Comments on: 4 tips for salary negotiation

By: ml

ml — Fri, 05 Mar 2010 00:22:01 +0000

Hey Penelope. I'm a loyal reader of this blog and I've been following you for a year now, and I'm loving it :)
Here's the issue: I'm on a temporary which will end soon; and will be negotiating the renewal of my employment.
Some background: the company has been easy on the firing trigger recently citing lack of performance. A friend in a similar position who already went through the renewal process was able to get a permanent contract (which I am planning to ask for) in addition to a 13% salary increase (now equaling the amount I earn, which is a good deal in my opinion).
I am satisfied with my performance, and so is my manager. Also, finding an alternative job is relatively easy, as it's in high demand. Two questions, regarding negotiating a salary increase:
- How much of a raise should I ask for, in order to reach my target salary which is about 7% higher; and how much is too much?
- Can I argue that there's a high demand on my profile, or mention being in discussion with competitors and receiving better offers?

By: matchmaker

matchmaker — Mon, 18 Jan 2010 11:10:20 +0000

I’ve found all that “most expensive” this or “priciest that” stuff to be pure marketing hooey. If the press stopped covering them they certainly wouldn’t make them any longer … it’s just a free commercial for whatever restaurant is promoting it.

By: Online job applications « Law and Conversation

Online job applications « Law and Conversation — Fri, 11 Dec 2009 01:39:42 +0000

[...] (though Penelope Trunk comes pretty close when she writes about it in the in-person context at http://blog.penelopetrunk.com/2003/12/11/4-tips-for-salary-negotiation/ ). The employer never discloses the range, so candidates are presented with the unattractive [...]

By: john alberts

john alberts — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 20:52:55 +0000

Hey great read ive been looking all over the place to try to find this information.

By: james brand

james brand — Wed, 09 Dec 2009 05:40:28 +0000

finally found the information im looking for here on your site thank you. I have bookmarked your site so I can come back

By: Fates & Fortunes » Blog Archive » Simon Cowell’s lessons in salary negotiation

Tue, 11 Aug 2009 21:55:09 +0000

[...] Penelope Trunk’s Brazen Careerist says to never start discussing salary until you’ve gotten a written offer, at which point you know the company wants you. Penelope offers specific language to help you defer having a salary conversation until you have more control over it. You can directly say, “I’d like to postpone that conversation until the offer stage.” If the interviewer continues to push, which is likely, you can ask him what he considers the job’s salary range to be. Once that number is disclosed, you say can “that would be a fine place to start” and move on. That way, you are not pushed into either low- or high-balling yourself. No matter how much research you’ve done, the would-be employer knows more than you do about how much he can pay you. Your increased control comes with the written offer. [...]

By: GHG

GHG — Fri, 22 May 2009 16:38:17 +0000

If it was a short term contract, not in line with the amount you were earning in your prior positions, then I would provide that data with numbers from those positions as back up. I too have been faced with much higher prior salaries from candidates, and while generally people don't want to go lower than previous pay, in this economy, people will sometimes do anything to secure an offer. As a manager, I don't care to bite on that bate, since the person is likely to be a short-term hire, and that is just painful for everyone involved.

While I would not have gone further with a candidate who was paid two or three times the expected earnings of a position, I certainly would be open minded if that candidate also explained not just that it was a short term contract, etc…but rather that all positions prior to the windfall role were paid in line with expected earnings for the position, with an example or two. That's part of why I don't just ask for most recent salary…I recently had a candidate who had only been with their current employer 9 months, and my query exposed that they'd received a 25% salary bump in that move. I'm not going to tack on another 25% to move them to my company; that's insane unless they're just that valuable.

Shame on the recruiter for being closed minded enough to not ask about prior roles once you disclosed the anomaly of your last position, but it's up to you to set their concerns aside, not the recruiter. Perhaps you were this specific and just didn't mention it in your post. If that's the case, I'd say this was just a poor recruiter, and that can happen in any situation – if it doesn't click, it doesn't, and if it's a reflection on the company's mentality, you're probably better off without them too. That said, if this is a pattern of the conversations with the employment you're seeking, I'd adjust your strategy.

By: Julianne

Julianne — Fri, 22 May 2009 15:59:22 +0000

I was once in a salary negotiation where the recruiter told me they were planning to make me an offer (note: that was verbal, not in writing), and then asked me what I was making at that time. I explained that my hourly salary at that time was for a short-term contract, so it was not comparable to what I was looking for in a more stable job. I did not tell the recruiter what I was making because it would have been ludicrous to imply that it was my expectation (I was making $60/hour in a freak situation where I was the only person who could do the job, but normal would have been more like $20/hour and I would have been delighted with $25).

Well, the recruiter asked me over and over and over and over again over multiple phone calls. I told him literally at least five times that my current salary was not relevant to the job they were planning to make me an offer for, and asked what they were planning to pay. After a while he told me that they could not offer me a position if I didn't answer the question, so I said yet again that I was currently in a very short term and unusual position, and that I did not expect to make anything like this wage at a steady job, and told him I was making $60/hour. He said he would get back to me, and I never heard from him again. I phoned him back a few days later to ask what was going on, and he said, "Oh, you're too rich for our blood!" to tell me they were not going to make the offer.

This was, needless to say, extremely frustrating, particularly since I had explicitly told them that I wasn't expecting my current salary at the new job. What should I have done, lied and made up a number that was only a bit high for the normal pay for that job? I've wondered since then if they had no real plan to offer me a position and would have withdrawn the proposed offer no matter what I had said — is that at all likely?

By: GHG

GHG — Wed, 06 May 2009 19:44:56 +0000

$10k is nothing? You're right, if you're already earning decent money. However, if this person is lower on the payscale and it's $25k -vs-$35k, that's definitely life changing. I understand the argument for the "huge learning opportunity", but those don't always pay off…I wouldn't recommend someone jump ship for a lesser salary in this economy without knowing the facts around the information provided. Also, the suggestions for negotiating are nice, but I can tell you that as a hiring manager, I won't even waste my time on someone who is unwilling to disclose their current salary, and expectations upfront. The recommendations make sense when dealing with jobs paying around $150k and higher – but I can tell you that when I hire someone for under $100k/yr, it's just not worth my time to deal with someone who thinks they're a smart negotiator. This advice would risk someone's likelihood of making a jump successfully in my mind.

By: Negotiating Your Salary: How to Make $1,000 a Minute - Collab.r.nation

Negotiating Your Salary: How to Make $1,000 a Minute - Collab.r.nation — Wed, 06 May 2009 12:52:49 +0000

[...] more information on this subject, check out 4 tips for salary negotiation from Penelope [...]