How to get a job that’s way beyond your experience
The jobs that are the most fun are where our learning curve is high but we can still achieve results. Usually the list of requirements for a job like this is a little beyond your experience. So how do you get one?
First of all, realize that the people who write job descriptions actually have little clue about what they really want in a candidate. That means they are easily influenced if they see a resume that grabs them. The other thing to keep in mind is that candidate requirements are usually insanely optimistic so most people applying will either be way out of the price range for the job, or not quite meeting the qualifications for the job.
In any case, you should always reach for a job way above you, but do it in a way that makes you seem like a reasonable candidate. Here are some tricks:
1. Use the informational interview as a sales pitch.
If you know someone is hiring, and you know you’re not qualified, you might still be able to get an informational interview. In that meeting, first find out all you can about what that particular department or company (depending on size) needs. Then find out what really matters to the person you’re talking to.
If you can sell yourself as someone who has the right type of personality and demeanor for the type of work that needs doing, the hiring manager might believe that you can grow into the job quickly. This leap of faith becomes more realistic when the hiring manager believes that you know a lot about the job and he knows a lot about you (which you selectively reveal in the informational interview).
Tough part: Shifting the meeting to a job interview even though it wasn’t scheduled that way. Be subtle.
2. Sell yourself as a consultant.
People want good ideas. Note, though, that a good idea is one that you can actually implement—one that you can see through from start to finish. People say that their particular industry is not like this, but in fact, every industry is ripe for a good idea sold the right way.
This is typically what consultants do. They go into a meeting selling an idea rather than selling themselves as a fit for a job description. A great example of how any industry needs good ideas is the funeral industry. There are tons of new ideas for how to bury peoples’ remains, and the industry is dependent on the quality of new ideas flowing in.
This is true of all industries, no matter how obscure. So if you come up with a good idea and sell it to the right person in the organization, you might be able to land a job implementing that idea even if you have no experience doing something like that.
Tough part: Learning how to sound like a consultant if you’ve only trained to do an interview.
3. Get people to use you as a reference.
Headhunters don’t fill entry-level jobs, they fill mid-tier and top-tier positions. The headhunting business is all about sourcing, so the more you know about how headhunters source online, the more likely you are to get tapped for a job that is a little beyond your qualifications.
Eric Muller, from Prizm Consulting, says he often searches for resumes with respected corporate brands on them and then he looks for the people listed as references—and he goes after those people. So try getting your friends at your level to list you as a reference and you get a chance to be considered for a higher level position.
Tough part: Getting the right friends.
4. Blog to become an expert.
It’s amazing to me how many bloggers in the Brazen Careerist network are people with 1-3 years of work experience who sound like someone with a lot more work experience. The reason for this is that blogging forces you to become an expert in your field a lot faster than a day-to-day office job forces expertise.
Blogging focuses on ideas and the person who is writing those ideas. You can position yourself as top in your field offline by becoming top in your field online. Your online position gives you access to people who would not consider hiring you based on your resume and experience, but would consider hiring you based on your blog and your ideas.
Tough part: Having good ideas. Really.
5. Have a realistic idea of your skill set.
It’s very hard to sell something you don’t believe in. So you are going to have a hard time getting a job that’s a little bit beyond you if you don’t really believe that you’re good at what you are saying you’re good at.
Also, though, it’s very hard to sell something you have blind faith in. Think about the evangelists that knock on your front door. Their arguments are not persuasive because they “just believe” they are right. If you “just believe” you can do it, you won’t be able to cut a deal.
So in order to land a job that’s beyond your experience, you need to tread that fine line between having a strong belief in your strengths and not going off the deep end to the point where you sound delusional.
Tough part: Seeing your true self and believing in the person you see. This is actually the tough part of all of life. Which explains why I like writing about career advice so much.
I like these. I would add that if you’re going to try to turn an informational interview into a job interview, you have to be very subtle about it and not overly aggressive. If the interviewer realizes that you set up the meeting with that intent in the beginning, they’re going to be annoyed.
2 words: personal branding
I’m extremely bias, but I’m the product of what I preach so I recommend it to everyone.
You really need to have a great product or no one will talk about you and you will have almost no pathway into a better job. Networking is also key.
