Great post! And it's all so true. As a recent graduate (from grad school), I was discussing with a supervisor & friend the daunting and discomforting nature of working an 8-5. Why? — because of #3. 8-5 disrupts my natural rhythm, and I'd be much happier working 10-7.

Man I love this post! Check out my last post on Do You Feel Like a Toby Sometimes. http://blog.talentdrive.com/talentfilter/2008/07/do-you-feel-like-toby-sometimes.html

Clay

If your goal was to be provocative - BINGO!

"washed up parents" Ouch! A little judgmental?

I congratulate on your confidence and enthusiasm, but a little moderation, tolerance and patience might be in order.

It's good to be on the leading edge, but you might might want to stay off the "bleeding" edge.

You're mindset is not going to contribute to the solution, so you're part of the problem.

Regarding the use of technology, mentor an older co-worker in the use of web/enterprise 2.0 tools to enable them to do their work more effectively and efficiently. Don't teach them tool, teach them how to use it in their work. You'll learn too, about the business of your company, and build a relationship that will yield benefits that might surprise you.

Ask Ryan H what his mother might think of your post.

Is there any generation that couldn't say this? The technology is new, but the principles aren't.

* * * * * * *
You're right. Just about every generation can say this. Since World War II, productivity in the U.S. has doubled. Doubled. This is due, of course to improvements in technology, but also in our understanding of human productivity. Every generation is getting more productive than the previous one.

–Clay

Golly, another post by some kid who thinks that nobody over 35 is capable of learning a new skill or using technology. Look, son, I was writing scripts and macros when you were at your mother's teat. We Xers and Boomers are not all lifeless automatons who cower in our cubicles all day, unwilling to speak truth to our corporate masters. Some of us have known about work-life balance for a while now, thank you very much. I suppose that every generation thinks of itself as the font of all worthwhile knowledge–I remember well thinking how clueless my old colleagues were when I started. But eventually you realize that you don't know everything, and that your elders may actually have accumulated some worthwhile life experiences. You'll get there eventually, and I hope to god that you don't have to listen to Generation Z telling you how worthless you are when you do.

Seriously? I could write about the positive attributes of every generation and show how it has a positive effect on their business performance. I didn't know it was a pissing match about who was more productive though so I came unprepared.

I guess I'll just have to start with your numbers showing that Gen Y is more productive.

Err, nevermind.

Gen X and Boomers have done stuff in the business world. Their success is proven by results. Look at the Fortune 100. Gen X and Boomers are all over the place. We aren't there yet.

An argument like this rings empty to businesses because there are no numbers or results to back it up. Until we do something, we're not going to be respected for bucking the unpleasant things about working.

I can say yes to all of the above reasons, and I'm way past my twenties. I've met many people in their twenties who do not exhibit any of these traits. I don't see any reason to categorize people by age, it's too simplistic and doesn't add to our understanding of how people work and learn.

* * * * * * *
Yeah, analysis based on age is often too simplistic. I agree. Still, there are some notable cohort effects.

–Clay

I can definitely see the advantage of Gen Y being able to easily find the best tools for the job. At one of my last jobs, one of the hardest parts of my job was not finding tools that would make our lives easier, but teaching my co-workers to use them. Luckily, they were open to learning, but I did still have to spend a significant amount of time writing down each new step as clearly as possible.

It's amazing how different our generations are in our basic comfort with computers and new programs.

In response to a commentator about, the reason I think we Gen Yers feel the need to write articles like this is because - when we are in the workplace - a lot of Boomers treat us like ignorant kids who aren't capable/productive.

And yes, we do work a little differently, but the workplace has also changed a lot. We can't depend on job security, and paying our dues probably won't pay off because we won't be there (either due to our own choice or not) long enough. So it's not surprising that our generation feels like we have to look out for ourselves more.

I usually like your column a lot. I will often print out a post and tack it up on the bulletin board for others. However, this is the most blatant ageism I have seen in a while. And it doesn't even have the virtue of being true.

Are you comparing Y to X or Y to the baby boomers?

Well, all I can say is that you really need to get to know more people than your 'washed up parents'… It may even be worth losing some sleep hours. And looking up from your bots. :-)

I'm not sure what's more interesting. The way Gen-Yers compare themselves favorably to other generations, or the way other generations resent the comparisons.

The fact of the matter is Gen-Y is way too arrogant. We think we're really hot stuff and can beat the pants off of anyone else when it comes to a contest of productivity and money-making ability. We think we're light-years better, but we're actually just slightly different.

Most Gen-Yers are better with computers than previous generations. That's not to say that previous generations are lacking in intelligence. Far from it. It's thanks to our parents and even farther back that we even have computers. Bill Gates is older than my Dad and he's undeniably influenced the progression of computer software and hardware in incredible ways. He wasn't the first one to invent computers either.

That being said, I usually have an edge in computer use and productivity than most people over 40. Why? Because I grew up with them and as Clay points out in Reason #6, I was experimental with them. That's the key to learning and keeping up with advances in computers. No class or set of classes can do the same thing, because things are always changing. You have to keep experimenting and figuring things out on your own. Otherwise you're stuck doing things by the book, and the book isn't always right about the fastest simplest way to get the computer to do what you want it to do.

