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	<title>Comments on: How to build a career as an artist</title>
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	<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/</link>
	<description>Advice at the intersection of work and life</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sun, 21 Mar 2010 13:59:21 -0600</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: tim</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-221302</link>
		<dc:creator>tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 17:20:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-221302</guid>
		<description>Your totally nuts dude. Fuck, thank god you were not a writer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your totally nuts dude. Fuck, thank god you were not a writer.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: tim</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-221299</link>
		<dc:creator>tim</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Feb 2010 17:09:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-221299</guid>
		<description>Great post!- I like the the take no prisoners approach. It is a clear headed and valuable look at life as an artist. Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post!- I like the the take no prisoners approach. It is a clear headed and valuable look at life as an artist. Thanks.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: FatBurningFurnace</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-219187</link>
		<dc:creator>FatBurningFurnace</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 07:27:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-219187</guid>
		<description>Treat art the same way, and you will stay sane.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Treat art the same way, and you will stay sane.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Mp3 Rocket Pro</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-219186</link>
		<dc:creator>Mp3 Rocket Pro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 07:27:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-219186</guid>
		<description>Could this ever happen in my life?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Could this ever happen in my life?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Aaron Petz</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-219039</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron Petz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 24 Jan 2010 00:23:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-219039</guid>
		<description>Ugh, making money as an artist. Horrible, the bottom line is money is such a powerful thing that it will sway objectivity in art, as well as arise emotion out of a human either good or bad. With that being said. Make money, and make art... Not make money while making art. :) _A</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ugh, making money as an artist. Horrible, the bottom line is money is such a powerful thing that it will sway objectivity in art, as well as arise emotion out of a human either good or bad. With that being said. Make money, and make art&#8230; Not make money while making art. :) _A</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jonathan of JonathanSteeleWorks.com</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-214747</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan of JonathanSteeleWorks.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Nov 2009 00:58:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-214747</guid>
		<description>You are right in saying that yours was not a friendly post. 

Maybe cynical too. This is not a friendly comment either. Maybe cynical too.

You see, although on some level, in a parallel universe in a different time do agree with you in some twisted way, your words leave me with just one thought. This of course begs the question, have we met before in some other existence. I am happily married and believe me, this is not flirting. But I am curious if the other me has met the other you. I digress.

Have you ever heard of the Fox and the Grapes. It is an Aesops Fable. We condemn the things in life we cannot reach. There may be another answer. 

The grapes only taste good when they are in season and are ripe for picking. Like grapes, making a living with art may be seasonal for some people. 

What you failed to understand is that there are artist and there are successful artists. I do not know of any starving artist. All artists I know are either overweight and out of shape, very successful or not currently practicing artists. The successful artists are in the business of collecting collectors. 

Even writers who are successful are in the business of collecting collectors. In other words, successful artist are business people. 

There are unsuccessful entrepreneurs. Do we call them starving entrepreneurs? No. They are just unsuccessful. Whether failures or not depends on how they look at it.

Me, my philosophy is everything is a win. So, to get into the show I just did on short notice this weekend past, cost me about $150 and to travel across three states. Even if not making a dime it would have been a learning experience. I did not do as good as I hoped to but I did learn a lot. Next year I should do double and get about 4 times the residual sales.

Not getting paid for creating art. Things that make you go hmmmm. Lets carry this thought out. The vast majority of folks do not get paid for sex and enjoy it. My mechanic loves working on cars. Should he not get paid for it? I would love that although he would not be able to do it for long.

And my wife has a hair dresser who loves hair and anything to do with it. She should not get paid for it. Although I think she is better at coloring than I am, my wife still prefers me. Oh yea, I don&#039;t get paid for that either. Actually, my wife does not pay me for the art I create that hangs in our house as well.

As for your choice of words, one of which must have come from your mouth,  I would not have in my hand with out a latex glove to protect it, unless it was dried and I was in a cow pie throwing contest. Well, no wonder you starved. 

As to art emanating from a black hole of choice. This is one of my favorite debates to hate. My camera man in a video commercial I produced that was shot in Long Island, dreams of doing something from the farthest reaches of his inner horror loving soul. However, to just talk to him you would never know he is a closet horror lover. He is one of the kindest people and brilliant artist, not starving and somehow has an affordable rent in New York City.