Boooo! Back to the “traditional” career advice Penelope? I was hoping for some controversy to start my Monday…
That being said, I just want to comment on your last few sentences today:
“Seeing your true self and believing in the person you see. This is actually the tough part of all of life.”
These two sentences could sum up my life right now. I think one of the main reasons I read your blog is the connection I feel with most (if not all) of your comments (hooray for sugar mommas). As a 27 year old, I’m learning that a major part of life happiness and professional satisfaction is about introspection. It is the first step in the 12 step program. Unfortunately, getting to step 2, or ever knowing what step 2 is, has turned out to be the hardest part…
Just a few comments:
On number 2, Sell yourself as a consultant: Far too many businesses have been burned by consultants learning at their expense. Many in certain business segments remember the Dogbert saying: “I’m not unemployed, I’m a consultant.”
On number 4, Blog to be an expert: That depends on the field you blog about. Certainly anything in IT that you blog on, you’d better know what you’re blogging about, because even the acknowledged experts in various areas get savaged by the readers of the blogosphere on even minute points. Don’t believe me? Just read slashdot.org.
On number 5, Have a realistic idea of your skill set: The big takeaway, is REALISTIC. Attempting to bluff or fake skills and experience you don’t have, is grounds for dismissal with prejudice and sometimes, legal action. If you haven’t done it before, make sure you’ve done something similar. If you haven’t got the skills and experience, and haven’t done anything similar, you need to rethink your approach to the position.
3.Get people to use you as a reference – This is a great idea.
Something else that is useful, is using linkedin and getting recommended by colleagues. I have found that this site is extremely useful, because the more recommendations you have the easier time you have applying for a job and it allows you to be introduced to a prospective employer directly through your reference, who also knows the employer. I guess it goes with the saying, sometimes it’s who you know, not what you know.
Maybe this works in sales or marketing. But in IT, you better either a) know someone, or b) meet the specific requirements. Otherwise you’re lucky if you even get a rejection note. Let alone an “informational interview” (which must be something new. From what I’ve seen, companies barely have time for real interviews.)
No offense, but any idiot can have a blog. Unless it’s very well known, no one cares. Even passing a dozen tough certification exams means next to nothing nowadays. Only relevant experience matters. The best way to get the experience required for your next job is to overachieve at your current job.
In a recession, companies can afford to be extremely picky and can get exactly what they asked for.
It is supply and demand. With an over-supply of emnployees, companies don’t have to settlefor candidates with skills that come close to their requirements, but actually get the candidates that meet exactly what they are looking for.
This is regardless of who writes the job posting.
This recession is not limited to finacial jobs. It is rippling across the economy. 40,000 fincanil services jobs lost so far mean that there are 40,000 less customers with discretionary income. Retailers are getting hit, and this will conitue to escalate.
Allstate – 109 IT jobs lost.
Wachovia – 500 jobs being cut.
Motorola – 2,600 more jobs being cut.
It is more than just positioning yourself. You are now in competition with everyone else who thinks they can do that job, whether they are qualified or not. That means you have to work smarter and harder than the next person.
Know the industry, know the competitors of your target company. know the stock price, the stock symbol. Who is the CEO? Number of employees, revenues? What products / services do they make deliver? Then you must know yourself. know what you can do to help the company. How are your skills going to benefit that company over the next candidate sitting in the waiting room.
But be very careful about how you move up. Never ever sell up on something you do not know how to do. Never lie. In IT, either you know a programming language, or you don’t.
#4. Totally agree. When I said I blogged about Music Marketing, I needed to know my facts, my major players and have a strong opinion on what works and doesn’t. Blogging on a niche makes you an expert whether you asked for it or not!
#5 Knowing your skill set is crucial. More so that you do NOT get into a career that does not suit you well. Flying into space sounds like amazing fun but if you can’t fly spacecrafts and get sick while flying you need to stay away. (That was an extreme case but you get the point!)
Thanks P for starting out the week good!
Despair.com scores again on consulting:
http://www.despair.com/consulting.html
I especially like #5. Have a realistic idea of your skill set.
Once you know your skill set then you can focus on the job description to determine what’s really being asked for and why. Many job descriptions don’t really tell the whole story why the company is looking to fill a certain position. I would not hesitate to apply for those jobs that appear to be achievable even though not every single requirement in the job description can be met. The important thing is to be truthful, make your best pitch and let the hiring people make their decision. They may surprise you with a job offer for reasons you’ll know why.
