It’s pretty well established that non-science degrees are not necessary for a job. In fact, the degrees cost you too much money, require too long of a commitment, and do not teach you the real-life skills they promise.
Yet, I do tons of radio call-in shows where I say that graduate degrees in the humanities are so useless that they actually set you back in your career in many cases. And then 400 callers dial-in and start screaming at me about how great a graduate degree is.
Here are the six most common arguments they make. And why they are wrong.
1. My parents are paying.
Get them to buy you a company instead. Because what are you going to do when you graduate? You’re right back at square one, looking for a job and not knowing what to do. But if you spent the next three years running a company, even if it failed, you would be more employable than you are now, and you’d have a good sense of where your skill set fits in the workplace. (This is especially true for people thinking about business school.)
2. It’s free.
But you’re spending your time. You will show (on your resume) that you went to grad school. Someone will say, “Why did you go to grad school?” Will you explain that it was free? After all, it’s free to go home every night after work and read on a single topic as well. So in fact, what you are doing is taking an unpaid internship in a company that guarantees that the skills you built in the internship will be useless. (Here’s how to get a great internship.)
3. It’s a time to grow and get to know myself better.
If you’re looking for a life changing, spiritually moving experience, how about therapy? It’s a more honest way of self-examination—no papers and tests. And it’s cheaper. Insurance covers therapy because it’s a proven way to effectively change your personal disposition. There’s a reason insurance doesn’t cover grad school.
4. The degree makes me stand out in my field.
Yes, if you want to stand out as someone who couldn’t get a job. Given the choice between getting paid to learn the ropes on the job and paying for someone to teach you, you look like an underachiever to pick the latter. If nothing else, you get much better coaching in life if you are good enough and smart enough to get mentorship without paying for it.
There are very very few jobs that require a non-science degree in order to get the job. (And really, forget about law school if that’s what you’re thinking.) So if you don’t need the degree in order to get the job, the only possible reason a smart employer would think you got the degree instead of getting a job was because you were too scared to have to apply or you applied and got nothing. Either way, you’re a bad bet going forward.
5. I’m planning on teaching.
Forget it. There are no teaching jobs. In an interview last week, the head of University of Washington’s career center even admitted to a prospective student that getting a degree in humanities in order to get a teaching job—even in a community college—is a long-shot at best. And, the University of Washington career coach confirmed that there is enormous unemployment among people who are qualified to teach college courses but cannot get jobs doing it. This is not just a Washington thing. It’s a welcome-to-reality thing.
6. A degree makes job hunting easier.
It makes it harder. Forget the fact that you don’t need a graduate degree in the humanities to get any job in the business world. The biggest problem is that the degree makes you look unemployable. You look like you didn’t know what to do about having to enter the adult world, so you decided to prolong childhood by continuing to earn grades rather than money even though you were not actually helping yourself to earn money.
Also, you also look like you don’t really aspire to any of the jobs you are applying for. People assume you get a graduate degree because you want to work in that field. People don’t want to hire you in corporate America when it’s clear you didn’t invest all those years in grad school in order to do something like that.
7. I love being in graduate school! Everything in life is not about careers!
Sure, when you’re a kid, everything is not about careers. But when you grow up, everything is about earning enough money for food and shelter. So you need to figure out how to do that in order to make the transition from childhood to adulthood. This is why millionaires have stopped leaving their money to their kids—it undermines their transition to adulthood. But instead of making the transition, you are still in school, pretending things are fine. The problem is that what you do in school is not what you will do in a career. So if you love school, you’ll probably hate the career it’s preparing you for, since your career is not going to school.
When I met the farmer, one of the first things he told me was that he went to school for genetic biology. But in graduate school his research was in ultrasound technology for pigs. But he missed being with the pigs, which is what he wanted to do for his job. So he left school.
And every time I see the pigs on our farm I think about how he took a risk by dumping a graduate program in order to tend to pigs. I love that.

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This article savors strongly of bitterness. I bet that you applied six or seven times to graduate school before giving up on it. Don’t rain on the parade of others just because you couldn’t cut it.
Posted by Rosie on October 1, 2011 at 2:05 am | permalink |
Rosie,
You hit the bulls-eye here. Congrats!