In a nutshell, we're arrogant, but we do have a couple excuses. One is that we do know technology. That's not a very good excuse, but it is an excuse. Second, we're young. Arrogance is something that we'll hopefully grow out of given a little time to gain experience and realize how fragile we really are. :)
* * * * * * *
In response to this: "that's not to say that previous generations are lacking in intelligence."

–Clay

As an academic librarian, I have to disagree somewhat with points 1 & 2. No doubt there are 20-somethings out there who really are on the leading edge of technology and automation, but a lot of the students I see have never explored technology beyond Google, Facebook and instant messaging.

I am currently teaching a class on online research to a small group of teens who've been hired as summer research assistants. I handed out a pre-course knowledge survey to get a sense of where they're at. In addition to lacking any traditional library research skills, these students all indicated that they are unclear about what a database is, are not making use of RSS readers to keep track of feeds, and aren't using social bookmarking tools.

Now compare this to most of the librarians I know. Most of my colleagues are reading and writing blogs, subscribing to feeds for both blogs and academic journals, creating wikis, using screencasting software to produce online tutorials, and even, in some cases, inventing their own apps. Most of the people I'm thinking of are in their 30s and 40s.
* * * * * * *
Right. Most librarians are going to be better at using library-related technology than teenagers. My hunch, however, is that most 35-year-olds will know less about how to use technology, in general, than the teenagers.

–Clay

sorry, but….who cares? did you write this to justify all of those text messages? because regardless of how productive they may have been, you still LOOK like you're completely wasting time with personal stuff.

and that's not good for anyone.
* * * * * * *
I think it’s much better when managers manage results, not appearance. I’d rather work with someone who’s twice as efficient as the average employee, even if they look like they’re doing 1/4th of the work.

–Clay

Ditto what Harold said–I can say yes to them all too and I'm 40. One thing about all the Gen-Y stereotyping is that, as dewey says, while most 20-somethings are familiar with YouTube and Facebook, many (most, to gratuitously generalize as you do) have no idea about technology–or work, or life, for that matter–beyond that. Just because a person can send a text message doesn't mean that they're an edgy go-getter.

One thing that doesn't compute for me is the disconnect between the ubiquitous over-achieving high-school and college students–all AP classes and extra goes at the SATs to ensure the best possible score and supercharged activity schedules–and these laid back, who cares how much I make as long as I'm happy 20-somethings. These Gen-Yers you're talking about–how did they manage to switch gears from "I must get all As and be in all honors classes and play by the rules to get into the best possible college" to "Who cares if I make mistakes?" young professionals?

I love Penelope but my one criticism of Brazen Careerist is that having all Gen-Y bloggers is getting kind of old. Every post seems pretty much the same as all the others: Look at me, I'm 20-something and I have figured out the secrets of the career universe. Ok–we get it already! How about some other perspectives?

Thanks for the nice laugh this morning. Since most Gen Y'ers seem to use these vaunted technology skills to post embarrassing photos of themselves on Myspace and Facebook while somehow not figuring out what Spellcheck is means I'm not too worried about the Gen Y competition.

I wonder if there will also be an epidemic of neck strain (to go along with the video game and social networking induced carpal tunnel) because of all this Gen Y navel gazing.

@ Maggie I can answer your question about the overachieving high schoolers because I was one. I had a full 16 college credits before I entered college, despite not taking a single AP test my senior year. I lettered in track, swimming, band and bunch of other activities. I was also did two youth in government programs, and went to state every year in a creativity competition. Then, in college, I graduated a semester early despite switching my major 4 times.

What happened to me is that I learned that people can work really hard doing everything they're supposed to do, and excelling - but still be laid off because the company wanted to cut costs.

Companies broke their deal with the workers, and I no longer feel compelled to play their silly game.

I have no problem doing the dirty work for a company, but I want my contribution and abilities to be recognized, and I want to work on something that matters.

Clay

Thanks for giving everyone a chance to hurl grenades at you. You made it way too easy.

On the other hand, you've stimulated discussion and engagement. Attractive for potential investors in Brazen Careerist.

In future posts you might want to focus on what you've learned from the feedback to this post (failure is often more valuable than success) and suggest ways to make the workplace more engaging for young people and to build relationships with older co-workers.

Hold your head high, you're trying to make adifference.

Joe, a Boomer (1947) with a Gen Y mindset

Generation Yers! We need to start encouraging positive views of us by being productive in the first place. Somebody took the whole thing about 'washed up parents' too sensitively first of all. Parents aren't washed up, they're just getting older. Then again, I'm wondering if I'm going to find an office-job by the time I'm thirty. I'm 27, post-college.

@Michael Henreckson
Thank you for your acknowledgment of the contributions of previous generations and the tools they provide so that succeeding generations can be more productive. Each generation has its own strengths and unique experiences. A productive workplace with a range of generations (one form of diversity) will seek to work together and maximize each generations strengths rather than emphasize their generational differences.

Clay:

The one thing that I learned that is key to your success - more than anything else - is the way you get along with your coworkers. Emotional Intelligence. People really don't hire,promote, invest in, and buy stuff from people they don't like. It's probably not fair, but it's true. Therefore, if you go around telling other generations (who at this point make up the majority of American workers - Gen Y is just getting started, man) how much better you are then them, they will not like you. And you have a really hard time getting ahead.

