http://waitingforbeta.blogspot.com – hey, it beats knitting.
Posted by Ammi on 11/09/2009 at 06:22am | permalink | Reply to this comment
From one professional working mom to another — You go girl!
Posted by Sara on 11/09/2009 at 07:24am | permalink | Reply to this comment
The point of your blog was that mainstream media is stupid, misses the point, abuses people, demands too much, and comes onto a story long after it's over.
It wasn't about miscarriages.
I couldn't agree with you more. Mainstream media is reactive. It doesn't create the stories, it just massages them into info-tainment. And it believes it is more important than you.
Ditto for mainstream publishing, mainstream marketing, etc. They're followers and bottom-feeders, not heralds and leaders.
Here's a topic for another blog: "The internet changes everything."
Posted by Nancy on 11/09/2009 at 07:38am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I think if there's anything Penelope has proven it's that most people (ie, almost all of you above me) are naive and can be manipulated like the stupid sheep you are. Or else you never heard of P.T. Barnum.
Posted by Johnny on 11/09/2009 at 12:55pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
And that's what makes me hesitant to register on this place-all this anachronistic 'grrl power' stuff (yuck).
Posted by Rachel on 11/12/2009 at 12:03am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I think the media finds your comment offensive because it is a brutally real message from a woman affirming her sexuality instead of being ashamed of it. Don't give in to the media's request for you to justify your actions. Also, your in-laws are ridiculous.
Posted by Pam from Canada on 11/09/2009 at 01:41pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
"So, mainstream media, here's my position. More than feeling compelled to justify myself to your audience, I feel compelled to protect my schedule and my family from your intrusive calls and seemingly random deadlines. I feel an urgent need to separate a sane online conversation about women at work from an insane media that is doing exactly what destroys women at work: Making it extremely difficult for me to have a manageable schedule for parenting."
If I hadn't already signed up for Brazen Careerist this would have made me do it. Thanks.
Posted by Emily on 11/09/2009 at 02:27pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hi Penelope,
I love your work at Brazen Careerist and admire your refreshing honesty. It is the conspiracy of silence that has allowed this messed up medical system to continue for far too long.
Best wishes,
Helen Baxter
Mohawk Media
Posted by Helen Baxter on 11/09/2009 at 04:14pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Go you.
Posted by Tzipporah on 11/09/2009 at 05:38pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Way to stand up for your (and my) right as a woman and a parent to have a LIFE! Thanks for blogging and encouraging the rest of us to carve out our own personal space!
Posted by Ruth on 11/10/2009 at 08:49am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Regarding how the media attention will affect the Brazen Careerist brand, I think it's time to give up the pretense that anyone reads this blog for serious career advice. This is The Penelope Trunk Story, and it's riveting thanks to the events that have occurred in your life and your willingness to divulge them.
Posted by Shannon on 11/10/2009 at 11:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Kudos to Penelope!
Posted by Jenny F. on 11/10/2009 at 02:20pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
oh crap, did the VC force you to give them the CEO position?
Posted by Harlan on 11/10/2009 at 03:41pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Could be. That is a known VC move (you get $, we get control).
Posted by MJ on 11/11/2009 at 09:11am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I've been using that "View a Random Post" button lately like it's some sort of lottery quick pick. A random post that came up was titled 'Job hunt tips I've collected' dated 4/9/07.
The first item on the list is "Don't answer the phone when it wakes you up." Reading further on yields the following – "Time magazine reports that "the morning haze you experience when the alarm clock goes off is known as sleep inertia, and it clouds your brain more than sleep deprivation. The impairment is most severe in the first ten minutes but can linger for up to two hours." Bottom line: Let the call go to voicemail and go get some coffee."
Now I do think The Guardian was unprofessional and inconsiderate when they called at 4 AM but that call should have definitely gone to voicemail.
Also it looks to me that Now magazine is a cheap imitation of People.
Your mainstream media rant regarding your experience with both The Today Show and The Early Show is understandable. I know the double whammy close together would leave me bitter. Do you need them? Do they need you? Probably no on both counts but as you well know both of you can use each other to the benefit of each other. Hopefully this experience with mainstream media is not typical in the future. I think there's more people like Max Chafkin out there in mainstream media.
Posted by Mark W. on 11/10/2009 at 04:49pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hello, I found your blog from Max Chafkin's article and I'm ever so pleased to have clicked on your name of the few I did click on. I too am a full time working stepmom (Oh yes, I have the three kiddos full time and I work in the publishing business full time). I really appreciated this entry and could relate. Thanks for making me feel like I'm not completely insane for trying to balance a career and parenting. Because I thought I might be. Maybe I am just a little.
Posted by Crys on 11/11/2009 at 09:55am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Medawar found this via "Kat in New York".
There are, occasionally, moments when looking after yourself must take precedence over communication.
Miscarriages can be life-threatening, proceeding towards medical help at flank speed should be the normal response of the moment and sharing the experience can always be done later.
Interface addiction can be as dangerous as smoking and for much the same reason: people find themselves doing it in situations where the slightest distraction could do them harm.
Medawar's Mum saw, through a safety window, when a researcher at Porton Down fished in his lab coat for fags, took his mask off and lit one up. He was in the plague lab and the only appropriate comment she could think of was "goodbye". (1952 or thereabouts. He died. These days it would probably be a Blackberry: at least you don't put them in your mouth.)