Posted by Jim Capatelli on March 18, 2012 at 8:07 am | permalink |
It sounds like the author has an envy-driven bitterness to those who went the extra mile or two in their education. These counterarguments are so subjective it’s painful to read. I might suggest a Masters in English to make better points.
Posted by Morgan on October 31, 2011 at 11:15 am | permalink |
I have a graduate degree, and a tenured university job…and graduate school was the biggest mistake I’ve made in my life.
Posted by Jennm59 on October 31, 2011 at 1:50 pm | permalink |
Humanities are not for everyone, but they remain essential to a democratic society. Einstein said it best:
“It is not enough to teach a man a specialty. Through it he may become a kind of useful machine, but not a harmoniously developed personality. It is essential that the student acquire an understanding of and a lively feeling for values. He must acquire a vivid sense of the beautiful and of the morally good…..He must learn to understand the motives of human beings, their illusions and their sufferings, in order to acquire a proper relationship to individual fellow men and to the community. These precious things are conveyed to the younger generation through personal contact with those who teach, not–or at least not in the main–through text books. It is this that primarily constitutes and preserves culture. This is what I have in mind when I recommend the “humanities” as important, not just dry specialized knowledge in the fields of history and philosophy. Overemphasis on the competitive system and premature specialization on the ground of immediate usefulness kill the spirit on which all cultural life depends, specialized knowledge included.”
Posted by Gretta on November 27, 2011 at 11:59 pm | permalink |
Hi penelope,
when you say “There are very very few jobs that require a non-science degree in order to get the job.”
what if i want to become an art teacher but my bachelor degree was in english (literature)?
I’ve been out of undergrad for 2 years now and have some work experience art related in galleries and an art magazine but would these credentials on paper be enough for let’s say an elementary/pre-school to even consider me for art teaching or even art teacher’s assistant positions?
sidenote: i went to a well-known high school for fine arts for 4 years (currently still listed on my resume) but im sure people think who cares what you did in high school after a certain point right?
help : /
-extremely confused
Posted by extremely confused on January 4, 2012 at 9:59 am | permalink |
I couldn’t agree more! The only thing I would add is all higher education should be more specific to a career field. It takes five years to get a four year degree and most of what you learn will not apply in the real world. It is a shame that most students that graduate from college come out with a lot of debt and few skills. Most don’t even become employed in a field related to their degree. What a waste!
Posted by Ronnie Holt on January 15, 2012 at 9:23 pm | permalink |
“The problem is that what you do in school is not what you will do in a career. So if you love school, you’ll probably hate the career it’s preparing you for, since your career is not going to school.”
I’m living this. Thanks P. Where were you 6 years ago? I’m starting my lost stage now and I’m 28.
I think I’ll be leaving the grad school off my resume.
Posted by MKK on January 22, 2012 at 5:40 am | permalink |
i dont undertsand wat the convo’s about i came here to check for ear defenders.
Posted by nameless on February 6, 2012 at 12:44 pm | permalink |
I am in grad school right now to be a speech-language pathologist. I would not have done it if I didn’t have to, but its the only way to get certified and be able to work in the hospital, schools etc. I don’t regret my decision, and thankfully will graduate with very few loans to pay back since I am also a graduate assistant at my school. I do agree with you that some fields don’t require it, in my case it does.
Posted by SLPgradstudent on March 1, 2012 at 11:43 am | permalink |
This article and the entire ensuing discussion completely fail to appreciate the developments in the U.S. economy and drastically diminished prospects for “successful” career paths under the “new normal”.
The debate between grad school and work experience no longer really holds any meaning and this will increasingly be the case for some time. Why? The economies of the West are rapidly disarticulating and ever more concentrated wealth and power is amassing in the hands of an oligarchic few who have no need for the structural social and economic balance that accompanied the Fordist and even Post-Fordist eras.
I believe many young people are opting for grad school not because they believe it will enhance their careers, but because they are well aware that many traditional career paths are closing off and grad school offers a way to avoid facing that reality as they can live off stipends and student loans and maintain some semblance of financial independence.
These conditions necessitate creative new avenues for subsistence, personal fulfillment and life choices as well as a considerable lowering of expectations.