Another thing to remember is with age come wisdom. My grandmother may break the remote control to her television every six months, but she has really good advice when I get in a jam. She doesn't have a computer or a cell phone - but there are lots of things she knows that I couldn't even begin to grasp.

So, in the future, please remember that every person in their 20s since the beginning of time has thought that their cohort was the best generation of all time. When you write posts like this, it makes you sound like a punk (and I really don't think you are.)

fantastic post! really enjoyed reading it. I completely agree about we seek our own training. Absolutely. I would also add that much of our "training' is just by first hand experience. Our generation is inventing the tools that make life faster and more efficient and we are more apt to try them and make our own tweeks. Twentysomethings are a bit lazy in that they don't want to "reinvent" the wheel- we rely on a few to invent it for us and then the majority just adapt that wheel to our best use.

Thanks for a great post! Would love your opinion on my blog sometime. I talk about the joys of being a twentysomething and going from college to corporate.

All those reasons and all that productivity, yet Gen Y has yet to really DO anything except blog about what they're capable of doing. I don't see it. Not impressed.

I grow weary of the Gen Y superiority complex. Congratulations, you've mastered Twitter and Facebook; so now you are ready to be CEO. Perhaps previous generations also drew from a bottomless well of narcissism, but we didn't blog about it ad nauseam.

You kids are damn lucky there's no draft because if you think corporate heirarchy is a problem, the military would crush you. Before we "washed up" hacks empower you to spend company revenue and potentially alienate clients, we will test you. Sadly, I find many of you utterly lacking in anything but enthusiasm and an outsized sense of entitlement.

@GenerationXpert. Great post. I agree with you completely.

How difficult is it to stay "up to date" in your field when you've only been in the field 5 years?

I'm impressed when I see people pull that trick off for 30 years (or more).

"Reason 2. We’re good at automating"

We are getting so good we are automating ourselves out of our jobs. Then our productivity drops to zero :-).

Ben

Yup, and Generation Y also invented sex.

Boy, does this hit some nerves! How soon did it take to get 20-25 comments!?

I'm a tail-end boomer, although I hardly consider myself one. My Gen Y kids come to me for IT advice since I work in that field and they do not. I regularly update my skills, not because I'm of a certain generation, but because it's a necessary component of the field in which I I work.

Here's the real glitch of Clay's far out analogy. Generation Y is just starting out. Most are not even married, let alone have kids. Heck, some of them keep moving back home with Mom and Dad! So, sure, they can quit their jobs whenever they're bored, or go back to school for the latest trend.

But life's a circle. Like the rest of us, Gen Y will also grow older. They'll get married and have kids. They'll stay with a job longer, until they're guaranteed a better one, because they have dependents. Taking classes to updates skills won't be as affordable or accessible. Goodness, by time they're 40-50 yrs old, they may have even been working for 20-30 years and be tired of it, no matter what they're doing! (But they won't be able to quit because they'll still be taking care of kids, since they started so late).

Every generation has been there, each in our own way. Every generation thinks we know it all when we're 20. We get even worse when we're 30, because we have a few years' experience under our belt. By time we hit 40, we start to realize the more we know, the more there is we don't know.

Beyond that, I haven't a clue, since I haven't gotten that far. I look forward to a whole exciting world yet to come.

Clay, I hope you write a follow-up in 20 years. It's sure to be good. And likely a bit humbler.

In a word: bullocks.

I think I probably know people from any of the recent generations still in the workforce that exhibit several of these traits, myself included. And I know those who are and aren't productive on both sides.

Bottom

Wait till his circadian rhythm gets out of whack because he has to get up early for his kid. Oh, that's right, Gen Y will have an automated and up-to-date schedule for parenthood, job, and life.

Ah, Clay. You're so funny:-)

I think the best part of this whole column and the comments, all of which I find completely hilarious and so typical of Gen Y thinking it's superior to anyone else, is this comment from Aaron:

"I wonder if there will also be an epidemic of neck strain (to go along with the video game and social networking induced carpal tunnel) because of all this Gen Y navel gazing."

I think we Gen Xers are just jealous that we didn't get a chance to be as arrogant as you Gen Yers, because we didn't get to enter the workplaec as easily as you, because there were too many boomers, not leaving enough jobs for us when we left college. So while we're truly bitter at your attitude, we're also just jealous that when we held that attitude, no one gave us the platform to gaze at our own navels.

http://40-nowwhat.blogspot.com/

I won't rehash all the earlier comments (although Aaron, Maggie, MichaelH: Yesyesyes).

My comment is item 2: I think there really is an age-related thing going on there. I was a total night owl until I hit 30. At that point, it was like turning off a light. Night and day difference, pun not intended. I don't think I'm alone, either.

Clay, talk to me in 10 years after you've had a kid or two, and tell me how much of a night owl you still are, okay?

Productive at what? All your points are very true, but real productivity is about getting the right work done and doing what matters to the customer/client/business. Your productivity can be perceived as wasted time withou results that matter to others.

Prove it, Clay.

Very provocative post! I agree with much of what has already been said by others, and sophie really said what I would have.

As the washed up stepmom of a couple Gen Y'ers, I realize that the workplace has changed, that the contract between employer/employee has been broken, that results are what count, and that being at your desk for 8 hours does not mean you were being productive.

I also remember being smarter than all of my older coworkers! I am excited to see what Gen Y will eventually accomplish because you do have a lot going for you, despite what many would consider as the strikes against you. You are bold and intelligent. I truly hope and believe the accomplishments of Gen Y will be spectacular!