As to being a real artist and making art no matter what, well, you must not be familiar with right brain vs left brain thinking. My best commission single (occasionally manic depressive and restless) was only 7K. Since being blissfully married, my best commission was over 50K (of course it was a monument work). I could not have made the big piece of art no matter what. It required 6 months and lots of someone else&#039;s money.

As a matter of fact, money has always been an inspiration. I am not a great artist. But money does inspire me in numerous ways and on numerous levels. I do believe it can help create art. Taking this to the absurd, I cannot paint with out paints that cost about $30 per tube and my big canvases cost about $150. Tried stretching them early on. Over stretching makes them a bit funky and warped. Hey, maybe I need to change the name of that early one. Thanks. It shall be called Early Warp In Green. No, just Warped Green. Wow, the creative juices are flowing thanks to you. But then this is a left - right brain thing.

Quitting your day job is essential if your great or if you want to be. If your so so, then work away. Nothing will get the creative juices flowing, at least for me, like working with out a safety net. But then, my 2nd most favorite book was the best selling, &quot;Innovators Solution.&quot; It is a book on the theory of how markets work. It is considered the Bible of Market Theory.

 Let see,that book was the reason for quitting nursing and becoming a self supporting artist. Also, that book resulted in selling 14 pieces outright to to a New Hope PA gallery rather than the typical putting them on consignment. 

Of course they were my first 14 pieces. Way undersold them but hey, I still made a lot of money.

Don&#039;t get me wrong. I was not always an Atlas of the Art Marketing self supporting artists world. I was at one time the equivalent of a 97 pound weakling. Bullies used to kick up copies of Thomas Kinkade in my face at the beach on the weekends.

Those were horrible days. The 7K commission mentioned above won a national interior designers award. Do you think I got another job from it. Nope. However it did launch an industry doing work like mine in all the restaurants around the world. I was not a businessman. I was an artist. Not a successful artist, only one who made a lot of money.


Turns out the 14 pieces I sold, there were ones I did not sell. Well, they just sold this past Sunday in November (09) for between 4 to 10 times what he paid me. Lets see, the six hours of the show resulted in about $3336 in sales.  Oh yea, they fed me too. They even fed my wife. On top of that, we got sandwiches for the trip home.

Just a side note here. I did not make $600 per hour at this show. Someone asked how long it took to create one of my pieces. I said 15 years. So, figuring the time I spent learning how to be a businessman and the art of not being a starving businessman and adding that into the mix, I actually only made an hourly wage. I figure my pay should be more than what I make as a specialist nurse. Any extra over the hours it took to create the work gets divvied up. I pay my book keeper (my wife) and my tax accountant (my wife), my cleaning lady (my wife and I am her assistant) and my secretary ( my wife) and my salesman who gets about 10 % (me and occasionally my wife).

Since she also has a job, this is extra money for her. She has not decided what she will buy with her cut just yet.

Also some of the  money is set aside for paid days off and sick days. I also put some aside for my paid vacation. I am up to four weeks paid vacation now. Of course, if the sales drop, I may have to do like many businesses and make cut backs. The first perk to be cut back will be the four week paid vacation time off. I may gripe and complain about the cutbacks but in the end, I know that they will be important for the success of my not being a starving artist.

Also there is health insurance, dental and eye not to mention unemployment insurance. Most entrepreneurs are not aware that there is unemployment insurance for if you should have to fire yourself or lay yourself off. It is a program managed by most local banks. Just go in and ask about it. It goes by the name, Saving Account.  

So, if I am making $600 per hour then I will not have anything left over for these other expenses.   But if I make a fair and decent wage, not only will these be covered, there will also be money for advertising and putting back into the business.



In the case of this show,  it only cost me 12% commission. But again, the pieces sold for way more than I would have sold them to the gallery owner. 

I guess this speaks to your comment on needing to be a businessman. Here I thought I had to lower the price and  consider them lost leaders in my attempt to collect art collectors. In reality, I needed to charge four times the amount (and actually make money for my time and a profit for my business) and as such, increase their value.

The last comment I agree with. I know a lot of better artist than I am who do not get paid for what they do. I would like to know how good of a networker I am but the creative mind, perhaps an artist who created the UpMo test has sold out. Now a commercial concern owns the name and is making  money from the concept.

Oh yea, the grapes are actually delicious. The only thing, you can only eat them in season. You may have to find other things to eat in the off season.