In that sense, the writer of this article knows very little about which she speaks. Graduate school is a “career path” in and of itself: If you can manage to extract a livable income from a university stipend or a subsidized graduate loan, you should do it and for as long as possible. Period.
Posted by Sean on March 15, 2012 at 3:49 pm | permalink |
Kudos, Sean. Superb post. Well written and well stated.
Posted by Jim Capatelli on March 18, 2012 at 8:06 am | permalink |
You seem overly bitter for someone young with a promising future.
I went to grad school hoping to teach college history. This appears an unlikely outcome, especially in the state of California. But I also went to know things I didn’t already know, and in this way grad school might have been the best time of my life.
I think you are right to caution people against getting advanced degrees that are not in demand. I should have looked into this more because one can’t trust the Bureau of Labor and Statistics. I asked a few professors while I was taking classes preparing for grad school, and even they seemed to believe there was opportunity, or felt obligated to support their profession. Now they don’t seem to know me.
Anyway, I’m not bitter. History is a calling for me in some way, though I’m not sure how exactly.
It is also worth introducing the idea of spiritual vocation. I ground it out in the corporate world for a decade, and finally faced a forced resignation. If I was still there I might have had a stroke or heart attack by now.
Posted by adam marshall on March 15, 2012 at 11:01 pm | permalink |
Well, I think this attack on the well-educated reveals two things:
1) Ms. Trunk’s own personal insecurities about her lack of education. Obviously, she knows that she’s been judged—probably correctly—for the fact that she’s missing an advanced degree. And this is her way of striking back. The entire post has a very juvenile, pre-adolescent tone to it.
It’s also a way for Trunk to get attention. She knows that being a bit sensational and snarky will draw viewers. However, in the long run, this will hurt her.
2) This snarky and not well thought out post is representative of the “dumbing down” of American culture. The hatred of smart, accomplished people in an academic setting has been encouraged by political extremists and charlatans for a long, long time. Sorry to see Trunk jump on this idiotic path.
The fact the Trunk strongly advocates home “schooling” while denigrating the organized, traditional public and private school, is indicative of her mentality. It’s all of one piece—and not the least bit surprising.
Posted by Jim Capatelli on March 18, 2012 at 8:04 am | permalink |
At the risk of feeding the trolls, I have to reply that Mr. Capatelli is not reading Ms. Trunk’s argument very carefully. Look in the comments and see that she had in fact attended grad school, but found that writing is better learned by actually writing. The result is not an attack on *existing* advanced degree holders, but an admonishment to *prospective* grad students that their finite resources are better spent elsewhere.
This is not a “My professor is a schlub” essay; the closest it gets is to crticize the ruinously escalating costs of grad school, itself an objectively verifiable fact. The real cost of college has, by most metrics, tripled between the current generation of students and their parents. Risking your nest egg is not enough anymore; today’s students must pre-emptively sign away a lifetime of sweat and toil on the tenuous promises of the academics that Mr. Capatelli esteems so much. Expect uncomfortable questions about the value of such a proposition, and a gritty determination to find lower cost substitutes that disintermediate the educational establishment, to continue.
Posted by M. Rad. on March 18, 2012 at 11:28 am | permalink |
As a 50-something person with a Bachelor’s Degree in Social Science, I’ve returned to school in a technical field for a number of reasons.
A second Bachelor degree is what I originally decided upon, but I’m attending a state college and post-bac students in pursuit of a second bachelor’s degree are pretty much ruled-out of admission.
A Master’s is on the horizon. It won’t cost substantially more than another Bachelor’s and the course of study is deep and comprehensive. I think it will make the rest of my life a lot more enjoyable and completely relevant to the experiences that I want to engage in.
While I can agree that the cost of post-secondary education is out of control and the ROI for education is abysmal, I don’t think that the education system is at fault.
I don’t buy any of Ms. Trunk’s arguments that a Master’s degree is a waste of time and an indication of someone (even a young and unemployed someone) who is shirking “real-world” experience.
Her position is disrespectful of those who are earnest in their pursuit of a specific type of knowledge and dismissive of a method of education with which she has issues. Having been a student of both, I can say without qualification that formal education is just as ‘real’ an experience as education at the School of Hard Knocks.