But, go easy on us old people though - keep in mind we stayed in those dead end jobs to provide you with computers, cable TV, cell phones, and all that other technology you're so comfortable with.

Now move out of my house so I can start living my life for me! *grin*

You might understand technology, but only with experience can you really get the insights into how the business world works.

A lot of times these newly minted grads come out of college thinking they know more than those before them, only to be cutoff at the knees.

A perfect example would be the dotcom heyday. There were a lot of B2B companies who were out to eliminate the middle-man. And these B2B sites based their entire business model on price. They'll match buyers and sellers over the internet and take a percentage of the transaction.

Guess what, middle-men are still around and most of these B2B's are defunct. Had they had the industry insight needed from experience, maybe they could have put a robust platform together that incorporated more than just cost savings.

As I've gotten older, I've learned to respect and admire the ingenuity of previous generations. Each has something to give.

Without the hard work of the Greatest Generation who not only endured a Great Depression, but fought WWII (and many in Korea), we wouldn't be here. To think we know better than the previous generation is arrogant and disrespectful.

Another prime example from the dotcom days, remember the "New Economy?" Everyone was going to make tons of money, customers were just going to appear and the economy would grow forever. These were new companies who did business the new way.

Guess what, when it all came crashing down, these companies laid their employees off, and many of these companies did a very bad job of treating their best asset like an asset. Many of these firms upon implosion lost sight of the human dignity of their employees. Some of these companies set up conference rooms and fired people en masse. Others laid people off by email or cell phone.

But the previous generations didn't hide their humanity behind technology. They handled issues face-to-face.

These generations were not perfect, sexual harrassment, and racism was an unfortunate part of the culture in the US. But to wholesale dismiss entire generations because you are more technically savvy is in effect repeating the arrogance of previous generations.

One of the big faults I find with GenY'ers is that while they think they are masters of technology, they're more frequently just bamboozled by smoke and mirrors.

I work in the field of design arts and media. I was lucky to do my training just before the advent of computers. As a result, I learned to *draw* first and foremost. With a pencil and paper. OMG OLD TECH!

Towards the end of my studies, computer graphics began to be more and more part of the toolkit, and I incorporated them appropriately. And over the decades since, I have taught myself HTML, CSS, Flash animation, and now video editing and post-production. Not bad for a 43 year old Luddite.

I have also observed that, in the later generations of designers, the whole process begins and ends with the computer. Most of the younger designers I have seen never even pick up a pencil. And frankly, their work suffers as a result. The basic connections that drawing makes between the hand, the eye and the brain are absolutely fundamental to the design process.

Instead, I see kids who can play with Photoshop till the cows come home, but the result still lacks the fundamentals of good design, and is frankly a swanky looking mess.

The other problem I see is not one that is confined to GenY, but seems to be strongest in that generation, is a completely uncritical approach to information. If it's on Wikipedia, it must be true. If it's on "Idol", it must be awesome.

"Awesome" is the buzz word of Generation Y. Everything is "awesome". No critique, no evaluation, just a reflexive, unthinking enthusiasm for the "awesomeness" of everything they see on Youtube.

Gen Y has never dealt with economic uncertainty. Gen X dealt with it right out of high school + college. But we're probably coming up on some rough times –when people get laid off. And have to get crap jobs. And start rethinking all of their job hopping…

shhhhh. nobody tell clay. Gen Y - they're just the latest crop of young people to be low-man on the totem pole, bled for pennies, and pounded into something useful.

Geez, I'm 26, and think Clay is full of it. I can tell you right now that at best, his description represent the so called 'go getters,' which are not as numerous as Clay would have us believe. Well, onto the points

1) That is very funny. I can tell you flat out that the majority of people I know of all ages don't know jack about technology. Yes, us young'uns may be better at using technology than those older than us, but on average most people of our generation are still clueless beyond MySpace, Google, Facebook, etc. I've actually gotten a few bewildered stares when I told some of our contemporaries that they should switch to Firefox.

4/7) Please, many of my friends hate their jobs. I'm a freelance computer programmer. I love programming, and I love the flexibility, but most of my friends aren't so lucky. I have a friend with a BS in Engineering (with a 3.6) who is currently an Assistant manager at burger chain. I have a another friend who is a bus dispatcher with his degree. Don't give me the "all of us love our jobs" routine. Most of the individuals I know, in spite of being very intelligent and hard working, do not.

6) Of course we experiment. That's what people do when they don't have any experience to utilize. I'm fairly certain other generations did the same thing until they found out what worked.

Honestly, I'm getting fed up with the generational pissing contests. Our generation does things differently because the times are different, not because we are unique and special among the stars.

———-
Now, for some other comments:
@Maggie: I have to agree with Katie. Many of us followed the rules and got good grades no longer have any idea as to why we did it. I was valedictorian of my high school class. When I look back at those years, I feel like I was a race horse, being driven towards a goal that wasn't my own at breakneck pace.

My parents never pushed me like that, but everyone else did. All I and my friends heard was the constant refrain that you had to do well in school to make it. We had to be competitive to make it into a good school. We had to be involved in hours of after school activities and then do hours of homework and studying, all this while our more laid back friends spent their time being young. Then, we got into the good schools, got good grades, and because of this, we were supposed to be rewarded.