Best wishes and how ever you fare, may you fare will.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You are right in saying that yours was not a friendly post. </p>
<p>Maybe cynical too. This is not a friendly comment either. Maybe cynical too.</p>
<p>You see, although on some level, in a parallel universe in a different time do agree with you in some twisted way, your words leave me with just one thought. This of course begs the question, have we met before in some other existence. I am happily married and believe me, this is not flirting. But I am curious if the other me has met the other you. I digress.</p>
<p>Have you ever heard of the Fox and the Grapes. It is an Aesops Fable. We condemn the things in life we cannot reach. There may be another answer. </p>
<p>The grapes only taste good when they are in season and are ripe for picking. Like grapes, making a living with art may be seasonal for some people. </p>
<p>What you failed to understand is that there are artist and there are successful artists. I do not know of any starving artist. All artists I know are either overweight and out of shape, very successful or not currently practicing artists. The successful artists are in the business of collecting collectors. </p>
<p>Even writers who are successful are in the business of collecting collectors. In other words, successful artist are business people. </p>
<p>There are unsuccessful entrepreneurs. Do we call them starving entrepreneurs? No. They are just unsuccessful. Whether failures or not depends on how they look at it.</p>
<p>Me, my philosophy is everything is a win. So, to get into the show I just did on short notice this weekend past, cost me about $150 and to travel across three states. Even if not making a dime it would have been a learning experience. I did not do as good as I hoped to but I did learn a lot. Next year I should do double and get about 4 times the residual sales.</p>
<p>Not getting paid for creating art. Things that make you go hmmmm. Lets carry this thought out. The vast majority of folks do not get paid for sex and enjoy it. My mechanic loves working on cars. Should he not get paid for it? I would love that although he would not be able to do it for long.</p>
<p>And my wife has a hair dresser who loves hair and anything to do with it. She should not get paid for it. Although I think she is better at coloring than I am, my wife still prefers me. Oh yea, I don&#039;t get paid for that either. Actually, my wife does not pay me for the art I create that hangs in our house as well.</p>
<p>As for your choice of words, one of which must have come from your mouth,  I would not have in my hand with out a latex glove to protect it, unless it was dried and I was in a cow pie throwing contest. Well, no wonder you starved. </p>
<p>As to art emanating from a black hole of choice. This is one of my favorite debates to hate. My camera man in a video commercial I produced that was shot in Long Island, dreams of doing something from the farthest reaches of his inner horror loving soul. However, to just talk to him you would never know he is a closet horror lover. He is one of the kindest people and brilliant artist, not starving and somehow has an affordable rent in New York City.</p>
<p>As to being a real artist and making art no matter what, well, you must not be familiar with right brain vs left brain thinking. My best commission single (occasionally manic depressive and restless) was only 7K. Since being blissfully married, my best commission was over 50K (of course it was a monument work). I could not have made the big piece of art no matter what. It required 6 months and lots of someone else&#039;s money.</p>
<p>As a matter of fact, money has always been an inspiration. I am not a great artist. But money does inspire me in numerous ways and on numerous levels. I do believe it can help create art. Taking this to the absurd, I cannot paint with out paints that cost about $30 per tube and my big canvases cost about $150. Tried stretching them early on. Over stretching makes them a bit funky and warped. Hey, maybe I need to change the name of that early one. Thanks. It shall be called Early Warp In Green. No, just Warped Green. Wow, the creative juices are flowing thanks to you. But then this is a left &#8211; right brain thing.</p>
<p>Quitting your day job is essential if your great or if you want to be. If your so so, then work away. Nothing will get the creative juices flowing, at least for me, like working with out a safety net. But then, my 2nd most favorite book was the best selling, &#034;Innovators Solution.&#034; It is a book on the theory of how markets work. It is considered the Bible of Market Theory.</p>
<p> Let see,that book was the reason for quitting nursing and becoming a self supporting artist. Also, that book resulted in selling 14 pieces outright to to a New Hope PA gallery rather than the typical putting them on consignment. </p>
<p>Of course they were my first 14 pieces. Way undersold them but hey, I still made a lot of money.</p>
<p>Don&#039;t get me wrong. I was not always an Atlas of the Art Marketing self supporting artists world. I was at one time the equivalent of a 97 pound weakling. Bullies used to kick up copies of Thomas Kinkade in my face at the beach on the weekends.</p>
<p>Those were horrible days. The 7K commission mentioned above won a national interior designers award. Do you think I got another job from it. Nope. However it did launch an industry doing work like mine in all the restaurants around the world. I was not a businessman. I was an artist. Not a successful artist, only one who made a lot of money.</p>
<p>Turns out the 14 pieces I sold, there were ones I did not sell. Well, they just sold this past Sunday in November (09) for between 4 to 10 times what he paid me. Lets see, the six hours of the show resulted in about $3336 in sales.  Oh yea, they fed me too. They even fed my wife. On top of that, we got sandwiches for the trip home.</p>
<p>Just a side note here. I did not make $600 per hour at this show. Someone asked how long it took to create one of my pieces. I said 15 years. So, figuring the time I spent learning how to be a businessman and the art of not being a starving businessman and adding that into the mix, I actually only made an hourly wage. I figure my pay should be more than what I make as a specialist nurse. Any extra over the hours it took to create the work gets divvied up. I pay my book keeper (my wife) and my tax accountant (my wife), my cleaning lady (my wife and I am her assistant) and my secretary ( my wife) and my salesman who gets about 10 % (me and occasionally my wife).</p>
<p>Since she also has a job, this is extra money for her. She has not decided what she will buy with her cut just yet.</p>
<p>Also some of the  money is set aside for paid days off and sick days. I also put some aside for my paid vacation. I am up to four weeks paid vacation now. Of course, if the sales drop, I may have to do like many businesses and make cut backs. The first perk to be cut back will be the four week paid vacation time off. I may gripe and complain about the cutbacks but in the end, I know that they will be important for the success of my not being a starving artist.</p>
<p>Also there is health insurance, dental and eye not to mention unemployment insurance. Most entrepreneurs are not aware that there is unemployment insurance for if you should have to fire yourself or lay yourself off. It is a program managed by most local banks. Just go in and ask about it. It goes by the name, Saving Account.  </p>
<p>So, if I am making $600 per hour then I will not have anything left over for these other expenses.   But if I make a fair and decent wage, not only will these be covered, there will also be money for advertising and putting back into the business.</p>
<p>In the case of this show,  it only cost me 12% commission. But again, the pieces sold for way more than I would have sold them to the gallery owner. </p>
<p>I guess this speaks to your comment on needing to be a businessman. Here I thought I had to lower the price and  consider them lost leaders in my attempt to collect art collectors. In reality, I needed to charge four times the amount (and actually make money for my time and a profit for my business) and as such, increase their value.</p>
<p>The last comment I agree with. I know a lot of better artist than I am who do not get paid for what they do. I would like to know how good of a networker I am but the creative mind, perhaps an artist who created the UpMo test has sold out. Now a commercial concern owns the name and is making  money from the concept.</p>
<p>Oh yea, the grapes are actually delicious. The only thing, you can only eat them in season. You may have to find other things to eat in the off season.</p>
<p>Best wishes and how ever you fare, may you fare will.</p>
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		<title>By: Barry</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-1/#comment-204638</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Sep 2009 13:25:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-204638</guid>
		<description>I think you&#039;re trying to spell &#039;Sibelius&#039; but he was a much later, Finnish composer.