Posted by Medawar on 11/11/2009 at 11:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
This too shall pass. I read several HR blogs and your blog by far has more comments than any of the others. Why? I think because you are honest and that takes courage. People don't always like or agree with what you say, but they do listen to what you say. Besides, isn't it better to be listened to? Agreeing with someone all the time is BORING. Ok, gotta go sign up for Brazen Careerist now (that's for you Penelope!).
Posted by Jennifer on 11/11/2009 at 12:47pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I do feel that until the government deals with the basic structural problems in our financial system of too much debt, we will not have a sustainable recovery. So even though the stock market can stay irrational in the shorter term, in the long run I believe it will go back to reflecting the fundamentals of our boom and bust economy. And that's why I continue to feel that for long term investors a better portfolio allocation is in cash and gold. I think the gold price will continue to rise due to a lack of faith in central banks' policies and in fiat currencies. I recently saw a very interesting articles called What Gold Bubble? Setting the Record Straight which I think is particularly useful for investors to read to get a better sense of what's going on in the economy and the govt's role in influencing it.
2
Posted by mthomas on 11/11/2009 at 04:13pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope, once again don't ever change. I'm not telling you anything you don't know but your realism and honesty set you apart from most everyone else.
Sounds like you are on the way to needing a media consultant or agent to best filter these media requests and ensure they treat you according to your needs.
Regardless, congrats for the increased attention and may it always be positive.
To the religio-fascist terrorists who threatened you I can only say that I hope they get exactly what they deserve.
Posted by Jonathan Ross on 11/11/2009 at 05:10pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Well, I came here due to your story being covered in the Irish Independent today, then reading the Daily Hatred(sorry, Mail) rant about TMI, and I'd just like to add my voice to the hundreds saying you go and write whatever you want. F*ck the death threat loonies, the time dumb jobbing journos and anyone, who tries to put you in a neat box and say "don't say that".
Here's hoping some journos take your side and write about how you've been treated, and how *they* are going to have to change.
Posted by Colm on 11/12/2009 at 07:20am | permalink | Reply to this comment
I loved your article in the Guardian. You are an eloquent and sensitive writer.
It absolutely infuriates me when others tell us what we should and should not discuss. When I, a nearly 40 year old woman, became pregnant with my first and very anticipated and planned for child (alternative insemination), people told me I had announced the pregnancy too early, that I was bold. No, not bold. Optimistic. And if I did miscarry, I was more than comfortable telling people I had. People astound me, really.
Keep on tweeting or twittering or whatever it's called. People are thirsty for this kind of honesty about subjects thought to be too private to discuss.
Posted by Genevieve on 11/13/2009 at 08:56am | permalink | Reply to this comment
"I feel an urgent need to separate a sane online conversation about women at work from an insane media that is doing exactly what destroys women at work."
Maybe is should be re-written in its true context. Replace the "women" with "people."
"I feel an urgent need to separate a sane online conversation about "people" at work from an insane media that is doing exactly what destroys "people" at work.
A true and fair context, as it applies to everyone, is both "men and women" at work, not limited to the "women at work."
Lets be equal and fair, but honest.
Respectifully,
Beth V.
Posted by Beth V. on 11/13/2009 at 03:35pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Hi,
I found you via the gaurdian comments section. reading what others wrote about your twitter comment, before I even read the full comment itself has been very interesting!
I shall be following you in the future!
All the best,
MW
Posted by Michelle on 11/13/2009 at 05:37pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
Penelope: I’ve been thinking all week about your death threats from Christian groups. A couple of questions spring to mind:
1) Do religious groups incorporate the death threat committee with the welcoming committee? A good cop, bad cop situation?
2) Has there been a new release of the Bible in which Jesus is a sociopath? I’m not talking about turning over a few tables in the Temple. I sometimes wonder if the flock has strayed too far from the Master.
I hope one of your critics could shed some light on those questions for me. I am glad that you’re illuminating such important issues.
Thanks!
Posted by Laura on 11/15/2009 at 09:53am | permalink | Reply to this comment
Saturday? Who watches the Today Show on Saturday?
Posted by Mark on 11/16/2009 at 12:55pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
As the recently managed-out single mother of three children age 9 and under, can I just say, you are my new heroine. I spent 8 years at one of the top 50 companies to work for (according to Fortune). But I just couldn't give them everything they wanted even working 60 hours a week. Thank you for a dose of reality.
Posted by Sylvia on 11/16/2009 at 05:37pm | permalink | Reply to this comment
I am not going to read the Guardian article-sorry. But I did watch you on an interview on some show maybe CNN? I thought you did a fabulous job and I learned something from you. I learned that if one keeps their wits about them they can frame the conversation and make it engaging no matter what question one is asked. I believe this is advice you provided in one of your career blogs about interviews. So it was great to see that in action. Plus I loved that although the gentleman interviewing you made some statements in an attempt to insight you to lose composure, you didn't. I thought you did a beautiful job with the media and it was fantastic to watch you in action.
I worry for your safety based on the vigilante anti-choice individuals worldwide. So sorry that speaking openly about your personal experience has lead to this base response. Take care!
Posted by Bridget on 11/18/2009 at 06:09pm | permalink | Reply to this comment