We weren't. I've already recounted the story of my friends. As for me, I did well in college but went for months before I was able to land a job. I spent two years as a substitute teacher looking for work. Finally, I said to hell with it and decided to start my own business using my programming skills. These weren't skills I picked up in college. No, these were skills I picked up over time by reading books and researching on the internet, picking up not only the basics but also touching on areas of computer science and software engineering as well.

After all of this, I can't help but look back and feel like nothing but an idiot. I and many of my friends worked hard and sacrificed. We gave up a lot of our teenage years to do what were we supposed and in the end got squat. It was only by doing everything I wasn't supposed to, by learning on my own even though my training wouldn't be recognized and by opening my own business in spite of the risks that I finally did "make it." ( All I feel my experience has left me with is a desire to not suffer this sort of treadmill based lunacy again.

@Clownfish:

While it is generally the rule, I will say that neither I nor my siblings, 19 and 20, do not rely on technology in this manner. My sister is an artist who draws freehand and only uses the computer for inking. My brother barely knows how to use photoshop, but draws freehand.

I can also sadly say that I've seen this reliance on technology in other areas as well. I've seen some very nice looking websites where it was obvious the designer who coded them relied on a WYSWIG and didn't know a thing about coding. On a site I was recently contracted to program a back end for, I saw tables used for layout, inline CSS, and a large white image used to set the background. Needless to say, I am not looking forward to pulling apart the pages to use as templates.

You lost me at "TXTing".

VigilanteNighthawk, you will go far. You write and you write well, something many of your contemporaries are still learning.

I can't believe your hard work in school is all for naught. So you're not working in the field you studied. Not many people are. But what your high school and college years did was teach you discipline and perseverance. You obviously learned the fundamentals of language, writing and math. You now possess the solid foundation to go in any direction you choose.

Imagine a large corporation with numerous project management applications, all desktops are unique, each users' choice of applications changes regularly as and when new/better ones come about, core systems and applications are fully personalised individually. Gosh, is there order in chaos?

The values of Gen X works very well at the individual level, but by it's nature not scalable.

Let's see how it is when family, children commitments and responsibilities come along.

@VigilanteNighthawk:

You're quite correct: What I should have clarified is that the trends I see in what I called the design arts and media (as distinguished from the fine arts) are prevalent in younger designers, not because they are "GenY", but because they are of the generation of designers who have been educated in an age where traditional drawing skills have discarded in favour of the whiz-bang instant gratification of high-end software.

Oh, and I'm so with you on the badly constructed website. In my experience, it's usually more cost-effective in the long run to simply rebuild such sites from the ground up.

I've had it with this place. I'm out of here. This is really the last straw I need after a hard day of work–some ignorant 20 something punk telling me he's superior?

Look buddy, I work in the internet field, I manage a high profile internet business, and I'll tell you the 20 somethings on my team can't even think their way through a problem. If it's not written on the board or in a book or on the net, they can't create it. If they aren't told EXACTLY what needs to be done they can't seem to figure it out.

Twitter, Facebook, etc are not changing business. They are not business models. They are not changing things.

Mark Zuckerberg didn't invent facebook, he is a prop used by the venture capitalists to make it seem like it's being run by the gen yers. The person running that company is :::gasp::: a gen x/late boomer with a stellar record.

Sorry buddy, but you just lost Penelope a reader, this type of post is just too much troll baiting, not useful, not fact based information (only ONE link on the whole thing?), just your opinion. And just like buttholes, everyone's apparently got one.

This is just like in 1995 when the internet changed from really smart people to a place where anyone with $1500 and a packard bell could get on the internet and spout bulls*it.

there are plenty of other blogs with good informative and thought provoking, not troll baiting commentary, and I'm headed there.

I always said, early to bed and early to rise gives you the same number of waking hours as late to bed and late to rise.

Folks,
This site has dumbed down to sensationalism (PT's divorce) and troll bait (this POS "article"). I'm out of here. PT, this is the type of crap your business model is built on?

@Jim testify brother

just cos you can push buttons on an IPhone done means you know anything about how a mobile phone works.

And I suspect the spoon feed nature of today tecnology stops people really learning stuff – ill give you an example I’me a late baby boomer or early gen X depending on how you look at it.

I took one of the first class my high school offered in programming as was in the middle tier as I’me dyslexic an got moved down a set.

In my CSE class we started with Machine language (ok a cut down training language but still proper machine code)

My first job was at a world leading RnD organisation where I would get given interesting problems like how do we get a 3d plot of the droplets from a fire sprinker system where the pattern has been captured using multiple filters and time lapse photography and shots of variable focal length to get the Z axis information

Had to work that one out from almost first principals with the enginner whose project it was and then write the low-level interfacing code to the A0 digitizer we brought and projected the images on.

This post is excellent. At least we now know that PT isn't the only one out there trying to give some "expert" advice!

Quick question: While your being so productive at getting work done are you in fact getting it done any better?

Being a IT recruiter for 20+ years (you know the career path the internet was going to wipe off the face of the planet)and the owner of my own company I learned my craft (sales) at the feet of my father and have trained many others over the years. However, the ones that truly succeeded were the ones that understood the business not necessarily all the new tools that can make us more productive. Because in my business if you can't sell it doesn't matter if you can use all the web tools in the world.