Wages (real spendable dollars) for the working class have been on the decline for decades. This is due to the current politics of capitalism and the idea that it is right and good for a few to control the wealth and the commonwealth, to amass personal fortune at the expense of many, and to take no social responsibility for doing so. In regard to this askew amassing of wealth, even John Bogle, founder of the Vanguard Mutual Fund Group and creator of the first index mutual fund, has asked, how much is enough? (Read his book, “Enough: True Measures of Money, Business, and Life”.)
Scapegoating the educational system and declaring that Master Degree studies are, among other things, a marker of laziness is a smoke-and-mirrors ploy to divert attention from the real problem. It is designed to glorify ignorance and the virtue of stupidity: ‘cause all that book-learnin’ ain’t gonna do you no good anyhow.
It’s revolting.
Posted by KC on March 25, 2012 at 9:56 pm | permalink |
Whilst I think you make some valid points, I think you’re sweeping with rather a massive brush. It really depends on the individual and his or her circumstances and goals. Some people I know go back to university to pursue postgrad degrees to try and cover up their subpar performance at undergraduate level or.. like you said in point 7.. because they don’t want to enter the “real world” and want to still live life as a student and I’m sure employers are aware of that, but in my field I absolutely need to complete a Masters because I am studying Chemical Engineering and here in the UK, to become a chartered engineer you need to complete a Masters (MEng) as well as a Bachelors. I’m sure it’s similar in the US, or at least it is in other fields.. Medicine and Law particularly.
I also know people who got their Bachelor degrees in their 20s and returned to university for post-grad in their later years, either on the dime of their employer or when they’ve been made redundant and got a generous redundancy package to fund a Masters/MBA programme.
Posted by Liz G from the UK on April 11, 2012 at 1:11 am | permalink |
Awesome post Penelope. I wanted to go to grad school after I finished my undergrad (in the Humanities). Instead, I took a leap of faith, hopped on a plane to Spain and, taught English for 7 months.
Upon returning, I got a job (unrelated to my degree) in an office at my alma mater, and will likely be promoted several times in the next several years and beyond. Had I went to grad school, I’d be unhappily busting my ass for a graduate degree that would do nothing for me except get me more student loans, and probably make it even harder for me to find a job.
The crazy part of it all is, my current job allows me to take classes at my university for FREE, and those credits can be used to getting a Master’s degree (or another Bachelor’s).
So, now I am learning about LIFE rather than how to get good grades. Getting my Bachelor’s degree has been very helpful, but going for a Master’s would have been a huge mistake. Penelope, you helped me figure that out in the summer of 2010, and I will always be thankful for that.
Thanks again for all of your insightful posts Penelope, you have seriously changed my life for the better!
Posted by Doug on April 16, 2012 at 11:27 am | permalink |
I would also like to add that, even though my job allows me to take classes for free, I don’t intend to take advantage of this unless it would provide for a sure-fire benefit to my career. I have learned so much more about life since I finished school than when I did while living in the bubble of Academia. Life outside of Academia is so much better, and provides for much more important life experiences!
Posted by Doug on April 16, 2012 at 11:32 am | permalink |
It is the law in some states that public school teachers must have a masters. I would lose my job if I did not have one!
Posted by helen on April 20, 2012 at 6:31 am | permalink |
Whaaattt?? There are NO teaching jobs? None? Anywhere? We don’t need well-educated, qualified teachers who can think in complex ways? Penelope, where do you get your facts? I must know this source so I can cite it in one of my useless grad school papers.
Posted by Frau Jones on May 9, 2012 at 7:13 pm | permalink |
I had to share this video: http://www.chicagoideas.com/videos/111
I don’t know how to embed a link in a comment-sorry! I am so happy that people are finally talking about this openly. Not everyone should go to college(let alone grad school)!
Posted by Ellie on May 15, 2012 at 1:50 pm | permalink |
You’ve got to admit this is a pretty divisive issue from what’s being said here.
Personally if you want to be a career academic then by all means that’s great.
My former thesis supervisor was more of a scholar advocate for better, healthier local organic food in hospitals – even a career academic can do their part to making the world a better place.
When I sent the original related article to a PhD friend of mine he certainly wasn’t thrilled or impressed and of course I had to remind him that I also took a environmental sci masters graduate degree too (so in a way I was perhaps mocking myself).