Penny,
I agree that the only way to gain new experiences to add to one’s resume is by incrementally expanding on one’s duties in current or future positions – even in the lofty echelons of the I.T. world.
But, that being said, I think that the title of today's blog is a bit of an exaggeration. Very few people can shimmy into a job that's way beyond their experience level. One needs not only the huevos of a bull, but the chupaz of a college student who has never known failure, to aspire to leapfrog others into such a position. Then, there is proving one's worthiness for the post against others with superior qualifications.
More power to those who try, but I think that a more practical endeavor is to shoot for the top position, but really aspire to the position of satellite to the big dog who holds the prime position, e.g. interview for director, but really prove your worth to the decision makers as assistant director.
Just a tactic I've seen others use successfully. With a little time, the top position will be yours eventually :)
What is an “informational interview”, and how does one go about setting one up? Of what benefit is an informational interview to an employer?
To Dale:
If you’re applying to be my assistant director, you’d better have a verifiable and proven track record of management and technical success before you’ll even be considered. Fresh ideas aren’t enough, and huevos and chuzpa aren’t going to cut it if you can’t walk the walk. My senior technical staff will shred you and toss you out, if you think you can fake them out well enough to get a job way beyond your technical skills and experience.
During the Y2K prep, far too many companies have been burned by the sharp, confident, slick talking wunderkind, who has all these great ideas, but is totally frustrated at the problems in the implementation phase. Their normal response is to leave for greener pastures, and leave it to the rest of us to clean up the mess, calm the uproar and make things work. Such ugly, expensive, and messy experiences have made many organizations more than a little critical and skeptical of applicants to senior positions with little or no relevant experience.
This blog says it all: http://www.brazencareerist.com/2008/04/09/you-can-at-least-pretend-that-you-can-wait-to-lead/
And the closing line is the killer: “Your chance to lead is coming. But you've got to prove you can do the job first.”
1. Most employers don’t have time for these types of interviews. Might be a good way to fact find about what you really need to bring to the table to hired somewhere.
2. Consultant = unemployed, unless you work/worked for Deloitte or something. Means nothing for reasons stated above by others.
3. References mean little if the meat and potatoes of the resume don’t make the first cut. Especially if they are from other people who lack experience. You will get found out.
4. Please…..
5. Now this one interests me. If you really do this, you would likely not be applying for a job beyond your skill level to begin with. Nor should you from an ethical standpoint.
Bottom line – you need solid experience to get hired. This is probably more necessary today than it has been in a while.
Instead of shortcuts that don’t work, how about some advice on the importance of tangible, measurable accomplishments, and the time to prove on a resume that you are worth the investment of a company.
Check out non-profits. There is plenty that someone with some unused talents can bring to the table in an environment of limited resources.
Uh…why would you *want* a job way beyond your experience? So you can show up, not have any idea what to do, make a mess of things, and end up getting shown the door?
A related question is how to “jump across” the business/tech chasm. As an IT person who has done a little of everything, often in great depth, my own challenge is how to get into a marketing role. Maybe the path is through web anaytics and data analysis. But sometimes I feel my tech experience is a handicap to creating any kind of “brand” beyond technology.
Some of these notions were unfamiliar to me, but I think Penelope makes a lot of good arguments for “overreaching” in a job search.
I’ve been a job-hopper since graduating from college, and those positions where I’ve been happiest are the ones where I get the congratulatory call, sign the offer letter, and then say, what have I done??
I think if a person is comfortable employing some of these tactics, he or she will feel more fulfilled, career-wise, in the long run.
References are probably THE most important thing here – even if you don’t have the experience, you’ve got to have a strong track record.
Focus on building value and a strong reputation in your current line of work. When you begin to venture out (or a little beyond), you’ll find that your reputation will follow you wherever you go.
To Dave:
Part of the problem in making the jump you want, is that the mindsets of marketing and technology are very different. There are transition programs, similar to the Technology MBA at U of Washington, so the phenomenon is not unknown. The good news is that technology touches everything, so the transition can be a lot easier than at first glance.