While it is great that Gen-Y has embraced the technology of their day, I agree with a prior comment, so did past generations. Technology is great when it works but occasionally you must work without it and that's where Gen-Y may have a big problem. A previous post had a great suggestion with a slight correction. Work with a mentor to learn the non-technology stuff and help them with the tech stuff. A 50 year old isn't going to consider a 23 year old a mentor no matter what how much they know but they will be willing to help. That way everyone benefits.

Let's look past the so-called content. Here's a guy who knows how to create buzz; has written and sold books. You create buzz in large part by being controversial. Truth generally has little to do with it.

Let's have a round of applause for Clay, for demonstrating how to successfully promote oneself. Not the least of which is by getting himself a guest slot on Penelope's blog, one of the current stars in the controversy and buzz-creating business. Marketers and job seekers everywhere, take note.

I have largely ignored the incendiary and non-verifiable assertions ("discussing" or "having constructive dialogue" about said assertions would again create more buzz—witness the response to this post). I say hats off to the marketing genius, who laughs all the way to the bank.

just notice clays comment "It’s just to say that, over time, each generation is getting progressively better at scoring well on a test that was designed to test the ability to be productive workers in this modern society. "

er mate EPIC Fail! you obvisly did not pass statistics 101 you dont grok what a fracking iq test measures do you.

I didn't know I was still in high school ("why our group is better than yours")?

Regardless of age, or 'generation', humbleness and appreciation for those that you can learn from (yikes, that may mean people who are older than you-!-) goes a long way.

Arrogance and a sense of entitlement only makes you look like a jerk, (I don't care how old, or young, you are, it's offputting at any age).

Clay,

I encourage you to explore the diversification in the Millennial generation. I am on the cusp of Gen X and the Millennial. In addition, I prepare Millennial students for success in their career trajectories. Thus far, professionals studying generations at work have only considered the middle class to upper middle class Millennial population (this would be twenty-somethings that can afford to stay current with technological trends), not the millions of Millennials that come from a less affluent socio-economic background. Class can be a beautiful equalizer in the workplace. While technology can certainly be one way to qualify the advantages of a generation, personality is personality. I find that my less affluent Millennial students tend to be more successful than my more affluent Millennial students. I say this harboring on the edge of grossly generalizing, but still. Could it be that they work hard because they have no other choice? Professional laziness is professional laziness. I think all generations share that, but I am inclined to believe that this is a trait that becoming increasingly commonplace for a certain class of Millennials. Perhaps the Millennials that had the "helicopter parents" in college are at a less of an advantage than the Millennials who did not. Again, I am connecting dots at the risk of making obscene generalizations. I think that the topic of class diversification in generations will be one that professionals will need to explore as they develop strategies to minimize all generation's challenges and maximize their strengths in the work place. Thoughts?

Motivated, intelligent and emotionally mature people span generations. This ain't anything new. The same old claptrap gets spouted by each generation while they're in their twenties - it's a hallmark of the arrogance of youth and the voice of inexperience.

It was a good laugh though. I spotted stuff in there that I said in my twenties.

There's a kinder, gentler version of Clay on The Growing Life. Based on this post, I thought he'd be the poster child for self-entitlement. While he typifies the parents of Gen Y as "washed up," he personally thanks his for teaching him how to be an unreal person. According to that particular post, we should aspire to be unreal, not real people. I guess their washed up jobs gave Clay the means and foundation for all of them to have an unreal life.

Being a money person, I was looking for some hint of his impoverished young adult life so I could make an example of him. But what I found is a pretty cool guy (who left home at 15 to start his first business), living his edition of the Secret, with a revenue stream he's grateful for (an income snowball as he calls it) and a professional life that exudes abundance. Clay's peers and Gen X could all learn something by taking note.

I just have to say a big congratulations to Clay! You may not know/remember me but we were in the same class in college…But besides that point, I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed the post.

I usually cringe when I read the "my generation is better than your generation" post, but I think you missed the biggest attribute the younger generation has…networking.

Gen Y/X seems to get more done through their peer groups and their peer groups are ever expanding. Much of this is technology driven, and I don't give anyone much credit for 'e-lationships' (# of myspace friends).

Business is, and always will be, about relationships. Technology has enabled introverts and people who don't want to kill time at happy hours the ability to connect and maitain a valuable network. This generation has certainly mastered these skills.

Find ways to bridge the generation gap and get past the 'my gen' versus 'your gen' garbage.

Ageism is not cool.

This post seems totally inconsistent with Clay's writings in is The Growing Life blog. Over there, he seems like someone you'd root for to succeed, not someone who stirs up the pot for the sake of self-promotion.

I tend to believe Clay's heart is in the right place, but intentionally crafted this post to fit some of the themes Penelope covers (generational differences). In the process of trying to be interesting, he came off as arrogant.

Just be yourself, Clay.

@Queercents

You're right. And that's what is so disappointing about this post on PT's site. It seems completely out of character with the revolutionary, optimistic spirit Clay nourishes on his own blog.

It seems as if all PT is about is self-promotion. It that is her fundamental career advice for these young men and women of Gen Y, we can see the toxic effect it has by witnessing Clay's transmogrification.

Big Thanks for this post!
Every word rings true. Enjoy reading your blog and will def look into your books.