I’ve found that it’s hard and takes time to break the conditioning of the traditional schooling system – it really doesn’t teach you the most important skills of persuasion and expressing the value you have to offer.
That I learned only from working with nonprofits as a partial link to a thesis project.
That eventually led me to marketing and careers and entrepreneurship.
Ultimately the real test for everyone’s individual case is whether they can do what they’re doing and still put food on the table.
And if you can and still enjoy what you do then wonderful.
Fair winds,
Sunny Lam
http://shinobicareercoach.com
Author of 101 Job Search Hacks: A Cheat Sheet for Landing the Job You Want (http://shinobicareercoach.com/scc/101-job-search-hacks-cheat-sheet)
Author of The Zen of Job Search – Get Attention! 10 Ideas That Really Work (http://amzn.to/K6j6Ny).
Posted by Sunny Lam on May 16, 2012 at 9:02 am | permalink |
I don’t know what job postings you’re looking at, but almost every one I’m looking at requires at least a 4 year degree. These are permanent, secure, and most importantly, positions I would like to do. And what about people like myself who leave a low-paying, low-potential position to do an M.A. and get almost instantly rewarded career-wise? But then again, I went to school in Canada where it’s practically free. $6500 for a 1 year M.A. and I’m making more 22,000 per year than I was before…useless, EH?
Posted by Thizzle on May 24, 2012 at 3:56 pm | permalink |
This is so misguided. Yes, I am graduating from grad school this month. I landed an amazing graduate job – one that I beat out 550 law-commerce-business students for, AND this semester I taught 8 classes per week. My relationships with my lecturers would enable me to lecture if I had choosen to undertake a PHD. How terrible.
Posted by Jono on June 7, 2012 at 10:08 pm | permalink |
Hogs are as smart as dogs. END THE HOGOCAUST.
Posted by silia on June 26, 2012 at 9:18 pm | permalink |
Having a graduate degree and being familiar with the struggles to find a job, I can only agree. I’d probably add – if you really really consider grad school, do your research first and find what you’re really passionate about. Don’t do it just because you have no idea of what you would do instead a continuing with your undergrad thesis seems acceptable. On the bright side, being a graduate student really opens up the door to the cutting-edge research and the community around, helping you to know the possibilities. Sometimes I think – if only I had the same kind of opportunities during my undergrad, I’d be much more competent to choose my further research topic.
Posted by whattosay on July 3, 2012 at 1:58 pm | permalink |
Penelope may rethink her comment after she shows up in the emergency room and the uneducated high school drop out can’t read her chart or knows what to do while she is barely hanging on!
Posted by Kathy on July 10, 2012 at 6:13 pm | permalink |
I have a grad degree. I wish I had the money to invest. If you are in a job that will get you promoted, go ahead. But if you are changing careers, don’t do it. It won’t matter.
Posted by Jeane on July 27, 2012 at 6:19 pm | permalink |
I loved this post! in the absence of ‘decent’ mentorship we follow the rules, because they are based on projected fears. For me one needs to develop a set of instincts, and the educational system gets to you first, so its very difficult to embrace ‘not going to grad school’ mentality when you running against the tide you know.
For me, we need to get these idea’s across earlier on in the process – its almost too late when someone is considering going to grad school.
The system needs people who go to grad school.
I wish I had read this article in 1994, my path may have been so different. But I do hope that one always strays back to the path one was meant to walk on, even if it took you longer than you intended to get there….
Posted by Simon Minitzer on July 31, 2012 at 5:21 am | permalink |
But what if you work full time as you are getting a degree? I worked for a start up that paid my tuition to take graduate classes at night. I graduated with a master’s degree in American Studies – researching digital culture – which has contributed to making me quite competitive. It was an ugly two years – 70 hours a week of work on top of finding time to read books and write papers – but it happened, and I think I’m all the better for it.
Posted by Noah on August 8, 2012 at 8:28 am | permalink |
There are some jobs that require a specific degree (being a therapist, as I am, requires either a masters in social work or counseling psychology, or a doctorate in psychology for some positions) and there are other jobs that look for “a master’s degree in blah blah blah or a related field” and there are other jobs that just want a master’s degree in whatever. This is fairly common in state jobs at least in NYS. You may START at a job that you don’t really need the masters for, and get promoted –but only fully qualify for your promotion because you have some kind of masters.