To JC:
There’s a BIG difference between stretching and overreaching. I don’t mind job-hoppers, since I’ve done some myself. The only question I would have is, did you stay long enough to see your projects through to completion?
To Paul:
I slightly disagree. References are important, but if you don’t have a realistic apprasial of what you can and can’t do, everything else is just makeup.
I disagree with the blog bashers. Have you spent any time writing one lately?
I started two a few months ago to promote my work as a graphic designer and writer. Yes, I can see if you stick it out, you will become an expert. Any blog that is long running, regular in its postings and has a respectable amount of viewers, definitely points to a talented author.
Here’s why:
What initially seems like a long list of topic ideas, quickly runs dry. You’re forced to research, research research for new ideas and data. Comments contribute to a blog writer’s knowledge. A comment will surely point out any errors and/or add informative ideas to the pot.
Blogging takes organization and commitment. Initially, I could whip off a day’s posting in 15-30 minutes. Then when the research factor set in, I started spending an hour or more. Any blog that’s long running and regular in its postings reflects dedication and commitment to carrying through on a project. When I need to hire someone for my business, you can bet I’ll be impressed by a long-term blogger.
A successful blog with even an iota of viewers requires strategic marketing tactics. Penelope didn’t just start writing one day and immediately have her devoted following. I’m betting it took quite a while before we all discovered her. And it certainly must take daily attention to continue this following – marketing attention, not just writing.
Nope. Blogging is not to be bashed. Anything that gets us involved in reading and writing (writing beyond the abbreviated text messaging Generation Y so infamously relies on) is something to be valued.
I agree with The Mushroom Factor. Only because I want it to be true.
To jrandom,
You make a good point about “stretching” vs “overreaching”. I guess the best way to explain how I feel about work is to compare it to exercise: I *could* plod away at the same resistance and hit a plateau eventually – while staying on the treadmill – or I could keep upping the challenge. I prefer the latter. This is probably characterized better as “stretching”.
As far as completing projects, not only do I think building up a reputation of completing projects is essential, I also think it’s important to make time for improving processes and documenting accomplishments (but then, I work in heavily production-dependent environments, so it’s a struggle to think about anything except getting the stuff out on time). This is also an important point – job hopping for the sake of doing so is less than admirable.
I really agree with 5# Have a realistic idea of your skill set.
It's important to have realistic expectations to keep your spirits high.
To Mushroom Factor and Mark:
Blogging NEEDS to be bashed if you are presenting yourself as an expert without knowledge, exeperiece, or know-how. In such cases, if it’s not expertise you’re writing about, it’s just a monologue of your opinions.
To JC:
Stretching is going from 175 lbs to 200 lbs. Overreaching is going from 175 lbs to 350 lbs.
5 ***** Penelope – Shooting way above your skill set is also a great way to get interview experience in your field and to eventually land a job that sometimes seems out of reach.
I agree with a lot of the comments re getting people on your level to use you as a reference. Time to interview a few of my friends and business associates for the position. I say interview, because you really want to know what that person will say about you and place a significant amount of trust in them.
Being in the IT field many here had posted how hard it is to get a different position. I can confirm that myself. IT is a tight field and while employers are screaming for additional H1b us US citizens (IT field) are crying ‘foul.’ Yet we hear of companies laying off, including IT and yet companies ask for more H1b’s?? Something smells to me and it stinks!
Even though I am currently employed we were told that there may be layoffs in our IT organization. Granted that I have 10 computer certifications as well as an MBA, I haven’t had an interview in several months. Sure I could get a job as a desk-jocky but I am beyond that and besides who would hire an MBA graduate to go out and replace your keyboard and mouse?
As to the job fairs … you’re better off staying home. That is unless you want to get into sales, killing bugs, or working in a hotel as a maid. But I will tell you this – go out and spend a couple of bucks and buy “Bait and Switch” and get a better picture what it REALLY is like in the REAL world!
I think the first sentence in this post is by far the most true and relevant point. If you have a high learning curve and don’t feel like you are accomplishing anything you will get worn down in a hurry. You don’t want to put yourself in a position where people question your skills as to why they hired you.
Some further thoughts:
The title and accompanying text are confusing. The title proclaims, “How to get a job that’s way beyond your experience”.