:)
Farida

I'm kind of getting tired of people using generation classifications to justify a particular work style. Hey, I'm and old Gen X guy but I stay on top of current technology, I read Blogs obviously, I text on my phone, my music no longer has a physical presence, I serf the web even without having a reason, I'm on Linked in, myspace, face book, and others. I even do a lot of this stuff while at work. The difference is, I actually give a shit about getting the work done and having it done when I said it would be done (always looking for more efficient methods including automation).

My point is this, I understand the stereotyping of the various generations and that is fine. However, no matter what generation you are, you have the ability care about and take pride in your work. And it is okay to want others to have a positive perception of your work ethic. A lot of these posts remind me of they way kids in high school used to act. If they sucked at sports for example, they just said, I don't need to play these stupid sports, I'm too cool anyway. Rather then taking on something they were good at, they chose to blow off potential in other areas and go smoke out back. Others might have sucked at School Work, so they just chose to be mediocre in study rather then understand what was preventing them from exceeding mediocrity. I think your intention with this Blog was to illustrate how your generation is more productive however, all you have done is demonstrated why a good portion of your generation continues down the road of Mediocrity.

I have hired many Gen Y's that are smart, hard workers, get the job done fast and efficiently, automate where possible and guess what… They show up on time, don't abuse the dress code, have a good work ethic and attitude, actually care about they way people perceive their work, and more importantly, how they are perceived as a person. These are the leaders of tomorrow. As for myself, and these hard working Gen Y's with a good work ethic, we would like to thank all you Gen Y slackers that think you have some right to live and work in your own lazy, content, mediocre style. Thanks to you, it is very easy to be successful in business today. Thank You for setting the standards so fucking low, that those of us that give a shit are easily advancing and finally getting fair compensation. Keep up the slacking!

From a dinosaur, and as an antidote to Clay's 7 points, I propose the following 7 attributes for success:
1) Communication via the direct route, formerly known as "people skills," including honesty in speaking as well as sincere listening;
2) Analysis & logic in one's own brain, prior to and apart from analysis and logic as it exists in computers;
3) Problem-solving with and without the assist of technology;
4) Global responsibility and an altruistic impulse towards global issues;
5) Ethics and ethical decision-making;
6) Ongoing efforts to see the big picture;
7) Humility as we begin to perceive the big picture over a long lifetime.

CAK

To all the insightful folk who have responded so far, I am surprised that no one noted that this appears to be the content of the negative ads put out by McCain v Obama. Does anyone else see an application here?

CAK

Ahh to be twenty and know everything again…

"We’re much more likely to love our jobs"

and the next line is…

"Since Generation Y switches jobs much more frequently"

Where is the love here? Why switch.
———————————————-
“how can technology make this task go faster?”

and the next line is…

"Sometimes our efforts to employ technology make things more complicated…"

At least we can have complication at a more productive rate.
———————————————-
"cares more about getting new experiences and learning new skills…"

"might not result in quantifiable productivity…"

"leads to the kind of shifts in thinking that save time and money…"

Are these skills productive or not?

Some very contradictory ideas here.

Generation X and the generation before that created the iPods that Generation Y are lapping up.

If owning an iPod and PDA makes you feel important, productive and like you know it all - more power to you.

In their natural habitat the Gen Y'er can often be seen TXTing in their cubicles, taking breaks, and instant messaging. Known for rolling into work late while wearing head phones, because they took the bus…everyday is tattoo and designer jeans day!

Clay I think you got suckered by pop culture created by Gen X.

Keep consuming baby!

Most Gen Xers could probably dig ditch faster than I would, or run faster, or party harder (well probably not party harder) but I think I get my point.
Certain attributes diminish with age, others become better honed. That's life now and in the future when your kids think you are ready for blue hair and a permanent vacation in a Florida retirement facility at 40:)

Your way of saying this though has alot of undies in a bunch but it is a universal truth. The young are quick, but with age (should) comes wisdom.
Keep writing kid, you have a bright future
My old 2cents worth:)

Clay writes: "…we’re not afraid to rely on nearly-free, online productivity tools from unknown companies…"

@boon
Yes! My first thought was, "oh my god, think of the security risks of having some unknown company maintaining all of your project data! And how will teams share data?"

Anyway, I am on the cusp of X&Y myself (more Y than X) and I think this is a lot of BS. In the surface, I agree that yes, I am probably more productive than my older counterparts, in terms of output. But I am in no way more productive in terms of success. My boss (cusp of X & boomer) has 20 years on me and there is no tool or training in the world that is equal to an additional 20 years of life/work experience. He can solve problems in five minutes that I've been mulling over and researching for a week. Productivity doesn't matter too much when all you can claim is that you're fast.

Charming. The irony of "The Growing Life" is not lost on me.

Thanks for this! I am SO tired of hearing boomers and X-ers wax on about how underrated/arrogant/silly/unengaged our generation is. It’s insulting and untrue and I’m sick to death of it. It seems like every time I have a conversation with an older person about the future of work/politics/economics –whatever- it turns into them giving me a million reasons why "nothing will ever change–you'll see. You’ll be just as cynical as we are one day, so there’s no use trying." I am so over it.

Clay, thanks for pointing out how we might actually get stuff done. Really. Good work!

p.s. Clay’s post was about how much more *productive* we are; not how much "better" we are. It seems that certain commenters are protesting waaaay too much.