Posted by Wendy on August 13, 2012 at 11:37 am | permalink |
As someone who went to grad school because I thought it would help me get a better job after taking time off to raise my kids, I have to say that I wish I had seen this instead. Now I have huge debt and no job because I have too much education to be hired anywhere. I have taken to leaving my graduate degree off my resume just so that I will be considered for positions. Pathetic.
Posted by Kimberly H. on August 30, 2012 at 6:32 pm | permalink |
Sorry, but this is news? Who are these people in the humanities telling kids to go to graduate school? I have a doctorate in the humanities, and was tenured at a major research university three years ago, and no student loans, and I give anyone asking for a recommendation to grad school a two-page document that I wrote called “Don’t Go to Graduate School.” In twelve years of teaching, there is only ONE student to whom I haven’t given it, because she is the ONE student who, of all who asked, who actually has the potential to finish a PhD and get an academic position. And she was mature enough to know that even her betting on academia is a crap shoot at best.
Posted by Barbara Henry on September 11, 2012 at 12:12 pm | permalink |
So now it’s wrong and foolish to just want to do a degree because, God forbid, you actually enjoy the subject? I never thought anyone could ever say that students who go to university are afraid of getting a job, of the real world. I thought it was supposed to be admirable that once you have left school and college, you still want to continue your education to a degree. You make it sound like going to university is just like school. What about moving away from home? Having independence? That’s not childish. When people grow up they move away from home-degree students do that too. Life is not about careers, and neither is it about education, but each to their own, and those who wish to do a degree in their chosen subject should not be mocked for it, or belittled. When I leave university, I don’t think for one second I will get my dream job straight away, but university prepares you for that, or at least the English universities do, I don’t know about American ones.
Posted by Holly on September 25, 2012 at 4:15 pm | permalink |
I agree with Penelope about Grad school. Someone figured out you could tell people there were zillions of jobs available in the design professions and charge a lot of money for the degrees. I have had friends in other careers who want to work in graphic design and they ask me if I have a graduate degree. I say no, that I learned everything on the job and started out as an assistant to a designer. I tell them to start at the bottom, at a low salary, find a good mentor, and put together a great portfolio.
If you already have an undergraduate degree from an Ivy League university you will look like a dilettante if you go to Grad school in a completely different profession than your original major. Instead you can take courses that are available at low cost online and put together a portfolio of your work.
Posted by Leslie on October 10, 2012 at 2:37 pm | permalink |
Your therapist went to graduate school. And I would not recommend anyone seeing a therapist who didn’t.
Posted by The Jobless Wonder on October 14, 2012 at 1:16 pm | permalink |
I got my MBA from a top-three school and tripled my salary. I don’t know of another thing I could have done in the year and a half I spent in b-school that would have increased my earnings that quickly. Now I have security and something I can fall back on if and when I do decide to take risks with my career. For me, grad school was a great option since I was feeling directionless in my career and had no big ideas for how to get on a more fulfilling track.
Posted by Anonymous on December 7, 2012 at 12:22 pm | permalink |
I’m a year behind here, but I have four things to say (or ask): 1) for the most part, I agree with PT when it comes to the soft skill Masters degrees; 2) I would like to hear what PT has to say about science degrees, especially since all of them do require specific levels of licensure; 3) considering that many jobs do require a Masters, even if getting it is expensive and could be seen as a waste of time compared to on the job skills, then wouldn’t the argument still stand that if you don’t want to re-invent the wheel by starting a company and plan to work for a large company, that you’ll need a Masters? 4) How does this apply to minorities and women? Do you think either groups can get ahead in specific fields without a Masters? Honestly, as a black woman, I’ve been informed by many mentors that to get ahead, I need to consider having a Masters, even in a soft field. Would love to hear your thoughts, and thanks for posting this article!
Posted by Nancy on December 23, 2012 at 3:38 pm | permalink |
so… what do you think, then, of careers that almost require you to have a Master’s degree?
Posted by music student on December 30, 2012 at 10:01 am | permalink |