The text states, “So you are going to have a hard time getting a job that's a LITTLE BIT BEYOND YOU if you don't really believe that you're good at what you are saying you're good at.”
Which is it, way beyond or a little beyond? There is a BIG difference. The former, to me, is overreaching, the latter, to me, is stretching.
In my opinion, it’s good to stretch. Overreaching will either get you laughed at or scorned.
On point 2, selling yourself as a consultant, the text states, “Tough part: Learning how to sound like a consultant if you've only trained to do an interview.”
In my view, this is incorrect. Far too many companies got scorched badly by self proclaimed Y2K “expert consultants”, and now demand some sort of credibility, like working for EDS or Deloitte, or a proven track record. That is the hard part of number 2.
On point 4, Blog to become an expert.
In my opinion, blogging doesn’t make you an expert. Learning, doing, making mistakes and correcting them leads you on the path to being an expert in your chosen endeavour. If a blogger doesn’t do this, his (or her) blog is nothing more than a collection of monologues on their opinions.
If you’re starting from scratch, you can blog about your journey to expertise, but you will get savaged continiously by knowledgeable readers if you attempt to pass yourself off as an expert with little or no real world experience. Blogging is just means of communication, not a way to become an expert.
On number 5, having a realistic idea of your skill set.
This applies especially in the technical areas, like IT, engineering, finance and so on, where much of the work is reliant on hard facts and quantifiable results. Far too many would-be applicants for senior positions in these areas have gotten shredded by the technical interviews.
Most engineers, accountants and technicians don’t mind if the director or VP doesn’t have their in-depth knowledge. However, they feel that, if this person is going to manage them, they should share their mindset, have had varied experience in the field, and have a clear vision based on that experience.
If you’re a helpdesk person and you’re applying to become the VP of Technology (something WAY beyond your experience), the senior technical staff won’t even leave a grease spot of you after the technical interview.
I guess the big question you have to ask is:
Do you need to be a Mechanic to drive the car?
If the answer is yes, then you need to have that experience.
But if you only need to know how to change your oil, check your oil, change a flat, and maintain the car, then go ahead and go for it.
Funny how a lot of CTO’s have no hands on technology experience. and many CEO’s jump from one industry to another without any knowledge of the industry they are entering.
To Jim:
What you are talking about is that old Peter Drucker idea that any manager can manage any kind of people in any kind of industry. Seeing the train wrecks in business over the last 10 years, I think that’s been pretty well debunked.
It didn’t help Alan Malawali to jump from Boeing to Ford, and it certainly didn’t help Al Dunlap when he went from Scott to Sunbeam. Perhaps the biggest flameout was Carly Fiorina going from Lucent to Hewlett-Packard. She really didn’t understand the legacy of Bill and Dave, she couldn’t connect with the people who worked for her, and she totally underestimated the damage her moves caused the company. The last 10 years are littered with the dead careers of CEOs, CIOs, CFOs and other senior managers who have jumped from one industry and crashed spectacularly in another.
Each industry has it’s own mindset, quirks, and special circumstances that can only be learned “on the floor”.
and now demand some sort of credibility, like working for EDS or Deloitte, or a proven track record. That is the hard part of number 2.
EDS??? Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I agree with some of the best salesman in the business, but once the contract is signed and all of your IT people have been laid-off, then they will screw you big time.
There are enough unqualified idiots around. When you need something done — whether it’s intake at a hospital or getting your car fixed — I hope you aren’t served by someone in the job way beyond their experience!
Great article. Everyone should always aspire to better themselves. What better way to better yourself than better your career?
There is stiff competition in the job market. Unemployment is on the rise. Large numbers of applications are received by companies for limited number of posts. But there is dearth of skilled manpower in the industry. So both potential find a job resort to online job portals which are a powerful medium in the era of Internet. There are certain websites which offer better services if paid for them. But, Jobbi.com is one exception that provides all its services absolutely free.
Jobbi.com believes in keeping things simple and easy as far as possible. The registration process of the site consists of few easy steps unlike other sites whose sign up process is unnecessarily lengthy and time consuming. The user can straightway apply for jobs or post his jobs after the completion of registration process. The portal also offers free resume search for candidates so that they can get access to best of resumes to build their effective profiles. It also has three samples or templates of resume which the user can copy and paste and then edit to suit their requirements.