The character you&#039;re referring to in &#039;Amadeus&#039; is Anton Salieri.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you&#039;re trying to spell &#039;Sibelius&#039; but he was a much later, Finnish composer.</p>
<p>The character you&#039;re referring to in &#039;Amadeus&#039; is Anton Salieri.</p>
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		<title>By: Matt Green</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-194526</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt Green</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 27 Aug 2009 18:41:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-194526</guid>
		<description>I worked with a lot of artists and bands mates who hated me saying that and never understood that they were in business, not in the arts !</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I worked with a lot of artists and bands mates who hated me saying that and never understood that they were in business, not in the arts !</p>
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		<title>By: Devon Hopkins &#187; Why You Should Manage Your Online Reputation</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-190921</link>
		<dc:creator>Devon Hopkins &#187; Why You Should Manage Your Online Reputation</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 17 Aug 2009 20:23:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-190921</guid>
		<description>[...] is becoming more and more important, whether you like it or not. Penelope Trunk writes that you do not have to quit your day job to pursue a career in art. To help maintain or obtain that day job, let’s look at some of the things you can do right now [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] is becoming more and more important, whether you like it or not. Penelope Trunk writes that you do not have to quit your day job to pursue a career in art. To help maintain or obtain that day job, let’s look at some of the things you can do right now [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2009/02/06/how-to-build-a-career-as-an-artist/comment-page-2/#comment-189487</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Jul 2009 20:10:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/?p=2099#comment-189487</guid>
		<description>Good comment, hedge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good comment, hedge.</p>
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