Also, in order to analyze these things some generalizations are necessary. Of COURSE not every twenty-something knows a lot about technology, and not every boomer is ignorant about it. But the data suggests that the twenty-something is more likely to know about technology than the boomer.

Being angry about it doesn’t make it any less true.

Jennifer, the irony of your post is superb.

Sounds like you're describing Generation X to me. Who invented all these tools you're describing?

All of this is missing the point anyway. As Penelope constantly writes, your interpersonal skills are far more important than your productivity and how good you are at the technical side of your job. Strolling into work late, wearing headphones and texting from your cubicle might not stop you doing your job well but it's all about perception.

Intrigued by Ashe's comment about working 8-5. Surely an 8am start isn't normal? Back in Australia we used to talk about the 9-5 and in the UK a 9.30am start is quite usual. I'm not sure where the extra hour came from - it's meant to be an 8 hour working day after all.

Penelope, these Twenty-Something posts are getting a bit repetitive. This is the first one for a while, but those of us who are longterm readers have read this all before. It's a different byline but it's the essentially the same post - and it's attracting the same old comments too.

There are so many interesting things a 20-something could write about in regards to their experience in the workforce. I don't want to read about what makes their generation different or special - they can tell me that 20 years from now. But I would like to hear about the experience of a college graduate job hunting, their experiences in their first job, how they manage their careers a few years down the track when they're starting to go for midlevel positions and decide what they want to focus on.

But you know what? I would also like to hear from women dealing with maternity leave and childcare, the workplace experience of minorities (beyond anti-Christmas flame bait), how older people deal with retrenchment, how people retire earlyor work beyond retirement. I would like to hear real, specific stories that may or may not illustrate a wider trend, not just generalisations.

I would also like to hear about different types of jobs. Reading this blog, you'd be forgiven for thinking the only two options are corporate office job v entrepreneurship. How does one get to be a photographer or an opera singer? What's it like being a tour guide or a teacher or a farmer?

The generation stuff was a vein of gold for you but it's been exhausted and it's time to dig deeper and give us something new.

I'm really enjoying your posts lately by the way - the more narrative writing style works for me.

You are loosing readers by writing in such an arrogant tone. I admire your obvious creativity and intelligence and I always read your blog in hopes of finding some nugget of inspiration. But lately I've been very disappointed by the lack of depth in your writing and research. This post in particular is just a simple insult to the hard working previous generations. I agree with some of your observations about the acceptance of technology in gen-y. But any gen-y who thinks they can produce more value to the corporate world than a more experienced worker is just a fool. Like the Bible says, "humility is before honor."

Gen Y invented sex, too.

Why does every generation think they're the original rebels and new thinkers?

I was sure WE were…Boomers sucked, Gen Jones knew better, but then Xers came, etc…

Nothing new, Junior. Hang in there though…You'll read/hear/see/telepathically input the same idea in a few years…

Clay, that was an interesting post. Thank you for that. Now get me a cup of coffee. And make it snappy! Don't stall for time with Starbucks wireless service.

I think these are ideas that everyone should take on board to achieve a better balance….not just gen y.

PS - I think gen x is starting to take a lot of these ideas on, however it has just taken them longer to do it.

My goodness! Such rancor among the generations. All right, kids, I'm a 40yo single mom of 2. The LOST generation. The one no one ever talks about. The kids of the early Boomers. And IMHO, y'all all need to take a deep breath and stop flinging poo at each other.

I taught myself BASIC in the early 1980s, and added Pascal, MLX/machine language, and Fortran in high school, and went on to college-level BASIC and Advanced BASIC. I was the first person in the history of my college to tutor a computer class at the same time I was taking it — couldn't skip the core courses, even if you could pass the final on day one. I developed computer systems and protocols at the first three jobs I had after graduation from college.

You know when I got behind on technology? When I started raising the next generation. When you shift your focus from keeping up with your peers to keeping up with your kids, your life changes. It's inevitable. Even after I re-entered the work-force, I didn't have the time to devote to learning like I did when I was young. But I fit in as much as I can, when I can.

Now as for the generational pissing contest, EVERY generation that has ever been, or ever will be, is different than the preceding ones. The world changes, and the generations change with it. Knowledge is lost as new knowledge is generated. My kids don't know what an LP is … I grew up listening to 45s and 78s on a pint-size turntable. My baby brother doesn't remember a time when there weren't CDs; I remember 8-track. I drive a car all the time; my grandmother remembers when a car was a novelty, and only rich people had them.

Get over the differences already, and celebrate the similarities. We all want to get ahead. We all want to raise our kids to have more, do more, and be better than ourselves. It's just the definitions that change as the technology and the world change.

I'm a 35-year-old parent who's tech-savvy. I don't take offense to your comments, but instead I just shake my head and remind myself how thankful I am that all the stuff I wrote in my early 20s isn't online! It would be so embarrassing to look at now. People are so arrogant when they're young. The trick is growing older & wiser while keeping your youthful spirit and shedding the pretentiousness.
By the way, was it your generation that invented all this technology?

PT,

Thanks for sharing this article. This helps shed some light on how "Gen Y" thinks as I mentor quite a few of these individuals. I do see a gap between generations as I fall into Generation X. I do see a lack of respect for the other generations as they have paved the way for us.

Well, I guess every generation feels they are better than the other. This will always be an ongoing battle.