Apart from employers and job seekers, other users are also benefited by Jobbi.com. Its HeadHunt program enables users to search for potential candidates and jobs and provide them to employers and candidates. So they act as a connecting medium between employers and employees. But, companies don't make payments to these headhunters for providing them manpower. Instead, they are adequately compensated by Jobbi. Moreover, candidates need to fill out one basic application form instead of different forms for all kinds of search jobs. Employers can only add certain customized questions as per their requirements. As a result, there is no need for lengthy repetitive applications. All these features speed up the job search process and satisfy the needs of the clients quickly and effectively.
http://www.jobbi.com/
Interesting article. Thanks.
I do have one question and it is a general one at that.
Does anyone or has anyone ever had the feeling that for all the wise words of wisdom that can be found in business literature about how organisations (companies) should be run, that in actual fact, the reality of things is that you actually see and experience the opposite?
A bit vague? Let me clarify.
There are countless business guru’s in the world today – in fact there seem to be countless guru’s in every aspect of human life – so this might apply to them to. With all these experts and their bright ideas, when you do in fact engage and experience the business world, do you really see the wisdom that is being touted around as the best way of doing things, actually in operation and actually working? My experience is – no.
Some principles do seem to be in operation, howevr just how diligently they are applied is another matter altogether. Suprisingly to me, some of the biggest brands are the worst defaulters on these business strategies and spend more time in a murky fuzz of indecision as to who is responsible for what, let alone following the latest and greatest approach to management and or leadership.
The above might seem totally out of step with this particular post, however to me, it says – why not go one or two notches above your level of experiene or competence? It might just be that your attitude and courage are probably more important than your actual skills. Not in every field mind you, but for most businesses. The weaknesses of the systems of organisations to actually understand what they need, yet still acknowledge that they need something or someone, might mean that they are open to taking some chances. At the very least it is worth taking a chance if there really is nothing left to lose.
firsteval i would like to say thank you so much for every one participate to creat such a site ,because it is very useful for all people especialy youngs,but i have a small criticize what ever we do to get ajob ,what you have mentiond abov and more but the result in most of time is negativa thanhs.
The second comment summarized my thoughts exactly – “personal branding”. However, there was not any help given on how to do that. So let me tag-team. I have found the best way to brand yourself is connecting with website that does most of the work for you. I have been using PersonaVita for my personal branding. They are experts in this area and have set up everything to help you brand yourself. I would strongly recommend it.
wayyyyy!!!! to many pages!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! CUTT ITT DOWN LADYY!!!
I like what you had to say about everything. It really made me rethink the process of an interveiw and how to put myself out there. Thank You. I am looking for a job and I’m trying to get into some kind of line that will make me look better for when I am ready for what I would really like to do. I accepted the whole new idea thing because it would work for me. I’m looking forward to hopefully hearing more.
Krysteena
I visited your web site for the first time and find it very interesting.
Carrol spncr
Job Description
Hello, My name is Thomas Cernota and I received an MBA from the University of St Thomas.
I have held management positions for over 10 years and have been in the work force for over 30 years.
I have years of experience in interviewing individuals for professional positions.
If you check out my site http://youvegotthejob.com/ you will find my
new book “You’ve Got The Job: What Ever Job Seeker Should Know About Getting That Dream Job”
that covers job searching, networking, interviewing and creating resumes.
I liked what I read then I read a reply saying Why would someone want a job beyond their experience? Some people like to challenge themselves and want to push themselves upwards and strive for more.
I believe that becoming an expert by blogging is a great way to get yourselves known. Employers/Recruiters would be more willing to take a chance if they could see that you are truly passionate about the subject. The site http://www.jobhop.co.uk allows you to show case your skills and blog about your expertise to browsing Employers & Recruiters. Just another way of landing your dream job.
You brought in a lot of confidence in me, absolutely fantastic article. Have already shared this with facebook!@bose
I Googled almost your exact title and found your blog! I was searching, because the jobs I seem to be drawn to are beyond my level of experience, but I still want to apply anyways. You have great advice.
I really liked this article, Penelope!
I was hoping you had a link to some post about “how to sound like a consultant if you’ve only trained to do an interview.”
I think that would be a great ebook! I’d buy that.